Iyoiyo

"Etching the way," I like this idea.

What is and is not does not depend on what you, I, or anyone says. I did not mean to claim any detailed knowledge of the Taoist religious sects. Of course I know there are many, that they're complicated, and full well that I don't understand their workings. However, this does not perturb me in the least. I neither want nor need to know anything about them . I merely wanted to say that there is no patent on meanings or names.

A comment to this first ... apologies in advance for the critical tone, but to say Taoism is not a religion is an uneducated view.

 

Taoism is BOTH a religion AND a philosophy. Which came first? Which is more Taoist than the other? Fools questions really. Taoism arose out of the indigenous shamanic culture of China, thus, without being an organised religion per say, Taoist roots are religious in nature.

 

This is a case of overlapping definition. In order to discuss things with others I must use words, Taoism is one, and different people mean different things by it. Knowing this makes me leery of talking or writing at all, but I inevitably succumb to my desire to explain.

The Tao is like a guy I saw in the grocery store a bunch of times, and later learned had a name: Steve. Steve is not what that person is, but that is what others call him. So, when I want to talk about Steve I use the name, instead of attempting to describe his every feature. The only reason I use the words "Tao" and "Taoism" is because the body of writing labeled as Taoist describes something that I wish to talk with others about.

My concept of taoism or "the tao" is based around something which is inherently possible to surround in rite or ceremony, therefore there can be no taoist religion, by definition ( of the word religion; which requires both a god, or gods, as well as structure).

And concerning the roots of "taoism," from my place I see that Taoism has it's roots in all facets of reality, it does not root from any one religion, any one continent, or any one people. If someone believes this to be the case, then we are clearly talking about two different concepts with the same name, again.

One analogy I have to myself is that the Tao is the mathematics of spirituality. I do not mean that it can be parsed out and understood through formulae. What I mean is that independent agents, unaware of each other, are capable of deriving the same a priori "conclusions."

The short answer is here: Taoism does not believe in anything, certainly not in the devil. it is not a religion.

Evil does not exist independent from humanity, in a sense it does not exist at all.

Also, should you continue to plumb the depths of Christianity you may want to consider that the Devil can not be the source of Christian evil . . . because God created him, and everything else. God either created evil, or he does not exist Q.E.D. This is a very old argument, but one that no theology has succeeded in resolving.

Ah, there are quite a few really, but I'm too tired to type them now. Perhaps tomorrow.

Hello Bums, I just wrote this for myself, but perhaps someone else might enjoy reading it.

In argument, people are very childish. Unable to accept the consequences of admitting fallibility they will argue on behalf of falsehood rather than confront the truth. If certain truths are an obstacle to their victory, they are mostly left unmentioned. This is a mistake. It is not most important to be right individually, what's important is arriving at the truth of the situation. By ignoring information to preserve intellectual "victory," the virtue of communication, and even thought, is destroyed. It is cheating. If one cheats on a test, receiving a high mark instead of a low one, it does not mean that one is intelligent. It's like renting a house, inviting your relatives over, and pretending that you own it. Winning an argument by deceit it is no victory at all: If anything, it is a betrayal of oneself.

Having established that thought, I'll move a little closer to my main topic: ownership. Ownership of what? Ownership of things.

How is ownership established? Who forges the little chain between someone and something, and says "there, that's yours"? It's a mystery, isn't it? All things that are owned by somebody were, at one point or in some form, things that belonged to nobody. What changed? If I pocket a beach pebble, what makes it mine? I say, nothing. The only thing connecting possessions and the people who "possess" them, is that the possessors want to possess the possessions. But wanting something to be true does not make it so. Just as it's detrimental to believe oneself proficient at roulette (when that is clearly impossible), it is also harmful to deceive oneself in other ways. You will, so to speak, lose your fortune. If you disagree, ask yourself: have I any proof to the contrary? Or is the idea too threatening to my lifestyle, to my concept of the world, for me to seriously consider?

It may be easier to think on this issue of "ownership" by narrowing the scope to simply "land ownership". Because all physical possessions are derived from the land, if we can resolve the issue of ownership with respect to the Earth itself the entire issue will be solved. Before we decide if Bill stole Bob's gold, we must establish that Bob owned the gold to begin with. And where did he get it? He took it from the Earth.

Who owns the Earth? Certainly there are many nations, and they seem to own the Earth. But, do they? No. They want to. They have the globe all parcelled up. Strong countries are even capable of things like borders, states, and fighting off those who would encroach on their "territory." But does that make the land theirs? No. If I steal a cupcake from a toddler, is that mine? Well, in a sense it is, I can do whatever I want with it. But that is only because of my brute strength, that is not because I own it.

The explorers of history were megalomaniacs. Who looks out on a new land and thinks, "well, I guess this is mine now, I saw it first. I want it."? How absurd. Every new place we go, every old place for that matter, has existed for an age, and will remain for ages to come. What flimsy logic can make the land ours? Why doesn't it belong to the dandelions or the toads? Were I to stumble on the proverbial pie on the windowsill, I wouldn't think it was mine. What else is the globe besides such a pie?

As usual I have become very sidetracked. Fear not though, this last paragraph contains the original motive behind all this exposition. What I started out to say, is that ideas are no different than places. Coming up with an idea and claiming it for one's own is just as silly as discovering a wonderful new continent and, deciding that because it's new to you it must be new to everybody, claiming it for yourself. In reality, the world exists together with mankind, but there is no reason to think it belongs to us. When we think up a new idea, we are not creating that idea, we are simply seeing it for the first time. Just because it is out of sight does not mean that something does not exist. All places in the universe exist. If one had the time and means, they could all be visited. It is the same for the world of ideas. They all exist, but many have not been visited.

A mind can never fully conceive itself. The ebb and flow of your subconscious is beyond common fathom. Whether reality is an illogical bunch of choices, and cause and effect, it will never by a standard be relevant to you.

 

Logically speaking, cause and effect is the only logical way, but it will never matter. The average mind has difficulty watching their conscious mind, let alone the in fathomable complexity of the ten-thousand half-thoughts processing through the mind-below-the-mind

This is an awesome response.

Hello all, this is a long shot, but I figured I'd give it a try. I'm graduating college in a few days, but the downside is that I will be moving away from my wonderful Kung Fu teacher, (http://www.thelittledojo.com/fook-yueng if you're curious about the style) and that is very disappointing. I'll be moving back to my home town in Juneau Alaska which, to my knowledge, does not house any established Chinese martial arts schools at all. So, I was wondering if any bums have personal martial connections in Juneau who might be willing to take on a student. Any help is appreciated.

It sure is confusing, but I often think the same thing.

Answering to all of those that i upset with my previous post:

 

- I'm sorry, it's called first phase, denial.

Wishful thinking will get us nowhere...

 

- If you want some facts, go and speak with physicians, with doctors.

For example, I see it myself, as I work in a pharmacy.

Many old men seem to have alot more vitality that many young men.

It's a sad thing to see.

And it gets worse, as time goes by.

- Many young men resort to Viagra and other pills to get a decent erection.

In young men today you can see alot of meat, and a tiny spark of energy...

You want numbers? Age? Look up the internet. Check up the high rate in onchological (cancer) type diseases. It's just the tip of the iceberg.

Still,I have no intention to prove anything, just know some facts, from what I see everyday, that's all...

 

- I remember my uncles, aunts, as I was little... they had a physical consistency that I don't see it today anymore.

The food is much less nutricious now, we move our bodies alot less, the electomagnetic smog is at an unprecedented rate. Do you really believe these go without consequences to our biology? The most sensitive part of our biology is our fertility... There are many factors that need be respected if you still want to keep this healthy.

It's not just erections. It's also the consistency of the sperm, and these have a direct influence on your mental health, your emotional health, your social health, and your sense of well being. So no, i don't think talking about it is overrated. I'm not interested in opinions either... Facts, they save time.

 

And, Guy, anybody ever tell you what happens to athletes after their career is over? Just met a handball national player yesterday at the hospital: she was replacing her knee with a metal one. Oh she had no problems whatsoever when she played... But with age, the abuses tend to come out. Don't get me started on martial artists, the story is even more sad...

 

What world are you living in?

 

And, I don't care if I sound harsh, I have nothing against you, I don't know you.

I admit I have a really big personal problem: little tolerance for stupidity...

 

L1

 

 

@Michael, so i was only half-joking.

...Emphasizing now, as a reaction to the reaction

Additionally, if you truly have little tolerance for stupidity, you could at least learn how to spell and write proper sentences. Perhaps English is your second language. In that case I would be able to overlook quite a lot. Simply because you work in a pharmacy, see people, and have opinions, does not make you an authority on anything: think things through a bit before you start giving out advice. Have you considered that somebody might read something you wrote, misinterpret it (or not) and suffer negative consequences? I have been rash in saying this, but I felt that I had to.

Well, I guess it won't be long before our life spans are down to about 20 years. According to this human degeneration idea my grandchildren might even die before I do . . . right.

It's not usually appropriate to say that something just plain wrong, but every once in a blue moon we get something like this:

Michael,

 

somehow yesterday's 16 year olds are not nowadays 16 year olds

they don't make them how they used to hehe

they have to work hard to achieve the same level you had at the same age (without doing anything)

it's called de-generation, and it's the current plague of humanity

every son is half his father's strength, and a quarter of his grandfather's

same goes for girls

 

 

L1

It makes absolutely no sense, and is not true. If this was an attempted metaphor and physical strength was not actually in question then it would have been wiser to make that more obvious.

I will shortly return to my home in south east Alaska (no more undegraduate study for me!). I hope I can start a garden, but it will really depend on how far the season has progressed by the time I arrive. We really need to plant at the right time in that region (because the summer is so short) or else the plants will not mature before they die. It might be too late to start planting. Although, perhaps I can help my mother with her garden .

Building sensitivity is something that comes slowly, at least to me and my fellow students. I think the best way to improve is to simply practice push hands drills with a variety of partners until you are able to sense pressure easily.

I'm just curious about what you'd call someone or something that likes to do things just to make others suffer? No reason other than to enjoy the suffering of others

And what would you call someone who likes to help others without having anything to gain from it?

I venture that nobody likes to do things just to make others suffer. It might look that way, but there are other reasons.

Evil doesn't exist

So then, why did you open it?

 

Secondly you assume that the world you currently experience is not your own creation. But what if it is? Wouldn't it mean that the absence of people with powers is nothing more than your own intent and proves nothing at all? All your logic depends on the idea that the world exists objectively and independently.

 

However, if you truly believe that the world exists objectively and independently, how would psychic powers even work? By what means? Wouldn't the world work by its own rules then? This goes back to our sincerity. If you sincerely believe in psychic powers you cannot also believe that the world is objective and independent of your mind and being.

 

You have to decide what is it you really want and how seriously do you want it. Most people who talk about wanting psychic powers are deceiving themselves in a very profound way.

You are, of course, completely correct. However, I put aside the possibility that this existence is my own creation at least while writing on message boards. Otherwise it becomes pretty difficult to phrase ideas at all, doesn't it?

I'm curious to see how power seekers can reconcile their quests with concepts of Wu Wei. All I seem to hear about is striving, striving, and more striving.

The electric car is not comparable. People from all places, at all times, have wished for and sought after psychic power. Are we to believe that over the millennia not one single solid, documentable tradition or example has come forth? I'm not trying to make anybody mad, but just think about this issue honestly. There would be no way to suppress the support for these kinds of abilities should they actually happen to exist.

I know supporters don't want to hear this, but if psychic powers were documentable in the least then the whole world would know about it. It would not be a secret. Large portions of the population would spend their lives practicing. Before responding in objection, think about the argument and see if it actually makes any sense.

I wouldn't say it's perfect, but I normally go for a walk and then stretch afterwards, after breakfast.

I too think the preoccupation with "powers" on this board is really strange, although it may or may not be cult like. Whenever I see one of these posts on how to shoot fire out of your eyes, or something like that, I always think of the same story. I've posted it before, and I'll post it again now.

One day two students were walking along together, and they began to talk of their masters. Both masters were famous and respected men whom people journeyed many miles to consult. Eventually they came to comparing the masters. One student said, "my master must be the most amazing, I've heard he can float above the ground, he can write in the air with a brush, and characters will appear on the paper hundreds of feet away!" The second student agreed that this was, indeed, amazing. The first student continued, "what can your master do?"

"My master can also perform amazing feats," spoke the second student, "when he's tired, he sleeps, and when he is hungry, he eats."

I was really glad to see this post, it's an easy idea to lose sight of.

I hardly know where to start on this post, but let me start off with examining what a pushup accomplishes. During a pushup, lets just stick to the standard-ish kind for now, you push up from the ground using your shoulders, triceps, and chest while keeping your body straight and static (which requires back, core, and leg muscle), then you come back down to the initial position. Forearm muscles are also recruited to maintain stability throughout the motion. Pushups are widely regarded as an effective comprehensive exercise and enjoy even greater popularity since they require no equipment.

You say, "There is no fighting or labor activity that mimics what pushups build in you (that I can think of)." Perhaps you have not been thinking hard enough? Any action which involves pushing, like a push or a punch, will be improved by pushups. This is because the muscles you use to push things are developed by pushing on things, like in a pushup! It doesn't get much simpler than that. To this you say, "If you are going to hit someone, you practice hitting things." That's true, but that practice does not exclude other types of exercise. In fact, purely punching things for exercise is a good way to hurt yourself. There's a good reason that boxers don't do it. The three bows (that's what we call them in my school) are a good source of pushing power of course. But somebody with upper body strength and the bows together will be more capable than someone using just one or the other.

There's a reason that martial artists and armies across the globe perform pushups. And no, it's not because they're stupid, it's because pushups are effective. True, after doing a lot of pushups one will find it hard to throw fast punches. But nobody does pushups before a fight, they do them to make the muscles tired on purpose . . . so that they'll be less tired performing similar actions in the future. That's what exercise is for, in a narrow definition anyway.

Even if, somehow, all the things I've said so far are completely wrong, there are still reasons to do pushups. One does not exercise only specific muscles. Why? Because that creates imbalance. Body strength must be in balance with itself to maintain optimum health. The consequences of muscular imbalance include joint tension and poor posture, which in turn can lead to more severe injuries later in life.

So, that was that, I hope it was somewhat informative.