dwai

I haven't got much of an idea about Wicca. But Mantra chanting is not "Bogus" like the other commenter has suggested. Mantras that are in Sanskrit contain energy that is activated when resonated (there are four levels of Mantra chanting...in fact of speech -- Vaikhari, Madhayama, Pashyanti and Para) via practice. They also act as an excellent tool towards silencing the mind. Sanskrit because the 50 basic sounds/alphabets of Sanskrit are primordial sounds that tap into various energetic configurations of the Universe. Mantras are composed in various meters (rythms) and these meters have specific effect on the practitioner/listener. Please look up Devi Sahasranama (or Lalita Sahasranama) Lalita Sahasranama -- The Thousand Names of the Divine Mother. Lalita Sahasranama on Youtube As the saying goes -- the proof of the pudding is in the eating.

Happy Dipavali to you too SV. Do you want to share some of the insights you might have gleamed from reading Sri Bodri's book?

Working on agitating your energy and expecting a good night's sleep is like looking for water in a desert. There has to be a methodical and careful preparation before you can start playing with your chakras. Traditional Yoga practice talks about the Eight-limbs way (Ashtanga) which calls for a disciplined effort to cultivate your prana and involves following yamas, niyamas (ideal way to conduct oneself and do's and don'ts that should be cultivated). Then you have Asanas (Yoga postures), Pranayama (Breath practices). These activate your chakras and help driving your prana up from the moola to the sahasrara (or from the perinium to the crown point). Along the way, you have to practice pratyahara (sense-withdrawal), dharana (intent), dhyana (meditation) and samadhi (realization). It is the same with any tradition, be it Yoga or Taoist meditation -- whether it is specifically mentioned or not. You will cause harm to yourself if you excite your prana without proper preparation. If you want restful sleep, do Yoga asanas. Prana cultivation (Chi Gung) is for people who want to follow the spiritual path.

Why? Is there a necessary pre-condition that a teacher has to teach all Tao material for free? And does charging money dilute or negate the teachings in any way? So may be you wanna think again...not everything in this world is for free.

I think you should not pass judgments without either trying out the man's style of training or reading his books. From your posts it seems obvious that you haven't read anything he has written. Each of his books are profoundly informative, with absolutely no gimmicks involved (he doesn't try and sell you anything). A lot of what you'll see at his website is a creation of his students (He believes in Wu Wei and goes with the flow, I'm told by a very reliable source). Anyone who has attended classes at his center in Oak Park, IL or studied with any of his students will not doubt anything he writes. Master Liao is for real. I'd strongly recommend reading "Nine Nights" along with his other books, including "Tai Chi Classics". I'd also recommend interested seekers to try out his style of Tai Chi (called Temple style Tai Chi) which predominantly deals with single-form practice. After each single form is learnt and felt, the long form is put together and is posed as a challenge to the student to retain flow during the various stages and in between transitions.

As he commented, to howls of outrage by some 'traditionalists', the correct solo training of the body is the difference between getting the remarkable abilities of the top Aiki masters, or not. Not only that, but that this training has been a core part of martial arts from other countries, notably the internal arts of China. Nothing mystical, not qi, but the correct training of the body. Physical exercises that develop a refined body awareness. Hi Mike, Thanks for an excellent post. I have only one thing to say -- the whole idea that Qi is mystical is a misunderstanding of the phenomenon (imho, since I've probably not practiced as long and hard as most members of this board). my personal experiences with tai chi leads me to believe that Qi is as real as the air we breath, perhaps being so closely interlinked with our mundane existence, that it is rendered indiscernible. Doing Tai Chi forms, the Qi flows and circulates most definitively through out the meridians. Over a period of time, condensation naturally occurs. I have experienced (rare occasions, but definitely not delusion) physical sensations of being pushed without being touched physically while doing two person practice with my teacher as well as some other senior students of my school. My teacher quotes his teacher saying that Tai Chi ability builds up over a period of time, like building a skyscraper by stacking one sheet of paper over another. It is a slow and laborious process. Some people have it naturally (by virtue of their Karma). Others have to try hard and diligently. I think attempts to extrapolate Qi to modern scientific terms are futile (many have tried and failed miserably). But it is as real and the abilities it produces are also equally real.

When time stops and the world fades away The senses collapse and the ropes begin to fray The heat of knowing gradually growing burns through the bonds that lead me astray As the waves flow through me one after one Even though I'd thought one goes blind staring into the sun All words escape me and shrinks the thinking mind As the life-force rises on its ecstatic run The sun shines brightly and my blind eyes see finally that I am That Eternity I argue and fight and flame and flaunt my might but when I look deep deep inside the chasm there is but emptiness as I deal with it's dying spasm I am dying yet I live because I'm not whom I see finally I am -- That Eternity But it took a long time Took far too long to break free Break free of those bonds that were biting into me Immersed in that stillness the emptiness of bliss Breaking through that miasma of myself but a modicum of peace The dams finally gave out and like a raging stream the light suddenly rushed in drowning my indignant scream When I looked up again where had I gone? I was but nothing yet was every one I was in everything and everything was part of me And so I knew I am that Eternity It wasn't easy as the observed said -- who is it that's asking me to mend my ways? If you are not me and I am not you who are you then and who am I too? What is this Eternity that you bring forth... Do you even have a clue? The rest of this poem can be read here -- Tat Tvam Asi Hope it was worth the read. Best, Dwai

While it is true that the mind does create sensations and these are nasty traps to fall into, the sensation described is that of a channel opening. My teacher calls it the Suspension. While practicing Taiji Ch'uan and Tao Gong, we were encouraged to focus on suspending from our crown point (this would lead to better relaxation and reduce the stress that a long session can cause on the knees and ankles). For a long time, I did not feel anything in the crown point (a few years), until one day suddenly the sensation arrived (the mental image that it evoked is that of a little tornado-like spiral of energy rising out of my crown-point). This sensation gets stronger at certain times and I know it's time for me to start my practice. Alternately, on the days I begin practice without feeling my crownpoint, I stand and meditate till it starts tingling and then the Tai Chi that follows is very strong, generating a lot of sensation. My limited experience has shown me that these sensations (as they are written about) are maps/landmarks we should all bookmark during our practice. More so, they are also signs that indicate to our teacher of a particular level being achieved. Cheers

Read this article -- The Battle between Science and Yoga This is something I'd written to categorize the arguments Materialists have against seemingly psychic/extra-natural phenomena. Physics isn't advanced enough to fathom everything and explain everything. Cheers!

Read something about Condensation breathing and packing Chi into the bone marrow. It is said to make the bones stronger and result in fat burning. Related perhaps?

What do we read? The Philosophy book or the idea? People die but if their ideas have truth, they stay alive. That living force that is "already here now" is also in the philosophy in a book by a dead person (otherwise it's just a bunch of malarky). How do we know if a philosophy has "Living Force"? Intuitively perhaps...

If you do practice Hatha Yoga and Tai Chi/Chi Kung, you'll see the similarities in the energy flow. Personally yoga has been helpful in opening up some channels (or so I feel) and developing the suspension that my teacher emphasizes in Tai Chi practice. It might seem a tad unnatural, but it feels really great once you get going. The key to doing Hatha Yoga is moderation (tai chi classic? Not too much, not too little).

Interesting -- in The Bhagavad Gita, Sri Krishna refers to liberation in the state when the ingoing breath merges into the outgoing breath and there is no distinction between the two. The Kriya Yoga tradition of Lahiri Mahasaya (Yogananda's style) is also based on this.

Read this book on Neurobiology -- http://www.amazon.com/Brain-That-Changes-I...s/dp/067003830X

Try reading this book -- Nine Nights with the Taoist Master

Greetings friends, I've been musing over the difference between knowing something intellectually and simply knowing. For example -- you are walking down the street and you look at the sky and see it cloudy and smell moisture in the air and intellectually know that it might rain. Or you might be walking on a bright and sunny day and suddenly something tells you it's going to rain (not a cloud in sight, etc). There is a difference between these two kinds of knowing. Similar knowing exists in esoteric practices and spiritual traditions as well. We can read a sutra or a classic and ponder over it intellectually (and thus think we know it), but then the actual form or asana is practiced and suddenly the true meaning of what a sutra or tai-chi classic referred to becomes clear as day (my Aikido sensei used to call it a Zen moment). I would like to read your (all who bother to read this thread and want to respond) opinion on this matter. Regards

Hi Rain, Beautifully put! Thank you. It is this "knowing" that I am trying to track down/understand (albeit that can be a bit of conundrum, given that it is something that cannot be intellectualized). When the intellectual knowing stops, is when the intuitive knowing starts (i like to call this second knowing the intuitive knowing). When doing your practice, do you use the intellect or the intuition then? I find it hard to reconcile between the intellectually "inferred" and the intuitively gleamed. Regards

How does Ego affect our Meditation? Is it the Self or is it something distinct and disparate?

Hi Taomeow, Thanks for your response. It was very illuminating... I have a few questions based on your description. Note, however that I might not make any sense at all, since I'm just a novice. And my apologies if that is the case. So what drives your meditation? Your left brain or your right brain? Is it your left-brain Interpreter module? Or is it your Heart? Or is it your Lower Dan Tien/Te? Based on what I have understood of the process, Ego is our "Self-image" and it keeps "waking up" every once in a while to re-assert itself. It is not just an intellectual limitation that we place upon ourselves, but also a societal one. This Ego is the barrier that differentiates us from the unlimited one. I know it is very easy to talk about it intellectually but not sense it experientially. But for those rare instances when it drops... My meditation is in trying to learn what my teacher teaches me, physically as well as energetically. Get as close to the description as I can, hopefully to go beyond the description eventually. But the problem is with this darned Ego which throws a monkey-wrench in my plans. Maybe I'm imagining it, but my self-description seems to be my limitation. Thanks Todd. That was an extremely intriguing elucidation. My teacher tells us about syntax and it's limitations. I guess to experience the Dao, we need to first go beyond syntax (which is what Lao Tzu refers to in the first aphorism of the Tao te Ching)... But my problem has been with the separation of the intellect from the experience. I believe (from my reading, etc) that this is a primary problem with many of the "Rational" kinds. We tend to "interpret" everything and find an explanation (even when there might not be any definition or words to explain such phenomenon).

But there is an Ego problem involved. Everyone has to deal with it -- no matter what your level of practice. It (ego) raises it's ugly head. Everytime we meditate and think about our "accomplishment", we are feeding the ego. It is frustrating, but the first step I think is in detecting it. You are right about the Fundamental One-ness of existence. But the Tao and the Brahman are not the sun or the moon, they are the same sky. Just like you call "Sky" - "Sky" in English, you call it "Aakaash" in Samskrit. But the end result is that you are referring to the same thing, only your syntax has changed. But when it comes to Tao and Brahman, what is to describe and what can be understood? Doesn't the Tao-te-Ching say if the Tao can be described it is not the real Tao? Similarly, the Vedantic literature does everything but try and describe Brahman. Here is a little article on Brahman that is Shiva or Sat-chit-ananda (or Existence, Consciousness, Bliss) -- http://medhajournal.com/columns/philosophy...liberation.html We have to get to that Undifferentiated One slowly by integrating the pieces that is us, weaving together the individual threads of our consciousness and energy. My Tai Chi Master refers to how "the Te has to be found before connecting back to Tao".

I am glad I was able to shed some light on this topic. The topic of Brahman is greatly debated in the Classical Indic Philosophical schools. There were six traditional schools of philosophy, Vedanta (or Uttara Mimamsa) being only one of those six. Within Vedanta itself there are 3 schools with different interpretations/levels of understanding of Brahman. The Non-dual school (not Monist mind you, specifically Non-Dual) or Advaita Vedanta treats Brahman as One and there is none other. Everything that exists is Brahman as is all that doesn't exist. The Dualist (dvaita Vedanta) school stops at the level of Taiji (the concept) with the dualism. The Specific Non-Dual (Vishishta Advaita) school says that dualism is the commonly observed phenomenon, but at the end it is all one. That seems to be the observation by Taoists as well (or so it seems to me) -- with the One Chi, Yin and Yang and the Tao. The Tao, the way it was treated (or so I think) in Ancient China has parallels with the concept of Rta (or The Way or The Order) of Ancient India (as in the Purva Mimamsa school of Philosophy). Rta became Dharma with the advent of Vedanta. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vedanta http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dharma#Proto-...ta_in_the_Vedas My purpose of posting these comments is because I saw SZ's original post (about Tao and Atman + Brahman) and it struck a chord. My intention isn't to belittle anyone else's opinion or to show off. The topics of Veda and Taoism and their similarities is a matter of great excitement for me. Regards, Dwai

I believe you speak of a different Brahman. The Brahman per Vedantic philosophy the undifferentiated One and everything is but a manifestation of it. The Brahman does not "create" anything -- since there is nothing that is not Brahman. The Brahman Simply is (too). The Indic way is to quantify this infinity that is Brahman in the form of more personified entities (deities). Like the old saying goes -- Do not judge a book by it's cover and don't accept anything you see at face value. There is almost always something deeper and more profound lying beneath the surface.

Hmm...that seems like an interesting "spin" to the term Wandering... As far as Atman and Brahman are concerned -- they are the same as Te and Tao (Microcosm and Macrocosm). There is little difference (mho) -- call it whatever you want to call it (Tao, Brahman, Great Eagle, Nagual, the list is endless). What it isn't is a personalized/personified God (which is also a distilliation, an abstraction of the Tao btw). East or South-East, the wisdom remains...we must not indulge in the Ego (my way is better than your way), but follow which-ever path the Tao leads us to...

The number 108 is an auspicious number in Indian Cosmology and thus a recurring concept. please refer to the bibliography provided in this url for some more detail on the concept of Marmas in the Indian Martial traditions -- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revival_of_Kalarippayattu