lazy cloud

I look forward to the consciousness is consciousness answer. As I tend to view conscious and consciousness , both as umbrella terms.(Conceptual Pluarity) Until then I will wonder if our consciousness topic will include any of the following concepts: awareness, cognitive psychology, perception and comprehension, sentience, wakefullness, self-awareness, Qualia, self-knowledge, states we are aware of, consciousness as an entity, is it a noun,adjective, verb.., is it life-like ? electro-magnetic ? neural? Even a crude basic look at this for me is problematic. 3 questions, what is, how is or even how can, and why? Subjectivity? Or are going to look at Transitive consciousness or Access consciousness, involving a form of meta-mentality or meta-intionality? where is the link? William James(1890) Stream of Consciousness. Consciousness as a dynamic process. Will this be a difficult topic because of the inherent differences between our subjective and objective modes of understanding?

Interestingly april 6 and april 19 have always been extremely good days for me personally.

I stumbled on that too. I got such a kick out of it I watched it 3 times. That lucy girl is hot.

If I wasn't interested in Twinner or Twinner's views then I would not have used my energy to post on this thread. Great thread this is and it would be cool if you did start a seperate collective conscious/unconscious thread. A few minor things that don't really matter but brought up in a friendly way , striving for consistency. "winning an argument" This flew way over my head. There is no winning or losing. It is an exchange and sharing of ideas. We all learn from each other. "I didn't expect the topic to go in this direction" Such is the way of serendipity and/or synchronicity. Very cool topic I have learned with each new post. In fact I didn't expect the topic to go in this direction either but I am glad it did. "but rather this discussion is very much like water" ( Taoist like. ) Those who cannot put their thoughts on ice should not enter into the heat of the discussion. When water warms to a certain level it is said to SUBLIME. pun intended. Iron sharpens iron. We aim above the mark to find the mark. MH , is that how they did it in the army? Extreme positions are not succeeded by moderate ones, but by contrary extreme positions. All things are subject to interpretation. whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is usually a function of power and not truth. Now, to get back up to speed on this topic. When one runs into a wall, look for a window or a door OR a GATE. You must have chaos within you to give birth to a dancing star. Careful where you cast your eggs , eggs are easily broken. The modern science paradigm is shifting hard now, largely due to the influence of Geometry. We are in transition to a post modern science or a "more modern science" I think JoeBlast stated. "I do not intend to change" (not taoist like )

Welcome Home.

Twinner may have come up with this metaphor independantly but it has been tried before. Seeking to intellectualize "What is Tao?" is not rational. It is not the natural universe as a whole nor is it the way of nature as a whole. It is not even the underlying law of the universe from which all other principles & phenomena proceed. If it was any of these things/concepts it would have been explained as such. Since it has not been explained as such after thousands of years of thought then maybe it really is unnamable,unfathomable, and inexhaustable. I do like the conscious/unsconcious collective concept IMO it does exist but it is not the Tao. It is not the 10th or 11th dimension. It is not the String Theory either. It is not the basic eternal principle of the universe that transcends reality and is the source of being,non being, and change. So, it not being any of these, as they have been rejected as a definition of What is Tao? Forward and backward, abyss on top of abyss, on top of abyss. In danger like this, pause first and wait. Otherwise you will fall into a pit in the abyss. Do not act in this way. Tao is GLIMPSED only through its effects. Over in Oxford there is another question that comes up from time to time...... The classical question "What caused God?"(I am not asking any Buddhist to attempt to answer this here) My point is , there are questions that make their rounds and do cause a certain amount of thought. Question all things as Twinner has said. Do not always expect to find the answer. If you find a warm fuzzy place where you think you know the answer to "What is Tao?" Great! by all means have a cookie. t

So, you are a Religious Taoist? Do you view Religion and Spiritual as 2 different things? Of course we should question all things. IMO the Ancient Sages were far superior to modern man. If they did not define Tao, it will be remarkable if we do. I think we need to further examine what the Ancient Sages said and look for the clues there. If someone did benefit from Christianity or Islam or any other religion,science, or philosophy why would they limit themself to that and not also seek out the wisdom from TTC. I am starting to agree with Everything in that you are putting limits on your view. Just because we have advanced in a linear timeline 2000 some odd years does not neccessarily make us smarter,more observant,wiser,... Just because "most believe" something does not make it the truth either.

It's a start. I am sure the lizard appreciated it. Kindness is kindess. Good to get the random act of kindness in early in the day. That way you will feel a sense of accomplishment all day long.

Where do you put the unconscious mind ?

Empath Training Manual 2011 is due out soon from Matsuo. Also if anyone is interested in Shamanism ,you may want to take a look at Dragon Gate Sanctuary.

I think this is an indication of your level of understanding and development Continue to soar as the Eagle.

Supermoon came and went . I enjoyed this thread very much. The thread was posted a few hours before the eathquake/tsunami. So the world is different now. Can we each become the change that we wish to see in this world? If not us, then who? If not now, then when? These seem like worn out lines that always go unanswered? I would challenge each bum to do one random act of kindness Today. Is that too much to ask?

I like this. Wisdom and knowledge are 2 different things. I also like your stance about truth. Truth is always so elusive. As elusive as trying to define Tao.

Tonight's moon will be worth a look too.

After looking in twinner's What is Tao? thread, I thought maybe a question from there would fit in here on this thread. Would Western Taoism be similar to Pantheism? Maybe I am not a Taoist in any sense but I may be a Pantheist who practices Taiji, Qigong, and Kung Fu. Maybe i also read some Taoist philosophy.

With this idea of collected conscious, or collective unconscious, or even if we call it cosmic conciousness, My question to this thread is>> We are considering this consciouness to be sentient in it's whole?or no?

We can expect to see some SuperMoon pics on the Cool Pic Thread?

To bring up Thomas Kuhn again as he is the fashionable example here. "It cannot be expected that 2 different scientists will make the same observations viewing the same empirical data/methods. Even if there were agreed on methods of inference and interpretation , scientists will still most likely disagree on the findings." Empirical results cannot be viewed as scientifically sound evidence. I could bring forth scientist after scientist that would agree to this. The real heavy weight scientists whose names we all recognize. So i wouldn't totally disregard empirical results but I certainly wouldn't put too much stock in it either.

clockwise and counter-clockwise rotations? equal number each way?

Your welcome Zerostao.

We can't leave this one behind either.

@zerostao, Does walking in circles contribute to talking in circles? Sometimes I find it hard to follow exactly what you are trying to say. Blasto did suggest that Kuhn does seek to transcend the paradigm. Regardless of physics or metaphysics, preaching is probably not the best way to try and convey the message. Obviously science is not Absolute. It does seem the more reasonable approach.

That is one cool Kangaroo.

ETA??