Lotus Flower

Inspirational. Thank you for sharing. As a counselor, it is great to hear of successes without medications. I do not believe everyone needs medications as so many people believe. I teach meditation to my clients to try to help them realize other ways that can help them.

What's the difference between turned on & off and activated or not? Seems to be the same thing to me...

It is the same thing-I was trying to put it in terms where everyone would understand what I meant.

http://blog.newsweek.com/blogs/labnotes/ar...e-your-dna.aspx

 

http://abcnews.go.com/Health/story?id=5287805&page=1

It is saying that they can alter which genes are "turned on and which are turned off." In my mind it is more of what is and is not activated...

Cool, I think I will look into getting a room at the holiday inn as well...it would be nice to wake up in the morning and be all nice and relaxed and not have to travel Not like Scottsdale where I was ~20 minutes away and had to drive like a bat outta hell saturday morning and hope my directions were good!

Oh goodie..that means I have a place to sleep also hee hee hee

I appreciate all the advice, but I think were aiming for two different goals. My goal is not to live a happy life, and to have better personal relations, its to transcend this world. There are a lot of people and a lot of paths, and this is mine.

 

Yes more than two hours does get you noticed, and thats exactly what I am aiming for, eventually I would like to be able to spend 10 hours a day in trance or more, leaving time to eat, exercise, shower. etc.

 

The deeper the trance the better, I hope to master leaving my body at will as to seek out teachers, and information. I have been out of my body a few times, each time for a slightly longer period, doing qigong/neigong while out of body also holds amazing potential.

 

You guys can continue your grounded lifestyles, and work on building better interpersonal relationships, be better people, work at local charities, and honestly it isn't going to do anything to help you awaken into a higher level of consciousness. Sure it will make you a better person, of that I am certain.

 

The problem is I don't want to be a better person. I don't even want to be a person. I don't want to be anything. It's really that simple. Perhaps this mode of thought is in and of itself insane, but its what I want, and its what I am seeking.

I feel that you are just able to define your path and that is a good thing. Not everyone is on the same path, as you said. Some people can accept that (as you can) others can not.

mwight, I commend you in your search. Please continue to share

I like where ths is going:

 

http://www.livevideo.com/video/ConspiracyC...e-no-cures.aspx

 

Its called , "Psychiatry, No Science, No Cures.

 

ENJOY!

 

Peace,

Lin

It is VERY true! I admit this from my perspective of a Counseling standpoint. There are many people that will admit this. One of my professors who has a PhD in Psychology will admit this also. There is not a problem with admitting this. The problem is that the way in which the media will portray this.

The truth is just as Oolong Rabbit said, it is an art not a science. The problem is that they are trying to push an art into the Medical Model. I don't know how many people know about the medical model but that is all about the disease. Mental illness is not a disease though. That is the problem. They are trying to fit the square peg into the round hole.

My profession is Counseling which has NOTHING to do with prescription drugs. It is talk therapy, which other have a problem with also. In my opinion, if someone needs someone to speak to in a guided manner, that is my profession. It is not what many think though. It is not the Freudian couch scenario. It is controversial just as there are many things on this forum controversial.

It is what I will say again, What is the path you choose? Is there tangible truth? No--just as in psychiatry, counseling, psychology.

As I said, there is a difference in psychiatry, counseling and psychology. People often mistake them and interchange these even though there are distinct differences.

Empty? Hollow? Jeez, so half the Taobums probably would have been commited!

I guess my issue with psychology has always been that it's not really a science, but tries to pass itself off as one. I am not sure about the United States, but psychology in Canada is part of the arts program. I mean if you want to study the brain using scientific methods, study neuroscience. This abstract metaphysical concept of the "psyche", well I am just not so sure that you can adequately study it using empirical tools. Anyhow, I will shut up about it now .

 

BTW, see what happens when you try to make a brief comment about mental masterbation on Taobums? You get sucked into the intellectual maelstrom.

Haha

Sad, that if you say you hear voices stating certain things you are deemed schizophrenic...

I agree with you that the US does try to pass off the art of Psychology as a science. They try to use science to back up their beliefs, but that certainly does not happen all the time. There are so many contradictions in their studies because it certainly is an art.

Mental Health Counseling is an art...talk therapy that many people do not believe in either.

Yes, you got sucked in...and I must take pride in that because like I said...I thrive off this hee hee

Have you ever heard of the thud experiement?

 

hqaptRYjhq4

It says you should beware the monks with a statue that is missing a hand

I have heard of the thud experiment. I actually have a copy of the study in front of me. There are MANY problems with the you tube video as a matter of fact. Some of things are true, but not all. The way the patients were admitted is almost all true, they all said they were hearing voices that said, "empty", "hollow", and "thud" After they were admitted they did act normal again. They were administered psychotropic drugs, but did not take any of them. Their stay ranged from 7-52 days with an average of 19 days.

The most interesting thing about the experiment (in my opinion) was that the patients who WERE insane know that the pseudopatients were not insane. They would often tell the pseudopatients and the staff this.

So, Psychiatry does have its problems and we in the field do admit it. I am not studying Psychiatry though, so I guess I am better off. There is a difference between Psychiatry and Psychology. In Psychology, we do also admit that we certainly do NOT have the all of the answers and are still looking.

The same as anything we may follow at this time. There is no tangible truth in any of it, yet we all have our paths that we will follow.

 

It says you should beware the monks with a statue that is missing a hand

If anyone finds the monk, please let me know so I can explain why I have the hand LOL

I am enslaved, trapped, bound to this world. My purpose in this life is to break free, and never return.

 

I am not enlightened, of that I am certain.

 

I will be reborn again if I died today, of that I am also certain.

 

The purpose of my life is to awaken, and achieve liberation.

So, you are becoming awakened and achieving liberation in this life...may I ask how?

What is your path?

I have a BA in philosophy . I thought philosophy would give me some answers, but all it did was create more questions. The reality is that I have learned more about who and what I am by sitting and meditating than any philosophical work I have ever read. The constant stream of thoughts just adds layers between us and our original nature, and there's a lot of wisdom in the old taoist notion of forgetting. Then again, I'm just a rabbit with a teapot on his head, so take what I say with a grain of salt.

Well, maybe that is the problem..my BA is in Psychology...my MA (I am currently going for) will be in professional mental health counseling. Could be that Psychology and Counseling are leading me down the wrong path...

Hell, I am just a hand holding a lotus flower, what does that say about me??

heehee old habits die hard!

Ahh, I just don't want you complaining about paying for me...after all, you "are not made of cash"

LMAO

This all sounds like a lot of intellectual masterbation. Just sit down and meditate

Maybe it is, but I am an intellect at heart and thrive off this

I'd like to go but I'm not 100% at this point. I've got my son that weekend and I'm not sure what his deal is (he does some qigong and meditation, I showed him kunlun 1...but he's 14, so I dont know if he'd be interested)...mentioned it to Jen, but I'm not sure if she wants to go either...then there's the whole cash thing to figure out...I'll sit down and do some talkin' & figgerin' and see what's up. AZ cost me like 900 by the time all was said and done, foundation training is going to cost me like 2k, this one will be...well, depends on who's going and if I am paying for them too I do ok but I aint made of cash hahahaaa

I surely will try to make it though!

Hey now! I can pay my own way

When I when down to the end of train tracks, everything that I was burned to the ground, it was a hard time in my life. Try realizing you don't even exist, and trying to keep it together at the same time. LOL

 

Since then I have shifted my paradigm, and learned to wear my ego more like a sweater. This ego I show to the world is no more real than a character I play on a video game.

 

I had a dream once a long time ago that I and a yogi were sitting in the stream, he pointed to some bubbles grasping onto a blade of grass underwater. "We are like the bubbles" he said, and then I woke up.

It took me many years to really realize what that really meant.

 

In essence I believe we are all one being, we are simply having different experiences simultaneously.

It is my hope that maybe someday we can all awaken and leave this place, or at least the ones who want to.

 

I have fun playing my character, but I want out of this endless theater. I want to achieve nirvana, liberation, union with god, whatever name you want to call it, To exist eternally as formless awareness, to never be reborn into a phenomenal reality, and realize truth eternally. No pain, no pleasure, nothing at all, just voidness.

So, from your view, what do you view as the reason you are here now as in your life?

I realize I am opening a can of worms and there may be some people that are going to get upset because I am asking such a question where some will take it the wrong way and think I am asking "what is the reason for us?" That is not what I am asking though...I am asking you personally what you think your reason is. You believe that eventually you will realize truth. Have no pain, pleasure, etc.

I am curious to see what you think of your life then.

You believe so?. Is it not only a hypothesis?. You mean to say, you don't doubt that at all?.

 

(Is not belief beyond the ability to doubt?. Or are people metaphorically calling 'the most favourable hypothesis'

belief?.)

 

To me it sounds like a attempt at consoling myself, if and when I feel deprived of something or when I relate to another's grief.

I would say that it is his belief and others may have doubts because that is not what they believe.

Who are we to say who is right though? Maybe this view is correct.

I look at people in my life that hold their convictions strong and have no doubt whereas I doubt their beliefs. From that experience, I tell myself to realize that they are going to believe what they want and it is not up to me to ask them if they doubt it. I will just respect them enough to let them have their beliefs whereas I will continue my search

I have always been alone. I believe there is only ONE being in existence, and we are apart of it, just as our cells are apart of us.

Now THAT is an interesting concept. One many humans do not want to explore though...

I like that train of thought though...

That is an interesting question.

 

I suspect that speaking for all Taoists is not your intention here, as I'm certain that at least some can see the general trend.

 

The 'evidence' is there - if you want to look into it, you really need to trace human history from the 'beginning' - from small tribal societies, to agriculture, to industrial age and to the current information age... these 'ages' were always very grand and relatively quickly changed our entire way of life in many very important ways...

 

To view a tiny part of it all in a Taoist way, you can notice that this trend has been moving up and out - yang expanding... this is apparent microcosmically in the average western human - most of their awareness is limited to the head and all their attention is outwards to things outside themselves... As this trend is gathering more and more momentum there is a quieter, subtler trend moving in the opposite direction - people moving down into their bodies with their attention moving inwards into themselves (for most this is an extremely painful process)... Nature has this habit of balancing things out eh?

 

That balancing is happening internally too - you notice richer people, more complicated healthcare, all the external things seem to be sorted out, yet there is this obvious dissatisfaction with it all - do you realise how many middle-aged women are on anti-depressant medication? - particularly those of middle and upper class economic standing... Innate nature corrects the imbalance of going up into the head, by drawing us back down into the body with plenty of 'new world' illnesses. And it's also drawing us back inwards by never allowing real satisfaction from all the stuff we've hoarded...

 

There is so much more to it, so much fascinating exploration to be had... It's so beautiful to watch it without concern and judgement - and it's so painful to watch it with concern and judgement... but we have to do both, if we're to grow...

 

Nicely put. I think that is a very good perception. It also is a motivator for me at least. Not only should I be looking at myself but also to see what is going on outside of me...

What is a person. (ie. What are you?)

Are you talking person as in personality and what makes your personality or are you speaking more in terms of human being/person?

So abstract or concrete??

RAOTFLMFAO Oolong

 

Warm welcome to Lotus Flower - I already feel lucky to know you!

Thank you, Steve! The feeling is mutual

I think it is a very interesting concept. Just think of what you can ask yourself--such as if you did accomplish your goals, what you are doing for a job, who you are with, etc.

I too would like to know what your email said that stopped you....if you will share.

Are we looking at 2009? I was thinking it might be cool to chip in and rent a cabin or something. Get away from the craziness of the city.

I have to admit...no matter how much I love the city. I do believe your idea is best. Although I do love the "country-side" also

I suppose Lin is right...we will have it all figured out by then regardless.

heehee but of couerse I will!!!

I dont know if I'll want to come back after it hahahahaa

Yeah, I think that will be the hardest thing to do after a full 7 days

People have gotten into accidents studying their minds while they're driving.

 

I think you will find you always have to limit what you're mindful of. You can only fit so many things in your mind at once*. Even looking inwards, there are deeper and deeper levels that appear over time. Most recently, I've noticed a subtle mind movement that occurs when I think on purpose than if thoughts simply bubble up. If you study your mind, you'll lose externals. If you keep inwardly focused, you'll miss the relationship between sensory inputs and mental reactions. If you focus on your mind, you lose the sense of the body. If you focus on your breath, you'll likely miss the contact of your feet on the ground.

 

Just for reference, what are you studying the mind in relation to?

 

*: In Mt Analogue, Rene Daumal suggests the average mind can only track 3-4 things at once.

I think maybe it would be more appropriate for me to say that I am observing my mind instead of really studying it. I am a beginner in a sense. I am observing how certain thoughts, emotions, reactions come about in my mind. I want to try to calm some of them, especially the ones that are of no use to me.

It points to knowing all things, without carrying them with you all the times. Thus when the conditions arise, so does the teachings.

 

Mindful of all things, but attached to none.

Therefore, if one is mindful of all things, yet all things not being attached to, then all things are not all things, and there is nothign to be mindful of. A non-discriminative mind is all pervasive, non-obstructed. Thus all things are upon the tip of a hair.

 

All Buddha Lands are of all directions, all sounds of the world are regarded, and there is no non-mindfulness, thus no mindfulness. Thus-ness pervades all directions, and not one direction is being pervaded.

 

Peace and Blessings,

Lin

Lin, I like the mindful of all things, but attached to none phrase. That is very powerful and holds a lot of truth in the path.

I know you will have 7 days free for this

Ok so sure I was in hella pain last night but I got a ton of work done. You have to leverage the need for extreme mind focus as a means to distract you from your body.

 

So I bike home -- sit in more full-lotus. Fall asleep. Wake up with this insane amount of bliss in the nether regions -- like the deepest amazing orgasm. It was awesome. So did more full-lotus, more sleep. Read Ramana Maharshi and Gurdjieff.

 

All I'm saying is that as Gurdjieff states the biggest problem in the West is the lower energy centers remain undeveloped. Read "In Search of the Miraculous" and ignore Ouspensky.

Thank you. I guess I will need to do some reading

It depends on what you're doing. Your inner chatter is not relevant when you're driving, but it IS relevant when you're studying your mind. Nothing is relevant but a single object if you're practicing one-pointed concentration. There is no one size fits all definition.

That is a good point. I think at this point it is important for me (as well as others) to always study the mind. No matter what you may be doing. I feel it gets you more in touch with things.

ha ha ha Good Point!