Mark Foote
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Posts posted by Mark Foote
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On 6/26/2025 at 9:07 PM, Mark Foote said:Ah, Joy Division, RIP!
If I said Joy Division was a great band, would that be an unpopular opinion?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8lgsVXiXZg&list=RDg8lgsVXiXZg&start_radio=1#t=20s
The link could not be embedded because www.youtube.com does not allow embedding of that video.
Ok, I know the lead singer of New Order was not a member of Joy Division. Still, if I said New Order was a great band, I fear that would not be an unpopular opinion.-
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2 minutes ago, Mark Foote said:
reverse breating, goldenliving men sit, don't lie down
dead men lie, don't sit
dead men lie, don't sithave a cup of tea; living...
have a cup of tea
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5 hours ago, Thrice Daily said:
Meld into more shapesEverything is emptiness
reverse breathing, golden
reverse breating, goldenliving men sit, don't lie down
dead men lie, don't sit(Dead Man's Zazen
生夾坐不臥 While living, one sits up and lies not,
死去臥不坐 When dead, one lies and sits not;
元是臭骨頭 A set of ill-smelling skeleton!
何爲立功課 What is the use of toiling and moiling so?
A gâthâ by Hui-neng, T'an-ching)
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8 hours ago, stirling said:
it’s an excellent question to examine carefully. It is in fact everywhere in the field experience, and nowhere at all. You aren’t really doing Shikantaza until this is something that you can see properly. This is why Shikantaza is not different from enlightened mind. Everything is Mind. You are liberating all phenomena in the moment that labeling them stops.
“... as an emerald jewel, of all good qualities, might be strung on a thread, blue-green or yellow or red or white or orange coloured; and a [person] with vision, having put it in [their] hand, might reflect; ‘this emerald jewel... is strung on a thread, blue-green... or orange-coloured’–even so... a course has been pointed out by me for disciples, practising which disciples of mine know thus: This body of mine... is of a nature to be constantly rubbed away... and scattered, but this consciousness is fastened there, bound there....”
(MN 77, tr. Pali Text Society Vol II p 217; see also AN Pali Text Society vol IV pp 202-203)
From something on my site:
On a forum site I frequent, someone wrote:
Even if you have no identity, you still exist. As what? The spirituality that I follow would say “as existence”, or “as pure consciousness”.
I was reminded of Nisargadatta, a famous teacher who lived in India in the last century:
You are not your body, but you are the consciousness in the body, because of which you have the awareness of “I am”. It is without words, just pure beingness. Meditation means you have to hold consciousness by itself. The consciousness should give attention to itself.
(Gaitonde, Mohan [2017]. Self – Love: The Original Dream [Shri Nisargadatta Maharaj’s Direct Pointers)“The consciousness should give attention to itself”—in thirteenth-century Japan, Eihei Dogen wrote:
Therefore, …take the backward step of turning the light and shining it back.
(“Fukan zazengi” Tenpuku version; tr. Carl Bielefeldt, “Dogen’s Manuals of Zen Meditation”, p 176)That’s a poetic way to say “the consciousness should give attention to itself”.
I used to talk about the location of consciousness, but a friend of mine would always respond that for him, consciousness has no specific location. As a result, I switched to writing about the placement of attention:
There can… come a moment when the movement of breath necessitates the placement of attention at a certain location in the body, or at a series of locations, with the ability to remain awake as the location of attention shifts retained through the exercise of presence.
(Response to “Not the Wind, Not the Flag”)
In his “Genjo Koan”, Dogen wrote:
When you find your place where you are, practice occurs, actualizing the fundamental point.
(“Genjo Koan [Actualizing the Fundamental Point]”, tr. Kazuaki Tanahashi)Given a presence of mind that can “hold consciousness by itself”, activity in the body begins to coordinate by virtue of the sense of place associated with consciousness. A relationship between the free location of consciousness and activity in the body comes forward, and as that relationship comes forward, “practice occurs”. Through such practice, the placement of consciousness is manifested in the activity of the body.
("Take the Backward Step")
"A friend of mine would always respond that for him, consciousness has no specific location"--that's another friend of mine, Stirling, not you!--your point of view on the nature of consciousness is widely shared, I know. As far as realizing the cessation of volition in the activity of the body in inhalation and exhalation, and so "just sitting", I"m not sure how that point of view enters into practice. -
13 hours ago, BigSkyDiamond said:i've only listened to the first song so far, it is beautiful.
i look forward to hearing the rest.
Volume is fine when i play it, no adjustment needed.
i like the different art for each song also. very nice.
Adding it to my play list.
Now I've listened to the first four songs. So far my favorite tracks are #1 and #4.
What a great collection this is. I upvoted on you tube.
Thanks, BigSkyDiamond!
I'll hope that when you get to it, you like the rest of songs as well.
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Returning to the OP:
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I made a recording of myself and some friends back in 1969, doing some traditional songs, some originals, and some covers (the covers are me covering John Fahey tunes). Dug it out for a friend a couple months back, and this week decided to make a YouTube video out of it.
Have to turn it down right away, maybe I could have done better on the volume...
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On 6/23/2025 at 4:14 PM, BigSkyDiamond said:when you are sitting (or walking or supine or standing or doing qi gong), however it is you meditate or tune into your awareness.....where is your point of awareness and do you move it around. where is your "consciousness fastened there, bound there". I know during qi gong i move my point of awareness to different places: to the diaphragm for deep breathing and expansion; or to the upper dantien turning it, or to the coccyx pointing down drawing a circle on the ground, for example.
Where is your point of awareness when you make no effort to place it, that's the question:
Sometimes when you think that you are doing zazen with an imperturbable mind, you ignore the body, but it is also necessary to have the opposite understanding at the same time. Your body is practicing zazen in imperturbability while your mind is moving.
(“Whole-Body Zazen”, lecture by Shunryu Suzuki at Tassajara, June 28, 1970 [edited by Bill Redican])
Quoteno my point of awareness does not sit or stand or recline or walk.
"I'm not afraid that my point of awarensess is going to sit or stand or recline or walk."
You know, sometimes zazen gets up and walks around.
(Kobun Chino Otogawa, my recollection of a lecture at S. F. Zen Center in the 1980’s)QuoteMy point of consciousness is just a point. It is viewing my body walking, and the trees and the sidewalk and the ponds and the turtle and the ducks. I do that exercise either at home just going about my daily activities, or when i am out walking. Yes there is ease of movement and ease of breath. It takes some getting used to, to hold both perspectives at the same time, the perspective of me taking a walk or fixing supper; and the "birds eye" perspective i view from my point of awareness up in the corner of the clear cube watching the scene. I find it very restful being a point. It feels very pleasant and natural.
A key aspect of the bodily self is self-location, the experience that the self is localized at a specific position in space within one’s bodily borders (embodied self-location).
(Journal of Neuroscience 26 May 2010, 30 (21) 7202-7214)
Where is the embodied point of consciousness, at this moment? The point of consciousness that is tied to the body, that takes place in the body, that can be now here and now there (or not), that moves (or not). A lot of my practice is to relax, stay calm, let thought play appropriately, and look to the embodied point of consciousness for automatic activity in the body.
From the piece I'm working on now (subject to change!):When habit and volition fall away, the feeling of ease ceases, and the activity of the body in inhalation and exhalation becomes solely by virtue of the location of consciousness. At such time, Gautama declared that one should:
… (suffuse one’s) body with purity by the pureness of (one’s) mind so that there is not one particle of the body that is not pervaded with purity by the pureness of (one’s) mind.
(AN 5.28, Pali Text Society Vol. III p 19.)
Thus, the body is kept open to a point-wise “embodied self-location” of consciousness.
The penultimate element of the mindfulness that made up Gautama’s way of living was:
I will breathe in… breathe out… beholding stopping.
(MN 118, tr. Pali Text Society vol. III p 126)
“Beholding stopping” is beholding the cessation of habit and volition in activity. To “breathe in… breathe out… beholding stopping” implies a cessation of habit and volition in the activity of the body in inhalation and exhalation. As Yuanwu wrote:
“… this will be the place of peace and bliss where you stop and rest… ”That’s not to say that arriving at rest from volition necessarily comes easily:
Suppose that you have climbed to the top of a hundred-foot pole, and are told to let go and advance one step further without holding bodily life dear. In such a situation, if you say that you can practice the Buddha-Way only when you are alive, you are not really following your teacher. Consider this carefully.
(“Shobogenzo-zuimonki: Sayings of Eihei Dogen Zenji, recorded by Koun Ejo”, 1-13, tr Shohaku Okumura, Soto-Shu Shumucho p 45-46)
You must strive with all your might to bite through here and cut off conditioned habits of mind. Be like a person who has died the great death: after your breath is cut off, then you come back to life. Only then do you realize that it is as open as empty space. Only then do you reach the point where your feet are walking on the ground of reality.
(Zen Letters, translated by J.C. and Thomas Cleary, p 84)
I personally find Gautama instructions helpful--I discuss 'em in Applying the Pali Instructions.
Quotethis is great Mark, thank you for the thoughtful and detailed response. I don't do seated meditation, in part because i just feel too antsy to sit still (but have no problem with seated qi gong, fine with that). And in part because it is just uncomfortable. And in part because i want whatever path or practice i have to be part of my regular daily life and activities and not "separate" to seated meditation. Not doing "just" seated meditation could also be my rebellion from sitting at a desk job and having that association.
You may find my description of kinesiology in The Diamond Trap, the Thicket of Thorns useful. Without that, I could not get to the top of the pole, much less advance one step further.
About sitting:Gautama began his instructions on mindfulness with advice on the appropriate setting, and on the posture to adopt:
Herein… (one) who is forest-gone or gone to the root of a tree or gone to an empty place, sits down cross-legged, holding (their) back erect, arousing mindfulness…
(MN 119, tr. Pali Text Society vol. III pp 130-132)
That Gautama’s mindfulness was his way of living implies that once he had aroused his mindfulness, he could continue that mindfulness in other settings and in other postures.
At the start of his descriptions of the fourth concentration, Gautama noted that:
(A person)… comes to be sitting down…
(MN 119, tr. Pali Text Society p 134)
Nevertheless, I believe that once Gautama had attained the fourth concentration, he could surrender activity of the body to the free location of consciousness in any posture.
(The Diamond Trap, the Thicket of Thorns)
Taken from a conversation I had in the comment section of Brad Warner's "Hardcore Zen" blog, back when he allowed comments:
Of late, I spend a few minutes when I first sit down doing what you suggest, letting attention go to the area of my sacrum and its movement vis-a-vis the ilia. I also rock back and forward, sideways, and observe the rotation that naturally occurs. Then I think of the basic Alexander Technique instruction, “Let my neck be free.” etc. Once I’ve adjusted and settled in this way, I put my hands in the mudra, and start my zazen. I also use double mats below the cushion at home, or even bed pillows.
Since I started limbering up in this way, I can sit comfortably in half-lotus for two rounds of 40 minutes, with kinhin between. Not just bearably, actually in comfort. I didn’t even know that was a possibility.
(“Shinchan Ohara”, Brad Warner’s “Hardcore Zen” blog comment section, March 4th 2015)
However long you can sit, is fine, for starters. I sit 25's, I sit 30's, I sit 35's, I sit 40's. I sit short sittings, if something comes up, or I decide I've had enough.
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On 6/24/2025 at 4:19 PM, Apech said:
... and the lead singer of New Order in a theater.Ah, Joy Division, RIP!
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23 hours ago, Nungali said:Yeah but you already had fame as a well known TV personality !
"Bill Oddie was a rebel... he roamed, through the West..."
(apologies to Johnny Yuma)
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1 hour ago, BigSkyDiamond said:On 5/19/2025 at 5:23 PM, Mark Foote said:
Quote"consciousness can take place in a specific location in response to that stress, and the location of consciousness can lead the balance of the body to engage activity in order to relieve that stress".
Quote1 hour ago, BigSkyDiamond said:
I have been meaning to ask Mark about this, so i understand "consciousness can take place in a specific location." is that like seeing my awareness as a "point" that I can (a) move the point around to different parts in my human body; and (b) move the point around to different places OUTSIDE the body.
The first part of Gautama's enlightenment, in many sermons, was:
“... as an emerald jewel, of all good qualities, might be strung on a thread, blue-green or yellow or red or white or orange coloured; and a [person] with vision, having put it in [their] hand, might reflect; ‘this emerald jewel... is strung on a thread, blue-green... or orange-coloured’–even so... a course has been pointed out by me for disciples, practising which disciples of mine know thus: This body of mine... is of a nature to be constantly rubbed away... and scattered, but this consciousness is fastened there, bound there....”
(MN 77, tr. Pali Text Society Vol II p 217; see also AN Pali Text Society vol IV pp 202-203)
Gautama's metaphor for the first concentration was that of a bath-ball--here's his metaphor, and my comments, from "Applying the Pali Instructions":
… just as a handy bathman or attendant might strew bath-powder in some copper basin and, gradually sprinkling water, knead it together so that the bath-ball gathered up the moisture, became enveloped in moisture and saturated both in and out, but did not ooze moisture; even so, (a person) steeps, drenches, fills, and suffuses this body with zest and ease, born of solitude, so that there is not one particle of the body that is not pervaded by this lone-born zest and ease.
(AN 5.28, tr. Pali Text Society vol. III pp 18-19, see also MN 119, tr. Pali Text Society vol. III pp 132-134.)
I’ve written about the “bath-ball”:
If I were kneading soap powder into a ball in a copper vessel, I would have one hand kneading soap and one hand on the vessel. The press of the hand kneading soap would find something of an opposite pressure from the hand holding the vessel, even if the bottom of the vessel were resting on the ground.
More particularly:
… the exercise becomes in part the distinction of the direction of turn that I’m feeling at the location of awareness… that distinction allows the appropriate counter from everything that surrounds the place of awareness.
I would say that gravity and handedness (I’m right-handed) are the source of my feeling of outward force at the location of awareness, and the activity of the muscles of posture in response to the stretch of ligaments is the source of the counter.
Omori Sogen, a Rinzai Zen teacher, spoke about centrifugal and centripetal forces connected with seated meditation:
Thus, by means of the equilibrium of the centrifugal and the centripetal force, the whole body is brought to a state of zero and spiritual power will pervade the whole body intensely.
(“An Introduction to Zen Training: A Translation of Sanzen Nyumon”, Omori Sogen, tr. Dogen Hosokawa and Roy Yoshimoto, Tuttle Publishing, p 61).
Gautama also said:
… a good (person] reflects thus: “Lack of desire even for the attainment of the first meditation has been spoken of by [me]; for whatever (one) imagines it to be, it is otherwise” [Similarly for the second, third, and fourth initial meditative states, and for the attainments of the first four further meditative states].
(MN 113, tr. Pali Text Society vol III pp 92-94.)
Gautama has a metaphor for each of the first four concentrations, the concentrations leading to the cessation of habit and volition in the activity of the body in inhalation and exhalation. There was another set of concentrations that he always described after his description of the first four, when he described them:
The first of the further states was “the infinity of ether”. Gautama identified the state with “the excellence of the heart’s release” through the extension of “the mind of compassion”. He described a particular method for the extension of the mind of compassion, a method that began with the extension of “the mind of friendliness”:
[One] dwells, having suffused the first quarter [of the world] with friendliness, likewise the second, likewise the third, likewise the fourth; just so above, below, across; [one] dwells having suffused the whole world everywhere, in every way, with a mind of friendliness that is far-reaching, wide-spread, immeasurable, without enmity, without malevolence. [One] dwells having suffused the first quarter with a mind of compassion… with a mind of sympathetic joy… with a mind of equanimity that is far-reaching, wide-spread, immeasurable, without enmity, without malevolence. (4)
The second of the further states (“the infinity of consciousness”) Gautama identified with “the excellence of the heart’s release” through the extension of “the mind of sympathetic joy”, and the third (“the infinity of nothingness”) he identified with “the excellence of the heart’s release” through the extension of “the mind of equanimity”.
(Appendix-From the Early Record)
My take on the first of the further states:
When the free location of consciousness is accompanied by an extension of the mind of compassion, there can be a feeling that the necessity of breath is connected to things that lie outside the boundaries of the senses. That, to me, is an experience of “the plane of infinite ether”.
(The Inconceivable Nature of the Wind)
Kobun Chino Otogawa, from Aspects of Sitting Meditation on the jikoji site:
Sitting shikantaza is the place itself, and things. The dynamics of all Buddhas are in it. When you sit, the cushion sits with you. If you wear glasses, the glasses sit with you. Clothing sits with you. House sits with you. People who are moving around outside all sit with you. They don't take the sitting posture!
The question is, when you feel your mind is up in the corner of that two-story space, does that mind sit? In particular, is the activity of breath effortless, as effortless as getting up out of chair correctly?
…good upright posture is that from which a minimum muscular effort will move the body with equal ease in any desired direction. This means that in the upright position there must be no muscular effort deriving from voluntary control, regardless of whether this effort is known and deliberate or concealed from the consciousness by habit.
…When the center of gravity has really moved forward over the feet a reflex movement will originate in the old nervous system and straighten the legs; this automatic movement will not be felt as an effort at all.
(“Awareness Through Movement”, © 1972, 1977 Moshe Feldenkrais, p 76, 78.)
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23 hours ago, BigSkyDiamond said:of course i had to google "semi-sesquicentennial definition"
Semisesquicentennial can be broken down to understand its meaning: "semi" - half of + "sesqui" - in the ratio of 3:2 + "centennial" - 100 years. Broken out mathematically, 1/2 * 3/2 * 100 = 75
Hooray for Mark !
The old man, and "she who must be obeyed" (apologies to John Mortimer):
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Strange, the attraction this thread has for me.
Me, the most popular person on Dao Bums!
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Solstice three hours and some ahead now, the sun will already be low in the Western sky at solstice.
Almost half a year gone, poof!
May your Midsummer be a celebration, for me my semi-sesquicentennial. Wishing the best to everyone!-
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On 6/18/2025 at 12:12 PM, Apech said:
calm embroideringbut crotchety while at my
daily crocheting
daily crocheting
clouds knit together, above
dark waters, below
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15 hours ago, BigSkyDiamond said:"Therefore, it is said:
"Those who implemented the Tao
Did not use it to make the people shrewd;
Rather, they used it to make them simple."
The reason why the people are difficult to rule
Is that they are crafty.
Therefore, using craft to govern a state
Is a pest to the state;
Using noncraft to govern a state
Is a blessing to the state.
Constantly remember: these two constitute a guideline;
Constantly remembering this guideline
Is called a deep and remote virtue.
The deep and remote virtue
Is deep indeed, remote indeed;
And, though contrary to all things,
Will eventually reach Grand Harmony."
- Translated by Chichung Huang, Chapter 65How ya gonna keep 'em down on the farm, after they've seen Paree!
"Using noncraft to govern a state"--a kind of "not doing", I'm sure. That's the proper subject of Dao Bums in my opinion, how that not-doing is done. The rest, as DDJ makes clear, takes care of itself.
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15 hours ago, BigSkyDiamond said:
... When there are too many restrictions and regulations, people become poor.
When there are too many weapons, the kingdom is in disarray.
When there are too many tricks, bizarre things happen.
When there are too many decrees, the crime rate increases.
(- Translated by Thomas Zhang, Chapter 57)Hmmm. Too many tricks... stop me if you've seen this one:
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On 6/15/2025 at 6:55 AM, Bogge said:Hi,
I saw another post where the OP asked for strategies for clearing out the emotion of anger.
He got linked to the six sounds of qigong or something along those lines.
It made me realize I have a completely different perspective on emotions. I always have thought of emotions are something you deal with mentally, they are ego that you as a seeker need to clear away with introspection, meditation, right view, etc. Something you have accumulated over lifetimes of wrong action.
But I remember when taking huge doses of Iodine intense anger would sweep over me for a few seconds and after that I felt so much lighter. It most likely detoxed something in my liver. It made me ponder on the possibility of emotions are something that can be healed in the body, because they come from the body. If that makes sense?
Either way I am interested in more input and other perspectives and where emotions come from, how we can deal with them, and so on.
Thanks.
You might like Daniel Goleman's "Emotional Intelligence".
He writes that responses get stored by the amygdala, reactions to situations picked up in very early childhood and beyond, and when the circumstances that gave rise to those responses are duplicated the amygdala overrides the cognitive centers of the brain to react.
Out-of-hand emotional responses is his focus, like a sudden anger.
I think Bindi's right, not so much "how we can deal with them" but how we can learn about our human condition from them.
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Shot this last night. Have to listen to it a few more times, no doubt. Mark does Dylan.
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On 6/11/2025 at 5:47 PM, BigSkyDiamond said:
islands float in air,astonished eyes shine and smile
enthusiasm
enthusiasm
for Van Gogh's starry night is
an understatement
an understatement
the gratitude we all have
one day at a time
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On 6/9/2025 at 8:13 AM, 心神 ~ said:What about when the wish is gone, but the body still holds the energy? When the mind and heart accept, but the body remembers?
I find there's no substitute for sitting with the anger, waiting for compassionate insight. The feeling is there physically in the body until my mind (and body) can work out what really happened, why somebody did what they did, such that I realize a compassionate release.
Can take days, but it's there when I sit until it's released.
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On 6/9/2025 at 8:01 AM, Taomeow said:I know it's a serious matter, but I can't resist offering my favorite movie scene dedicated to anger management:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zEE7xzwogMc
I know it's serious, but one good clip deserves another ("it's good, it's good, it's good."):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQXuazYI_YU
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21 hours ago, Nungali said:
... and actually E HE , the gamekeeper now owned all the animals and as gamekeeper he was the one that governed the what and how of ALL those animals and how they should be utilized ) .
A very unpopular opinion, amongst the original inhabitants, no doubt!
I still have faith, that the gift of the sciences of the peoples may combine with the gift of the sciences of the so-called modern world (those sciences sometimes a curse) to see humanity living in peace across the globe.
To realize a change in myself, should be all that's really necessary, I think. How's that for unpopular.
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I tend to reread the works of Yuanwu a lot, principally Zen Letters: Teachings of Yuanwu. I think the only English translation currently available is by the Cleary brothers, but I like their translations.
I think Carl Bielefeldt's "Dogen's Manuals of Zen Meditation" is excellent, I refer to the translations he makes in the book a lot. I didn't realize how much material Dogen lifted from Chinese sources until I read Bielefeldt's book.
I also come back to "The Gospel of Thomas", I have a translation made in the 1950's that I bought in the '60's that I like ("The Gospel According to Thomas", coptic text established and translated by A. Guillaumont, H.-CH. Puech, G. Quispel, W. Till and Yassah ‘Abd Al Masih, pg 18-19 log. 22, ©1959 E. J. Brill).
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moving our point of consciousness; and the universe as a thought we are thinking
in General Discussion
Posted · Edited by Mark Foote
Is Dogen saying something there, when he says "find your place where you are", when he says "practice occurs", and when he says "actualizing the fundamental point"?
What's the difference between "just sitting" on the couch watching the Simpsons, and the "just sitting" that is shikantaza?
The Theravada doesn't interest me. The first four Nikayas of the Pali Canon interest me, as do the writings of Yuanwu and Dogen.