DentyDao

Hern,

 

I see. Again, I haven't read through all of what you wrote, but would just like to say I don't think I can add much more to the discussion. If people aren't impressed with David or my knowledge about David, then that is really their issue to work out.

 

I will say that David is Tu Di disciple of Wang Liping. They have lived together, and David studies with him year round in China. I and others among David's students have received closed door training with Liping through David. So, for those who know something, there's not much more to say really.

 

The website is a work in progress, so maybe those who created it will add more info in future.

 

Cheers, S

Hi Hern,

 

You seem upset. I didn't read much of your letter to be honest, but, as you may have noticed, I've kind of done the forum thing and have chosen to essentially move on. I'm not infallible, so your welcome to whatever conclusions you choose to come to. From the tone of your letter it sounds like you're not all that impressed with what I wrote. That suits me just fine.

 

Cheers, S

You guys can get pissed off at people for asking these questions, but remarkable claims should have some hard proof to back them up. I think that's all Gamuret has asked for, but so far you guys have just presented fluff.

I'm not upset. It would be interesting to know more about this side of David's work, but I have never bothered to ask. The PhD reference was taken from the Qigongresearch.com site which was created by some students from Turkey. David asked that we not use it for the website; not sure why, but I would assume it's because that's no longer something he wants to emphasize in the presentation or his own work. From what I have been told he made many of his connections through the research he was involved in, maybe he wants to keep those connections to himself, just a guess; he's pretty careful to protect the privacy of the masters he works with.

 

Anyway, let me know if you find anything interesting and good luck on your search.

 

Best, S

 

 

PS- yes, David's students have met Liping and, as I said, I did as well.

I don't know why Sean Denty is so silent.

Sorry I didn't see this, I don't follow the TB board unless someone emails me generally these days.

 

Um, I honestly haven't inquired in great depth about David's research, but there is some info on the foundation forum. He published a few studies in China and did some consulting for Rochester University. Those are the ones that you might be able to look up. He is working on some research in Vienna, that one is pretty interesting; all the details are on the forum.

 

Some of the research is classified, like the stuff Wang Liping does researching people with special abilities for the government. He is considered the top expert in China on Qigong health and healing and does a great deal of work with cancer and aids patients. He also set up many of the standards that are now in place for qigong and TCM in general.

 

He teased us a little when we showed him some herbal prescriptions we had. He said we could ask any high government official, who is the best doctor in China and they would say Wang Liping. Then he told us all our herbs were basically a waste of money and we just need to Pan Zu (sit and meditate). I guess this is typical of the Northern School.

 

Sorry, I the research thing is not really my field or interest, next time I see David I'll ask him. David is a pretty remarkable guy, when he was like 14 or 15 he left Italy and became the apprentice of a Chinese kungfu master in Taiwan; the rest of the story is kind of one unbelievable adventure, so it probably better if I stay in my forum and keep quiet; these discussions usually just create endless gossip and bad feelings.

 

Peace, S

Although as things move along I will be posting something health wise to help cultivation.

Like that special water we talked about.

Later,

Max

 

Max I did find your insights on water and DNA very interesting. Next time I get to NY, it would be nice to get to get together.

 

I have a submission for your site from Sifu Liping, interesting health suppliment that he brought to light. I'll post it here when I get a chance.

 

Yours, S

Wow,

 

A while back my friend Max (aka Smile, one of the long time members here) showed be a pretty cool website he created that give all kinds of useful tips and info about health alternatives. At the time I was like ya, I'll check that out, not really thinking I would find anything ground breaking. Anyway, one of my students told me he had a wart on his finger for quite some time and I remembered seeing something about a wart cure on Max's site, so I totally hooked this kid up with the info on Max's site. Long story short, the kids wart got considerably smaller and he was totally excited that it was working. I guess nothing else had; he said he had even had it frozen off at the doctors office and it just grew back, bummer.

 

Anyway, I just wanted to share this resource because I know Max is the kind of guy that doesn't like to brag. I'll keep you guys updated on my student's wart.

 

Here's the site where you can find the wart cure and as well as other interesting information: www.curebum.com

 

Cheers

from what i know Jiang doesnt charge one penny

i dont know about Liping, but i expect to be the same

 

I appreciate the kind post. I should be mentioned that Jiang and Liping do charge. For Liping, the government demands payment for his time, especially for foreigners.

 

Again, I understand this idea of taking money for spiritual practice being taboo in the States; or anywhere for that matter. It will likely always be viewed suspiciously by some. The Chinese view it as a test of sincerity and determination; as well as intelligence to have the ability to master money and demonstrate an acceptable level of aptitude in the material world.

 

Money=metal, which is the base of alchemy.

 

When I was studying with Liping, he said he really wants the teachings to spread. That's why he is writing a book with David to share some of the basic outer teachings openly. For those who reach a good level, doors will open.

 

Taoist practices are awesome to strengthen our spirits, body's and chi but they won't open a door out of Samsara. Buddhism does.

Wang Liping is a Buddhist and a Daoist. Many Daoist lineages have produced living Buddhas, just as prolifically as Buddhism the formal religious entity. Wang Liping is a Buddha on a par with Padmasambava, but he doesn't go around making claims, he doesn't need to. And he can demonstrate all the powers of a Buddha not just talk about it. The point is not to make silly comparisons to show one is better than another. Daoism is Dharma, only people with limited understanding see a distinction.

Yes, the training that David provides is a business. Yep, it's not Buddhism which is usually free, not always; generally the teacher receives financial support from his students. David live a typical middle class life, he's not rich.

 

I'm the only one doing any marketing in the states. And I'm a volunteer school teacher.

 

Revenge of the Gods? Um, you lost me there.

 

Is this conversation really necessary? I mean, I have really moved on.

 

Good grief

Sean,

C'mon, it's a business. Don't try to bullshit anyone otherwise. How much money did Jesus charge anyone for his teaching? I don't have a problem with people charging for their services, not by a long shot. But Warren Buffets success is a proven commodity, you just offer promises.

Mr. Buffet's method can be had readily, there's folks who worked for him who wrote books about it. He didn't threaten anyone with curses from the gods like you guys do. You're a bullshit cult.

 

I don't really know how to respond to that. All I can say is that David and his teachers are in demand and very well respected in China. Wang Liping really is the guy who determines what is taught in the Daoist temples in China, monks and lay people wait years just to meet him. You don't have to believe me I guess.

 

Warren Buffet's advice might be in a few books, but how many people personally apprentice with him and get hands on assistance and mentoring, very few.

 

Ok, guys. I'll leave you to it. To each his own.

Also when all of the commotion about Jiang was happening on this site several months ago, Sean said David had an offer to waive the fee and prove to me that Jiang was legit. I had to join their forum to see the offer, so I did, The offer was that he would waive his fee. I would fly to China and offer to be exposed to Jiang's full power. I would have to sign a waiver that they would not be held accountable if my internal organs exploded or I died... AND THEN I WOULD HAVE TO PAY THE FULL FEE TO MEET JIANG. What kind of people are these? What is the attraction? I just don't get it folks.

 

If you would have had the actual commitment to come, David would not have let you get hurt. That's just silly, but then again it's pretty clear that you weren't all that serious.

 

I recently met with Sifu Jiang. The man who discredited him on his blog has since apologized; the newspaper article was a complete tabloid fabrication. The student is now helping Jiang publish a retraction.

 

Anyway, Jiang burnt blisters into all of our hands from over a meters distance with no preparation or physical contact. David also insisted that Jiang remove his clothing to pass the electric like surge of qi which was incredibly strong and overwhelming and doesn't require any training on the receiving end to be perceived, no battery pack.

 

Anyway, Anwei is a fine teacher. I wish you success in your training.

 

Peace, S

Hey Guys,

 

The forum attracted a number of young people and individuals in a low income bracket who were and are very sincere. People that, for whatever reason, were attracted but cannot afford the training. I sincerely sympathize with this situation having been a college student once myself. One of the goals of the foundation forum is to eventually provide scholarships for very dedicated young people who lack the funding to enroll in the program.

 

Just to put things in perspective, the basic foundation training is a three year program that involves a two week commitment once a year and is comparable in cost to other similar programs. One seminar's tuition costs roughly 1,600.00 US dollars and you would need to attend four seminars to complete the training; after the first two seminars the cost is reduced to almost half, about 800.00-900.00 US Dollars. This is a complete training and all one need to progress to a very high level of realization.

 

Just to say, the cost is not as absurd as this thread claims. Many people at the top of their respective fields charge much more to attend their seminars. The dragondoor.com Guru Pavlave or whatever, is a friend and client of one of David's students. I guess has charged as much as 2,500 for a weekend of personal coaching. And, if you want to get incredibly strong, they say he is one of the absolute best. It's the same kind of thing with David. His students are really serious and want really top instruction, pretty cut and dry honestly.

 

The masters that David works with include Wang Liping and others of a comparable status. They are heads of huge organizations and have tremendous commitments to literally thousands of students throughout China. Naturally, just to arrange a week of exclusive time with someone like Wang Liping costs a great deal of money, thus the high cost to train with a master. Wang Liping is responsible for overseeing all the Taoist temples in China, in addition to many other duties.

 

Logically, to attend a training with Warren Buffet on how to make money will cost more than attending a training with someone without his reputation and unquestionable aptitude. It's not such a mystery really.

 

Again, I sympathize with the desire to have training of such a high caliber with highly qualified teachers available to a wider audience. David and his masters also want people at every socioeconomic to have access to authentic Daoist teachings and some basic teaching will be made available in a book David is writing at Sifu Wang's request.

 

In the mean time, as Max has said, there are some excellent teachings out there. I can't comment on all his recommendations, but Buddhism really is a perfectly profound teaching. Dzogchen in particular is a very high level system of teachings, with many Daoist influences and commonalities.

 

As for the forum, we feel that the services offered for our members is well worth the one time fee. Many forums charge much more and on a yearly basis. We charge a one time fee for lifetime membership; $250.00 US dollars. That's less than a dollar a day over the course of a year.

 

Of course all the basic information is provided on the website (created with funds raised largely from Taobum.com members, thanks guys), so there is no need or requirement to join the forum. I don't see what there is to be so upset over and we have had a good response from our members, many of whom have already signed up.

 

As for the other accusations, in the entire forum history we banned two people; and only after days of negative ranting on their part. We simple wish to be among fellow students and those like-minded; and for those who share are interests and like the idea of online training and getting their questions answered, it not such a huge deal.

 

Cheers, Sean

My oppologies to the forum for the subjective and personal nature of this post.

Why not say something you won't have to appologize for? Go find your self and grow up a little.

So Basically David is not capable of cultivating it for himself.

No, not at all. David has worked hard the last fifteen years and achieved a great deal. He accomplished what he has without the aid of the masters, training up to 8 hours per day at some points in his training. Later, if you followed the discussion, he did receive empowerment to assist the process, but this is true of all Lei Shan Dao training.

 

From the time that David introduced to Mo Pai he never achieved anything, but just constantly looking around and talking with other Masters collecting information. And now, those who follow him can only walk the same path, how is a student of David expected to achieve anything any other way?

Are you kidding, David achieved a great deal years ago. He is very accomplished. What are you talking about? Do you even know?

 

Many of his students are doing the same successfully. Most of David's students are very positive and inspiring to be around and grateful for their time with David.

 

Another important point is the fact that David has several masters, some of whom do accept those students who reach a good level, including Jiang. David is quite capable as a teacher and guide, but his students have many options and a variety of interests as well as different goals with different masters.

I seriously doubt that this is a Method used by Teacher John Chang.

Say what you will. Your spectulation has no meaning. While the methods are different with many similarities, the goal and result is the same. This is very clear. There are actually twelve methods and techniques to cut the cords written about it Kostas' book. Different Pai within Lei Shan Dao, of which Mo Pai is a branch, use some or all of the twelve. Mo Pai applications call for around four of the twelve.

 

Jiang and his brother have trained over one hundred successful students in Da Mo Pai to achieve the so called level four. Jiang's master is well above level 30, possibly much higher. You can read about some of the things he and Jiang can do from the people who saw and felt them on the foundation forum; which include all of the things written about such masters and far, far more. Why fall in line with the gabby talkers who have nothing better to do than cut people down. At least do your research and present an intelligent comment.

Hey Cam,

 

Pay your self a dollor for every day you are successful and, at the end of the 100 days, go out to a nice dinner with someone special to celibrate. That's my tip.

 

May the immortals smile on you.

 

S

It probably depends on what system you are practicing.

 

If you are doing Sifu Max's way. My guess is you do 100 days along with Kunlun every day. If your not doing 100 days along with Kunlun every day I don't see how this can be called the "Kunlun 100 days".

 

David Shen's system same thing. You do 100 Days along with the Foundation Training from David Shen.

 

Just doing 100 days to do 100 days wouldn't be too interesting to me. I mean, I probably don't have the focus to pull it off anyway but if I am going to do it the whole idea would be to strengthen the arising Bliss of Kunlun Level One..not just to do 100 days.

 

Best.

 

Again, just to avoid confusion, it's important that people don't think that the foundation training involves 100 days as Cam suggests. We are doing something different and for a different length of time. Yes, celibacy is a requirement, but again there isn't really any similarity between the two trainings.

 

Point of fact, just being celibate for a hundred days can have drastically different results depending on what practice you are doing.

 

Sorry, to butt in again, as you were...

Re-copied this post from my 100 days journal,

 

Regarding 100 days,

 

Sean Denty told me something that I will put into practice and also might be useful to others. If I have "an accident" don't start from the beginning but pick up where I left off.

 

So let's say I am at day 20 and then have a wet dream. I would then say in my 100 days journal "had an accident" I would not count that day and then I would start over the next day at 21.

 

This also might be useful to people in realationships that are interested in doing 100 days with Kunlun. Instead of freaking out when your beautiful wife wants to make love on the terrace..or on the floor in the bathroom or whatever..you go ahead and do your sexual shaman dance then don't count that day but then start from the next day.

 

This helps take the pressure off!

Hey Cam,

 

I didn't see this. Just a quick note of clarification to avoid confusion.

 

What I explained to Cam was a simple comment on the way jing opperates; because Cameron is a member of the foundation forum and what I told him is written there, I just thought I'd mention it. However, since Foundation and Max's Kunlun have little to do with eachother, it's important that what I said is not applied to Max's teaching.

 

Also, what Cameron wrote is not what I explained, so it's important not to mistake what is written as something accurate or part of authentic Jing Dong Lu, the theory of accumulation of jing; which any way does not have anything to do with Kunlun, as it is taught by Max. Sorry if my comment created unnecessary confusion; I regret having mentioned it as it is really not helpful to interfer with what Max taught you.

 

Cheers and good luck with your 100 days.....

 

I'm not claiming that Lei Shan Dao came from Buddhism.. haha so I hope you all don't worry about that.

 

WHat I am saying is there are loads of methods within Buddhism not readily seen by cultivators. These methods only are revealed either by a master who has cultivated them, or knows them well and has attained high level then teaches them, OR through one's diligent cultivation, with a foundation of virtue, and moral.

 

 

Not at all, I would agree with everything you said. I would say both Daoism in Buddhism are two peas in the same pod. Of course both are good and have their strengths and weaknesses.

 

Buddhism doesn't believe the mind exists. They don't take refuge in their mind. Daoism, if not cultivated properly, only takes you to states, not the original mind. Buddhism helps you understand the mind, the states that arise, and drop it to reveal the original nature, which is not mind.

The difference between Buddhism and Daoism is that along the lines people got attached to states and sensations, power and searched for that only, thinking it was the way to actual "oneness, Dao, Nirvana."

The name Buddhism was only given to let people know what the methods help you attain. Dao was a name given to let people realize the manner in which to cultivate in order to see the original nature of things.

 

To the relative mind, there is Dao, Buddha. To the completely enlightened mind, there is no separation.

 

Peace and Blessings,

Lin

Right on Lin. very nice