Marblehead

The only one I found is here: http://www.amazinggracehk.com/666033/Lao+Tzu+statue.html Be well!

It appears to me that you really want to talk about the nature of the human animal. I suppose one of us should start a thread on the subject. Be well!

Hi Vajrahridaya, The following is the definition of "Tzu-Jan" presented by Dr. Wayne L. Wang in his translation of the Tao Te Ching titled "Dynamic Tao": Tzu-Jan is commonly translated as "nature". It is, however, not the nature of the physical world, but is the spiritual naturalness, Tzu-Jan is the primordial unperturbed process of self-development. It is the state of Oneness. Self-So. Spontaneity. Naturally so. With no apparent reason. Be well!

Hi Vajrahridaya, The term natural becomes a term more often than not that excuses one's ability to investigate deeper. Nature is dependently originated. Most nature comes from the desire for survival which emanates from the fear of death, based upon identification with the body and the idea that we were born, and we will age and die. Your conclusion lacks investigation in my opinion. This might make your ego angry... hearing this. It might get defensive. You totally misunderstood what I said. Please read it again. Try to think beyond the concept of man's nature or the nature of any living organism and into the natural processes of the universe. Be well!

Hi Little1, That was a good post. Thanks for sharing it with us. I am in general agreement with it. Be well! Hi Vajrahridaya, We are in general agreement on this one. Every time I observe to gain understanding I am seeking (to gain knowledge). The point is, we need to know when to stop and allow this new information to become established in our mind. Indeed, we are not told to remove all desires. That would be unnatural. But we are told to lessen them so we can be more at peace with our Self. Be well!

I like that word you just created: dis-en-hardened. Is that the same as 'lighten up'? I do agree with you though. Grasping (for anything) is not good. I am told that I should lessen my desires, lessen my ego, and stop my freaking seeking. I do prefer the word 'awareness' over 'realization' though. Be well! I like what you said there above Lucky7. Be well!

Nope. I didn't have one. I must have missed the point. Oh well. Be well!

Funny. You made me think the question: Why does Buddhism say that they have to loose their ego if there is no ego in the first place? Isn't that called a contradiction? Be well!

But then in Taoism this 'infinite potentiality' is called Mystery. Yes, we Taoists have that. But, lucky we Taoists, we also have the Manifest. The real, concrete, physical world. We get to run and play and smell the roses and break each others' heart and all kinds of really neat things. Poor Buddhists. Locked up in the Mystery, eternally 'infinite potentiality' but never manifesting. Kinda' like a chicken egg that never cracks open to give life. Oh well. Be well!

Hi Soundhunter, There is one form of meditation some Taoists get involved in that can be dangerous. It is a form of very deep meditation similar to what some of the Native Americans call a Spirit Quest. Chances are you will never incounter this on your own so I wouldn't worry about it. Those who do learn about it will probably already have a teacher/guide who will assist with the practice. No, I do not have first hand info on this but it is what I have been told by someone who I considered knowledgeable enough to speak about it. Be well!

Okay. Fun and games time. Actually Taoism goes back 4 million years and was founded in Africa by Lao Tzu's mother. (She lived a very long time.) We figure everything out, and we transcend the figure who tries to configure. Well, since there are seventeen different schools of Buddhism I would like to suggest that even though you may have figured everything out not one agrees with any of the others. (Witness some of the Buddhist discussions here during the past three weeks.) So y'all go ahead and talk about death and suffering and we Taoists will talk about living this manifest life in the most joyous and fruitful way we know how. And when death does come knocking it better come fully armed because we are going to fight all the way. Anyhow. What are we supposed to be talking about. Oh, yeah, who is Lord/God in the TTC. There isn't one. To paraphrase: Man follows earth, Earth follows heaven, Heaven follows Tao, And Tao follows Tzujan (Its own naturalness). Be well!

Hi Erdrickgr. I hope I don't come off sounding rude but I don't agree with the quote above. Yes, for those who have teachers available and who can afford the cost, sure, get a teacher. But I don't see why a teacher is absolutely necessary because Tao is already in each and every one of us. The key is in learning how to access this (please excuse this word) power. I have said this many times before and I will say it here now: The answers to all our questions lie within. We each must learn how to access this information. The means of doing this will vary greatly between individuals. Some may never find the way because their mind is cluttered with so much trash that they will never reach the innermost of their being. Now, if you are interested in the arts then I would say Yes, find a teacher. But if your search is for inner peace and contentment then, as I suggested, the answers are within, out task is to find the way to the knowledge. Be well!

Hi Tao99, Interesting perspective. I would like to ask a question though. (Let's say you are that football player.) Weren't you really THAT at that point in time? In my mind we are always 100% what we are at any given point in time. The fact that years later we become something else doesn't really change the fact that we were such and such 20 years ago does it? Be well!

Oh My Goodness!! We Taoists were pointing at the moon before any Buddhist understood that there really was a moon. Yes, I confess. We Taoists are very literally-minded folks. See what alll you have added to such a simple concept? I was only pointing at the moon and here you are talking about death and suffering and transcending death (which no one can do) and facing a mystery and cultivation. To your last paragraph, we Taoists do that too, but not when we are supposed to be looking at the moon. Be well!

Yes Dear. You are wrong. To your first paragraph we Taoists don't waste our time on such silliness. When a Taoist point to the moon that is his/her only intention. No hidden agenda. We simply say, "There is the moon." If we wanted to talk about Mars we would point to Mars and make comment. Life is really very simple when you don't add your illusions and delusions to it. Be well!

Well, when I point to the moon and say, "Look at the beautiful moon." there is normally only one moon in the sky. If you look at my finger instead that's your problem, not mine. Be well!

I like my ego too. Be well!

I wasn't referring to you Froggie. I was referring to anyone who would believe everything they saw in the video. Be well!

That's wu wei, I guess. There is a time to talk and there is a time to shut up. Be well!

I will make no comment as I do not wish to offend anyone. Be well!

Hi Carson, I'm with you. I do love a good discussion though. Be well!

Hi Erdrickgr, Good points and questions. Yes, if one views religious Taoism one will find many gods. That is the reason I stopped my search into religious Taoism early on with the path I had found for myself. I cannot answer any of your questions regarding the religion - the answers will have to come from someone who knows about that aspect of Taoism. Yes, I consider myself to be an Atheist. Be well!

Hi SlackerBee, Welcome! May you enjoy your time here. But you really live in Norway, right? Be well!

Hehehe. I can tell by some of your posts that you are really a Taoist. Very Taoist, they are. From your post above: Rather, those who have found it haven't found a way to communicate it directly into other people's minds without any effort on their part. That is a Taoist realization. It is something that cannot be done therefore a Taoist teaches through example and keeps his mouth shut. (No, we can't describe Tao but we can talk about a few of its characteristics.) Be well! I actually agree with this for those who find that it works for them. Be well!

Yep. We do need to get rid of the crap now and again. Both physically and mentally. Learn to unlearn. Be well!