Starjumper

Hi girls. That was me =) A person on my forum asked about a certain practice an upon checking it out I found some people here going ga ga over the latest BS artist. I very much dislike seeing people getting ripped off in the name of my practice and so upon dealing with it in my typically heavy handed manner (I'm not a sissy keyboard artist, I'm a goddamn welder) I noticed a bit of a childish tendency arising in some of the respondents and so decided to, as they say, fuck with their heads. I think it's called trolling =) I hope some enjoyed the attempt at humor. Bye girls, {{{smooch}}} Ian and Sean and 'others', I'll get back to you in that thread before too long. I'll tone it down.

Thanks, I tried it but - Lama Dorje: "There are no topics to show for those search parameters"

Hey thanks, Trunk, I did the search but the only thread that came up is the Wild Goose one, Yes, he is 95 now, he is a very amazing person, and extremely powerful with chi, and kind too, at least to strangers =) He does have very judgemental and bad things to say about some types of practices and teachers too. Also, I shared almost nothing of my practice. I said that beginners could benefit from Max's exercises, so we agree on something, good. Many of the most advanced masters had very few students. The most powerful chi kung master in China has only one..

OK, I did the kunlun search and this is all that came up. Does capitalization matter in searches? BTW, Michael Tse claiming to be a master makes him a liar too =) I'm sure DustWalker is gone, but Dayan chi kung is Wild Goose chi kung and I have learned it.

No problem, I'm really glad that you are glad that we were able to clear that up too. Have fun with the used car salesman's beginner weenie practice, may it take you far. Or at least as far as possible.

Yes I saw that but it's not high priority. No doubt my students and people in general think I'm quite a sweety pie, but there has always been disagreement among various schools. Normally masters are polite to each other but they will not tolerate fakes and can be quite abusive to them. The internet is quite conducive to yang interactions as well. After rereading the section on that page I think I will concede that one to you and guess I took it the wrong way, it wasn't stated wellby him and was a little ambiguous. I must say that after reading the other BS I was in the wrong frame of mind. Well your spelling was close. Pei Mei is often written as Pai Mei, so maybe your Pia Mei was just a typo. I've heard of Tong Long but afraid I don't know what it is.

It could be another projection bt I got it from here From his site: "........building of chi in the lower dan tien and projecting it from the palm. You can really mess up someone's nervous system that way and damage their internal organs. .... If he sees this kind of desire in you, he will teach you nothing." Projecting chi from the palm is usually a healing technique. Here's more: "Many people are interested in this energy being used on people who are not open to it. This is not possible with Kunlun because this process involves matching the magnetic body of the people involved." That is BS because if you have chi you can use it on someone whether they want you to or not. Hey that's great. Maybe if you knew my teacher was Bruce Lee's primary kung fu teacher you might change your mind, (not the guy in Hong Kong) Bruce Lee knew his shit, luckily for him he could prove it by beating people up. It's a little tougher for me. I think it's fantastic you don't want to come and see me, that's great, glad I could weed out another one. My teacher rejected almost all applicants and I'm not looking too hard for students either. Go see Max, give him your money, be happy.

I pointed out the lies in a previous post so liar fits. Also, I saw a sales video of his and he made it sound like a really high power secret practice which he made a lot of exalted claims for. It was a very good sales pitch, but it was a lie and I'll explain why later in this post. I was interested and the more I looked into it the more my bullshit alarm went off, as it has for other people who have checked him out as well. The point is, what he is teaching is two relatively mild exercises that have been separated out from a system. I have a serious problem with him calling it nei kung, which is very misleading. These exercises are OK and they can be jazzy for beginners but they won't do much for a more energized practitioner. Leg shaking is a way of generating chi and for people who have never experienced a lot of chi it can be impresive. But why doesn't he just tell people to shake right off the bat instead of beating around the bush? Sounds fishy to me. I shake my legs all the time, even now while I'm typing I'm shaking my legs, you can do that too, you don't have to make some big bullshit deal out of it nor do you need to hold the hand posture he calls for. When someone has more chi flowing through wimpy channels then it can cause spontaneous chi kung, either a random chi kung dance or spontaneous postures or mudras. My teacher or I can make people do that by shinning hands on them with the terrible palm energy that Max says is so evil =) He's such a bullshitter. After the channels are 'burned' open to allow more flow then the added energy from shaking will not cause spontaneous movement. So while it can seem thrilling for a beginner it's sort of a big yawn for someone who already has strong energy. Another thing about the arm posture. From the sound of it it appears that the instruction is to hold one hand only up, that is BS. He just wants to make you do something difficult to make it seem like a big deal. What you do when your shoulder starts to hurt too much is you simply turn the 'ball' over and hold it with the other hand up. Also note, even though the elbow is up the shoulder should be down, the shoulder will creep up abd that will cause more pain tension. What is even better than holding the ball with hands vertically is to hold the ball with the hands to each side like you are holding a big ball against your lower tan tien. The hand position he calls for is not a powerful position. Not unless you are Max. I said my teacher could beat up Max's teacher (which is no doubt a fact) and then I had the little smiley face =) in case you missed it. I was just playing around at being ten, so relax. I was thinking I want to improve everyones energy and my own too by helping them not get suckered by a bullshitter. I hope that helps. Besides I've been to my mountaintop already, I have no where to get, but yes, in the final analysis, I shouldn't bother. Suckers are born every day and nothing will change that. Hopefully I saved a couple anyway.

Yes, popcorn, a good idea. And thank you so much for describing the posture. ROFL, no kidding??? What a huge clock of clap that is! That guy is more of a fairy than I originally thought. I teach the leg shaking in the first class, even to people who are just curious and checking it out without paying. The hand position is indeed one of the many 'holding the ball' postures, and it really isn't too special, it's second grade stuff. Leg shaking, kids do it automatically, hold your heels up and what happens? DUH, your feet start shaking, why not just tell people to shake in the first place? Because it makes it look like a big mystery, that's why. We just get on with the shaking and in a little while it becomes automatic. The shaking generates some energy, and you can use many different hand positions during it. If people are going ga ga over that then it really is a sad situation. No wonder Max doesn't want real Nei Kung artists coming to his class, they'd feel like killing him for his lying cheating ways. No wonder lil Max is afraid of palm energy LOL. So here we have some Bozo hyping some minor little practice and making a lot of money off of it. Now I'm jealous. Sure it will, if you are very suggestible, but by then he has your money, so it's all good, does he give money back guarantees? This is another ten cent exercise, and it isn't nearly as good as the first one. Actually it's usually spelled Pei Mei, and it means White Eyebrow. The image appears stretched vertically so I'm going to take it out for now and adjust it. It looks like the avatar machine on here modifies all images so that they are 125 X 125 no matter what the original dimensions are.

Don't go yet, we are in the process of exposing the joker in the Pillars of bliss thread, the sitting posture is described there later on in the thread.

OK, I'll try a search, hopefully I'm covering some territory which is new here. Glad you like the avatar, it is fun. I think I'll switch to Pei Mei for awhile for Mal

OK, your points are well taken. A used car salesman does sell functioning cars after all. Maybe I can get a show of hands here as to who is in the for or against camp. One of the pages on the website I posted above has a 'scientific explanation' of how it works, and that 'science' really bites. It is one of his lies, if he doesn't really know science he shouldn't use fake explanations. Another thing is that Nei Kung systems are systems which contain hundreds, if not thousands, of techniques. It is true that nei kung systems contain some techniques which are not well known among the chi kung community, but if someone shows you a couple of exercises from nei Kung then that is not nei kung. It's a couple of chi kung exercises. So that is another and very unfortunate lie, because it can create whole groups of people who have been misled into thinking they are doing nei kung and that they know what it is when the fact is that they are missing most of the boat. Nei kung really is a fabulous thing and if you learn and do the whole thing it can take you all the way to the mountaintop, and quickly too. What Max is teaching is not nei kung, it's a lie, it's a few chi kung techniques put together in a very simplistic chi kung system. He's only calling it nei kung because it's popular with the crowd that rushes hither and yon to different seminars, it's the latest and greatest way to make $$$. Another thing which is really weird is he said he won't teach people who have palm energy because it can be used to hurt others! OK, that sounds nice, but keep this in mind. All real chi kung masters have this palm energy and it is normally used for healing others and it is essential for nei kung to work on self healing as well. All accomplished nei kung practitioners should have this palm energy. Therefore it seems the only reason for him to say such a thing is because he's afraid of people who knows the real thing. Also, I've been studying internal arts for thirty years too, with several high level masters, and my nei kung teacher is one of the hidden masters. ...and, my teacher can beat up his teacher =) Not saying his not an impressively nice guy, used car salesmen are very nice.

I found this guy Max's website. http://www.kunlunbliss.com/index.html I just think you guys should have some reservations about this and maybe not waste your money going to a seminar, unless you have a lot of money to waste, that is. I'm afraid I need to toot my own horn to provide some backing for my opinion here, but I spent six years of intensive training learning a real Nei Kung system from a very advanced and powerful master, and due to my perspective it looks like Max is a flake, liar, and bullshitter ala used car salesman, and a fairy too =) I realize that many of you don't have have access to a real master, or aren't motivated enough to go to one, or wouldn't be able to stomach it if you did, so you end up going from one seminar to the next. Just beware of this guy's claims. I don't have the time now but I will explain later what it is about the claims and explanations here and on the website which set off alarm bells in me. Concerning this posture, could you or someone describe it for me please. No doubt Max makes it sound like some secret special deal and people feel reluctant to relate it, but I've learned most if not all the ten thousand postures and it probably includes the one in question. You can be fairly certain that one single posture really isn't that special and that there are several that will do the same thing. I'm guessing that to cause shaking and other movement that it must be a pretty wide stance with knees bent. I'm guessing that due to the shoulder pain people are mentioning that the hands and arms are either overhead or in some awkward position?? Concerning the posture name of holding the ball, there are many variations, but it is sometimes called embracing the tree and it is similar to post stance, horse stance would be one too if you changed the angle of your wrists. The Various types of holding the ball meditations (sitting or standing) are on of the hallmarks of Taoist meditations. If you want to learn the real thing you'll need to plan on living in Seattle for four years, at least.

So am I correct in assuming that this Kunlun practice consists of bouncing up and down while holding the ball?

Here's one way of looking at it. Traditional Eastern paintings of enlightened masters depicts them with a big aura. A big aura results from having a lot of chi (chi power) so, drink your Lotsachiade and you too can glow in the dark.

Unconditional love, you can fake it , but you can't practice it although faking it could help, it is a result, not a practice. As part of the long process of meditation the negativities that arise are opportunities for you to face your own worst enemy. If your meditations are working this negativity will get worse and it will provide the motivation to search for causes. In order to experience unconditional love you must be able to truly forgive others and truly see things through their eyes. In order to do that you must be able to absolutely forgive yourself. Before you do that you must be able to achieve stillness in te. In addition to that you must befriend your own worst enemy. Before you do that you must be able to experience mental stillness (no thought) for extensive periods during day to day activities. Before you do that you must first achieve an enlightenment experience. Before you do that you must be able to experience mental stillness for extensive periods during meditation. Before you do that you must be facing your own worst enemy. Before you do that you must experience all your negativities arising and hounding you like demons and resolve to kill or cure them. Before you do that you need to meditate a bunch. You also need to continue meditating during the whole thing. Perhaps that's why gurus tell people to fake it till they make it.

I agree, but my point was about energy cultivation as it relates to spiritual progress. Meditation use specific postures because they do specific energy 'jobs' in our bodies. When you have more energy flowing within then that job is done better.

Thanks Mal, have a wonderful new year.

In the martial Nei Kung systems the powers that are cultivated are not directly related to spiritual progress except in a roundabout way. Most systems, whether they are martial or caligraphy, focus on something 'else' to achieve which is not specific to spiritual growth but it can make spiritual growth faster because it provides motivation to meditate and it provides a focus for meditation. The powers and special abilities cultivated in martial Nei Kung/alchemy require an increase in a person's chi power, and having more chi provides faster results in spiritual growth if they are combined with the right series of cultivation meditations. The enlightenment level among meditators in general is the same as it is in the non meditating public, but the ratio among martial artists is about a thousand times higher, I read that somewhere, the rest I know =)

I would like to know about your technique with the wool. Was it combined intent or did you also do energy work on it? Concerning the video, there is a lot about it the suggests it is a fake, the abruptness of the rising motions, the leg movement to maintain balance, the ring of fire to keep the curious away, the darkness. However, there appears to be no tree overhead, but can't be sure. However, my long time teacher, one of the most powerful chi kung masters, accepts levitation as fact. He told me that levitation serves no useful purpose because it is too slow and it wastes too much energy and yet he had me try it and told me how. He showed me newspaper clippings from a Chinese newspaper about a levitation contest that was held in Europe, it included a photo of the winner. The last couple of nights I have had some dreams of levitating with special emphasis on the technique so this thread appears to have some synchronicity for me since I've been gone for six months and on my return it's at the top of the line.

The theories point to the same truth in various awkward, confusing ways. I had an insight into the best explanation some years ago, a simple and obvious truth. The point is, they do know, and I know it better but I'm not telling.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story...kennedy_jr__wil Excerpt: Electronic voting machines also caused widespread problems in Florida, where Bush bested Kerry by 381,000 votes. When statistical experts from the University of California examined the state's official tally, they discovered a disturbing pattern: "The data show with 99.0 percent certainty that a county's use of electronic voting is associated with a disproportionate increase in votes for President Bush. Compared to counties with paper ballots, counties with electronic voting machines were significantly more likely to show increases in support for President Bush between 2000 and 2004." The three counties with the most discrepancies -- Broward, Palm Beach and Miami-Dade -- were also the most heavily Democratic. Electronic voting machines, the report concluded, may have improperly awarded as many as 260,000 votes to Bush. "No matter how many factors and variables we took into consideration, the significant correlation in the votes for President Bush and electronic voting cannot be explained," said Michael Hout, a member of the National Academy of Sciences. Charles Stewart III, an MIT professor who specializes in voter behavior and methodology, was initially skeptical of the study -- but was unable to find any flaw in the results. "You can't break it -- I've tried," he told The Washington Post. "There's something funky in the results from the electronic-machine Democratic counties."

What's so funny about it, the idea that it generates more energy or that it is non specific? I don't have any idea what to expect from those accupuncture measuring techniques, and the most substantial thing I have to back up what I'm saying is my experience. I have trained myself to be quite sensitive to chi and when I use certain motions to generate more of it then you can bet your life that I feel more of it then, and the machine produces the same feeling. The only thing I can recommend is that you try it yourself. You can do all the same focussing and sealing while using the machine, and for me it generates similar levels of chi as an extensive shaking practice does. I have no idea what Winn teaches pertaining to shaking but I'll take your word for it that it's limited. BTW, there are other practices which generate more chi than shaking =) Word games, your body generates the chi with movement and the machine is what makes you move, so the machine is doing the work and you are getting the benefit. That's called high efficiency, and high efficiency is particularly important in this chi cultivation scheme of things. It generates energy in the same way that shaking does. Do you or anyone else here know how shaking generates energy?

That may be true but I think you are comparing apples and oranges here. The chi machines generate MORE energy, lots of it, in a non specific manner. Acupuncture has nothing to do with generating energy, it is more about dealing with blockages. It has very little commonality with acupuncture and it was a mistake to campare them, I suggest you try one of the machines on yourself to see how it feels. Some of the machines are variable speed and so might have been better for your father at a slow setting. I hope you can try to describe what was different about the energy you felt from the machine compared to self-propelled activities because I have learned to move myself in the same way as the machine and it generates the same feeling. It seems to me that the key difference you may have experienced is 'more' because there are also some other types of self practices which generate similar amounts of energy with similar feelings.