liminal_luke

Oh sorry. I was actually pulling from several different posts, so the first and second quotes are totally unrelated. Here`s some greater context for that second quote. (Perhaps it`s just supposed to be comedy, and we`re not supposed to believe he believes it?) ........................................................................................................ Tomorrow there is a women’s march, like the one in Washington DC. I support women marching. As the fat acceptance movement’s most prominent critic, I’m well aware of how “body positivity” has resulted in an increase in the number of obese women in America. Anything that involves a bit of exercise for our sisters and moms is alright by me! But I hope they bring some men along to keep them on course. I don’t mean to be rude, but it’s well established in the research literature that men have far better spacial awareness and sense of direction than girls. Can you imagine 50,000 hairy, overweight feminists wandering, hopelessly lost around downtown Seattle, like a drunk Sasquatch convention? Have you noticed these armpit hair-braiding west coast femsquatches spell “women” with an X? W-O-M-X-N. Is the X silent? How do you pronounce that? It’s like “LATIN-X”. Is it Lat-tinks? Sounds like a new paraplegic cholo X-Men character who was shocked he didn’t have to be jumped into the group. Too bad that after today’s inauguration, he has to go back! I always there was feminist biology and feminist history, I didn’t know we had feminist spelling! This is what always happens ladies and gentlemen, a women’s march becomes instead a chance, quote, “to acknowledge the impact of discrimination based not only on gender but also race, sexual orientation, nationality, faith, class, disability and body odor.” Why can’t it just be a women’s march? The same thing has happened in Washington DC, where the women’s march has become a mess of identity politics with black women lecturing their white comrades and every other identity jockeying for power in the left’s grotesque minority war Hunger Games. Or, in case of feminists, Hungry Games. My theory is that women simply can’t get along with each other or work well together. Call it intrasexual competition or whatever, but the results are obvious. I’ll quote my favorite twentieth-century philosophy, Al Bundy: “Don’t try to understand women, women understand women, and they hate each other.” Or, in other words, girls are retards. Milo Yiannopoulos

OK, I`ll bite. Perhaps surprisingly, we do have some areas of agreement. And some less surprising areas of disagreement. He doesn`t like the new Netflix show Dear White People and neither do I. I dunno. Maybe I`d feel differently if I were black? I tried to watch it and just couldn`t get past the pervasive moral scold vibe. He says that "black people can be racist too." True. Quote: I do recognize it isn’t your fault that you happen to share a gender, one of the actual two genders, with batshit crazy, mean-spirited, man-hating, and deeply unhappy feminist harpies. Here he`s being oversimplistic (and also kinda mean). I`m no expert on the biology of transexuality, but I think gender is a more complicated subject than the "actual two genders" phrase implies. What about intersex people? Some people are born with both male and female genitalia or ambiguous genitalia. Perhaps more common are those whose internal physiology (hormones?) are seemingly at odds with their physical appearance. Quote: Or, in other words, girls are retards. Disagree. There`s a phrase he uses (I think it was him) that I found insightful and apt: virtue signaling. I`d never heard of this before, but I think it refers to a real phenomenon and is a keen observation. I generally agree with Milo about free speech. So anyway, not everything he says is wrong. At least I don`t think so. A great deal of what he says is offensive though -- even when he`s right.

Ok, I get how you could read me like that. Thanks for explaining. In my defense, I think I do a passable job of treating people as individuals. There are conservatives here whose opinions I hold in high esteem and those I don`t. There are also liberals here whose opinions I hold in high esteem and those I don`t. The tone of these kind of internet debates can often get ugly. I do try -- not always successfully, I`m realizing -- not to contribute to the muck.

Agreed. Left-wing frothiness, particularly in the wake of the election, reached a really shocking pitch. The conservative frothiness I`m referring to is an admittedly more muted phenomenon. MooNiNite recently posted a video about Milo. I hadn`t heard of him before, but I looked him up and have been reading his posts at Breitbart. Now, he`s not as frothy as the people who are protesting his Dangerous Faggot tour, I`ll grant you that. But still....well, here`s a brief sample of his writing: In fact I’m considered so dangerous that today, January 20th, I am the second most dangerous man in America. Second only to Daddy, who has taken office today. That’s right, social justice losers! Donald Trump is your president now and there’s nothing you can do about it. A bit on the frothy side, imo.

If you`d like to explain it to me, I`m listening.

Brian, Your point that leftwing protesters are "frothy" is well-taken and one that I have already acknowledged in my reply to Aetherous. Like I say, it`s not hard to find examples of left wing foolishness. All I`m saying, is that there`s also conservative frothiness. Do you disagree?

Please understand, WuDao. What I said about the vast majority of Trump supporters wasn`t such an insult. I said that the vast majority of Trump supporters would not independently come to the same sophisticated analysis that RC did. That`s also true of the vast majority of people who don`t like Trump. You might have noticed that I also said that I myself would not have come to that conclusion. In my assessment RC is a very astute thinker. Few people can match her, Democrat or Republican. To say that the "vast majority" of any group of people are not going to independently arrive at her level of insight isn`t a great insult, it`s just the truth.

We disagree, Aetherous. I see conservatives repeating his losers comment right here on Taobums in a way that seems pretty frothy to me. RC might have been right when she said Trump stooped to a spit-waddish name calling level for a specific purpose; I do not believe that most of his supporters who parrot the language share the same sophistication.

Ah, I dunno. You may be even-tempered Aetherous, but the same can`t be say for many of your conservative companions. For the record, I`m equally critical of leftist foolishness -- of which there is plenty.

Some further thoughts... It`s not just terrorists (losers, if you prefer) that listen to Trump. His supporters also listen to the speech in which he spit-waddishly calls them losers. You posit that the level of Trump`s thinking is well above the level of his discourse, that he`s purposely speaking in a simplistic and emotionally inflamed way for some strategic purpose. That`s a sophisticated analysis on your part (perhaps influenced by your business expertise?), and not one that the vast majority of Trump supporters would come to on their own. Most people, including me, assume that Trump is talking on a spit waddish level because he himself functions at a spit waddish level. Occam`s razor and all that. Like a Starbuck`s barista frothing milk for a cappuccino, President Trump froths the more savage passions of his conservative base. Perhaps this increases his support; it certainly seems to around here. It also has the effect of bringing the whole country down to a more spit waddish level. Not a good thing, in my opinion.

RC, You may be right. Like I say, I have an almost gut-level negative reaction to that kind of talk. But then again, it`s not really my reaction that matters. If it really is a well thought out strategy and it works, well, more power to him. LL

You`re probably right WuDao. I suffer from a bad case of Western Do-itis and have a hard time gently leaving anything alone, especially my "self." What you say though...probably right. Warm regards as well LL

Maybe I misunderstand but... I think that the people who experience "no-self" also have a really solid sense of who they are as particular individual people. The contradiction between "no-self" and "strong-self" is only an apparent one. And no it doesn`t make sense how both could be true at the same time. That`s OK though, because we live in a paradoxical universe: nothing true ever makes sense, and nothing that makes sense is ever true. The tao that can be told is not the eternal tao. There`s not really a conflict between developing the self and dissolving the self. Psychological therapies seem to aim towards building the self up while some mystical traditions seem to aim at tearing it down. I believe we have to do both.

Now, when someone thanks me, my computer alerts me with a little ding. If I happen to be on another page, a little notice appears at the bottom of my page alerting me to the activity. That`s nice but I think we can take it further. I think it should be like at a casino: multiple thanks should be like hitting the jackpot. Lets add flashing lights, celebratory jingles, the sound of thousands of coins coming down the chute.

If you appreciate Taomeow`s clarity now, you oughta of seen it before the edit. Even better!

That`s too bad. Imagine how awesome it would be if Marblehead was exactly like that. After all these years, I have this one impression of him in my mind and it turns out to be stunningly, stupefyingly wrong. Marblehead comes out from behind his fishpond or wherever, and says "fooled ya!"

It`s not like I really need another way of annoying people, but I`d love to be able to add differential calculus to my mental torture toolbox. Very cool.

I agree that meeting increasing violence with increased security seems a rational response. It`s unfortunate that much of our culture sees even just having feelings -- nevermind their open expression -- as a sign of weakness. That attitude has led to so much needless suffering. To me it`s just the opposite. To be in touch with one`s feelings and willing to appropriately and forcefully express them is a great strength. There`s power in emotional sensitivity.

The people who call what fear and anger? People respond in all sorts of ways to terrorist attacks. Some respond in conscious ways and others respond in ways that are distorted by unacknowledged emotion. Note that I`m not saying that people who "see the problem of terrorism" necessarily belong in the later camp.

Agreed. And I`d add that it`s unacknowledged feeling that largely keeps people from being able to take rational action. It`s crucial that we acknowledge and express our sadness, our grief, our rage. Most of us will feel those things; it`s only human to do so. But we don`t want to act out of a rageful trance. If we give ourselves space to deal with whatever feelings come up, the emotional storm will pass, our tears will dry, and we`ll do the right thing -- whatever that may be.

Some further thoughts on the Monk-Lite approach.... Monk-lite is not for ascetics. It`s important to balance austerity with indulgence, to consider how to nourish the five senses with pleasurable experiences. You could get a massage, soak in a jacuzzi, float in an isolation tank. Retreatants might spend time at a museum looking in a particularly contemplative way at favorite works of art. You might eat foods that are not only healthy but also delicious. This is in stark contrast to the usual no-pain, no-gain way of the weekend (spiritual) warrior. Our culture tends to be big on achievement; we`re all trying to "improve" and become more than we are. It`s easy to bring this competitive mentality to our spiritual pursuits. The monk-lite approach is all about harnessing the power of gentleness, being kind to ourselves, in order to do something radically different. Monk-lite retreats might sound like wimpy versions of the more hardcore meditation retreats, but they can be just as powerfully transformative, and sometimes more so. There is great potency in letting go of our more-is-better compulsivity and settling into something easy and appropriate to where we are in the moment.

Lots of great ideas here already. How you spend your monk weekend very much depends on what kind of monk you are. I`m on the lazy side so I prefer a monk-lite experience. Advanced practitioners might benefit from sunrise prostrations and a rigorous meditation schedule, but there`s a transformational magic that comes from making small easy shifts too. Some ideas... * A weekend without motorized transportation. Stay home or walk everywhere you go. * A weekend without TaoBums. Or for the really daring, without any screens. No TV, no computer. * Wanna dial it up a notch? Ditch the phone * Still not extreme enough for you? Do the weekend in silence. Can be a planned silence with other people. I`ve been at so-called silent retreats where talking was allowed for the purpose of daily chores. For a more complete silent experience, solitude is best. * Consider the location. Nature is good. You could rent a house in the beach or mountains. If that`s too upscale, there`s always tent camping. * Decide how you feel about books, writing. When I was doing my silent retreat reading was forbidden. The idea, I think, was that it would distract from meditative focus. I get how that cound be, and also think reading and writing might make a nice focus for a monk-lite retreat. It all depends what kind of monk you want to be. * Most monks do without alcohol and pot. (Hey, don`t look at me -- I didn`t make the rules.) * On the other hand, I can imagine a couples monk-weekend with some planned sex, massage, etc. That`s probably not the kind of weekend you had in mind, but just sayin`. * A monk weekend might be a good time to kickstart a special healthy diet. Opinions vary on what makes a healthy diet, let alone a spiritual one, so I won`t advise on particulars. If there`s a particular food, or type of food, that you regularly eat and would like to experiment with doing out, now`s the time. * Give some thought to "reentry." How do you want to bring your monk experience back into your normal life. Are there aspects of what you did during the weekend that you`d like to make a regular part of your routine? Could you schedule a monk-fifteen minutes daily? What insights did you have during the weekend that you want to take with you when you go?

“What are your fees?" inquired Guyal cautiously. "I respond to three questions," stated the augur. "For twenty terces I phrase the answer in clear and actionable language; for ten I use the language of cant, which occasionally admits of ambiguity; for five, I speak a parable which you must interpret as you will; and for one terce, I babble in an unknown tongue.” ― Jack Vance, Tales of the Dying Earth

To lie habitually, as a way of life, is to lose contact with the unconscious. It is like taking sleeping pills, which confer sleep but blot out dreaming. The unconscious wants truth. It ceases to speak to those who want something else. Adrienne Rich

I know your intentions are good, Aetherous, but I think sometimes the good fight can change us in ways we don`t expect and wouldn`t of wanted. Part of the beauty of America is that everybody is allowed to be an idiot -- even me. I hope that never changes.