Rocky Lionmouth

I’m not in priestly training if thats what you mean, i am studying a family style of hei gung kung fu under Sifu, he’s started transmitting how to worship but i cant tell you more of where their spiritual training comes from at the moment, they are southern in origin but came by way of Vietnam to Europe. His ritual training, energy and Feng Shui is solid, but i lack academic insight to trace it and it hasn’t come up yet where he studied, probably with his grandfather for the basics but i cant say if he has a formal rank in priesthood. It’s very basic stuff for me yet. Our primary deity is Guan Sing Dai or Guan Gung, but i know Sifu also worships Guan Yin.

Thats true, and we are primarily a daoist group under Sifu but buddhism is a strong influence in their lineage from way back. For me the incense and wine i offer are more like offering an honored guest something to drink, it’s for him. But more formally if i need to ask for guidance or something important as a supplicant. But as you say, the relationship with the deity the important bit, open heart and empty mind are what builds it i have found.

@flowing hands re the fruit and offerings, you’ve never seen it? I have and i do, i’ve been instructed to offer certain fruit and other things, but my instruction is southern, i don’t know if this might be relevant.

Oh come on Wan, is it Frustratio Daobummeus Vulgaris or are we driving you up the walls again. If nothing else i got your back, don’t dispair.

Most grateful if you would!

I think that the I ching system isn’t organized to be readily analyzed with a strict sequence of causality. I read an article once from a philosophy and mathematics scholar who had come to rest that I ching could be approached as a chaos-generator. That change (iirc of the aberrant kind that the I ching treats) is described within a certain area but the specific position at a certain time isn’t predictable. Now my chaos theory and mathematics understanding is limited by lack of deep study and possibly capacity to understand its intricacies, but as far as observing trigrams and hexagrams and the various sequences they appear in they seem to not be so very linear in how they relate... idk, they sort of ,ake sense but not much. Changey wangy wibbly wobbly. There’s a thread about an approachable description of the 5 Phases in the Daoist forum where user Desmondf did an interesting breakdown meaning the trigrams describe patterns of mental activity. Blew my mind if no one elses at least.

I’m still even trying to actually make sense of the trigrams themselves. Organizationally i mean, it is a tough nut to approach. OnT: I’d say religious practices and the strictly philosophical practices that many seem to want are if not overlapping then intermingling to the point that one practice could be of either camp or belong truly in both. I’ve strayed from philosophical approach long since, i found it hindered me from further understanding by perpetuating a dichotomy that might seem valid but that the closer you get to specific practices and more general developments of realization and understanding seems contraddictory if not completely fabricated. You can extract the juice from a lemon, but Daoism is not a lemon i’m a fraid. 2 cents.

I don’t think its hilarious, rather the opposite. By no means do i wish to disrespect the rules, so i shall edit further.

Going out on a limb and begging your pardon if wrong: iirc those animals are representations of the protectors/gods/stars of their direction as well as the four phenomena mentioned earlier. Black Tortoise is Xuan Wu aka Pak Tai who is Shaoyin, Qin Long has been mentioned, Red Phoenix is Taiyang and the deity i can’t remember, Bak Fu is litterally the White Tiger and Yellow Dragon is the Golden Dragon which is the center of all aka The Great Heavenly Emperor and represents the great equalizer and principle of Taiji, the Supreme Ultimate, to which all direction revert before changing. Tiger and Dragon are Taiyin and Shaoyang but i’m not sure which is which, i do believe the Tiger is considered Taiyin but what do i know?

Nice breakdown Desmond! Thanks, i’ll be reading this a few timesver and see what plops out.

Hmm, that sort of depends how those 4am nights pan out. If you’re walking out of sessions or performances drunk and tired then i agree, but if you feel refreshed and haven’t overindulged in libations or food then i think it could be good cultivation support. Some of my best times producing have been all nighters with good results and i felt energized waking up after little sleep. When i used to do gigs it was strongly dependent on the venue, crowd and collaborators. I learned pretty fast not to stay after hours for ”winding down” though, that stuff was killing my liver 😁 I think frequency, mindset and individual setup plays a pretty big role in how it affects guarding, refining and overall being smart about energy. Btw, sorry for the two-year throwback quote, i thought it could be relevant.

I can’t listen to music when meditating, it throws my stillness off completely. Back in 05 i started sitting daily for a few years and in the beginning i was usin music to support me, but after a hiatus i began sitting with silence and no supports at all and found it had much greater benefit for me. For me music pulls me back out in the world around and my sitting has since i stopped with the music to focus only inward and maintain stillness, like Freeform said music belongs to movement, i wish to move or rest with it. I love music, i make music, i feel unwell if i go without music for a long time but for sitting it definetly ruins stuff and depletes/deviates energy. Plus i’m really picky with what sort of sound and spectrum i enjoy most, just listening with a thin low end or misaligned equalization starts my gears grinding. I remember once i was at hour long meditation with this pretty faar-out teacher and he insisted on playing some really annoying, treble-loud mixed hindu chanting backing tracks that set my mind ablaze. I could not reach myself. To top it off he’d monitor us for slacking off so as soon as someones head started dipping or back slouching he’d ring these two cymbal-chimes that had a VERY penetrating and carrying frequency. It was one of the worst sessions i’ve had sitting, i couldn’t stop hoping for it to be over, the boombox to crap out, the teacher having a meltdown, ANYTHING really to get me out of that place. Seeing as i was young and had less self esteem i felt i should stay and endure it so nobody would think i wasn’t up for these advanced lessons... ha! Ridiculus, today i would have left within ten minutes. Even worse when i was asked how i meditate usually i said two half hour sessions daily and everybody laughed and called me an ”expert”, then they all sat through this horror with blissful faces and claimed they were refreshed and destressed after. I was edgy and depleted for days after Apparently this group operated on far more advanced levels than i ever will, i enjoy meditating on the streets with heavy traffic while waiting for a bus, but that tinny hindu record he had was just torture. It would not be shut out.

I have no idea who ”we” are or should regard worship of the Taoist Gods, but for myself i regard it with respect and curiosity. My own worship of Guan Sing Tai is under instruction and development trough Sifu so i regard that with comfort, serenity and more curiosity. In beginning it i chose to accept what would come from it and be sincere. I regard his effigy as if it were him and i pay my respects and beg forgiveness and patience when i see his house or altar improperly set up. For me Guan Sing Tai, Pak Tai and the Gods are what they are, i treat them with honesty and respect because i know they would not ever treat me without any consideration. I cant say exactly how or what they are, embodiment of principles, ascended immortals, supernatural or natural beings or whatever, it’s not perhaps so important to classify them or something when they can in fact be interacted with and it is possible to build a sort of relationship through worship. Ask me again in ten or twenty years?

Sifu is native cantonese speaker and he’s always said Yam-yong, except for when he says it in Mandarin by way of English and the he pronounces it Yim-Yan and the final g is almost silent. However the times i’ve witnessed him speak with strangers in chinese young folks have trouble understanding his dialect and he expresses himself in a pretty old fashioned way apparently, kids today huh?

Amentjena! Bra där, bra. Akta dig för galningarna, vi är ett helt gäng såna här.

True that.

I just wish i’d realized sooner that the basics and those ephasizing the importance of them actually knew what they were doing, instead of fantasizing about the advanced practices. I know today that speaking about these thing with people IRL is going to just be a way to alienate us both. To have a few people to discuss with would be great, i have two, which is enough. Energetic practices are not for everyone, the whole concept of actually shedding expectations and judgement to become intimate with what is real and so close at hand that it’s imperceptible almost is going to be hard to share with someone. Despite the internet this is a lonely road, and growing accustomed to self-sufficency should come earlier. People within and without will look at me funny, like i know deep inside already i should shun them. I’d tell myself: If someone says ”this is highly advanced” you should distrust them. If someone offers praise you should shut your ears and walk away. Only listen to the source and resonate with it. There is no prize, no acceptance, no destination of manifest truth so quit believing it will feel like you’ve arrived one day and just keep going, enjoy life in actuality. Peace

Why? ”Also my secret.” To quote a young Jackie Chan in a tailed version of a beatles-mop in the movie ”Snake and Crane Arts of Shaolin”, in which he also demonstrates Pheonix Eye Fist technique by first flipping this big brawler guy the bird. English dubbed version is great, the Ting Brothers are a group of hilarious side-story villains you simply mustn’t miss!

Good advice this. Keep lead out of reach at all times. Also don’t eat mercury or cinnabar. Mercury is only useful to ingest if you have advanced syphilis and even then it’ll drive you just as mad as the syphilis would, but you’ll have less discomfort meanwhile. And then you die.

Finally, someone acknowledges the truth. Hats make the man. Hats contain the magic and is the only credential you need. Even back in the prohibition era it was known: ”if a guy aint got a lid he aint worth talking about”. The hats.

I’m not being mean or cruel mind you, bu I think its a little tragic to watch. For me the tai chi clips with ”secrets” revealed say it all, it’s hard to put in words but this man seems lost between utter crass drive and complete fantasy, his energy is scattering and whisking about aimlessly and his feet tell of a great dishonesty, but he doesnt seem to know.

Pretty sure he’s still a member on here in spite of TDB being on his celestial shitlist. IIRC there’s been quite some controversy around the man previously, flamoffs, minions, campaigning and trolling.

Dont poke the bear lest you end up befouling the Blue Cupboard and we have to wade through frightening amounts of oddities.

Cheers macker, you the bawse!