JinlianPai

Just like lightning that exist in nature as a universal expression the golden elixir in the universe as well.....

You never know there might be taoist who work directly with the golden elixir force....

You cant create something in your body that doesnt already exist in nature.

Very good.

Alchemists work like this there maybe a direct method to generate the Golden Elixir by the originating sect.

Then

Another sect hears of this they find another way to generate the golden elixir but thru a much more lengthy process....

But

The originating sect golden elixir is brewed differently and has vast connections to the stars and earth by connecting with the golden elixir that exist in nature.

There is the alchemical side of meditations

And

There is the spiritual side of meditations (what forces in nature is your meds connecting you to and its spiritual affect on you).

Interesting question. One I do not feel qualified to answer. The Zhong Lu Chuan Dao Ji seems to suggest the need to circulate the golden elixir to refine the body. But I would need to study a bit more to speculate with any clarity.

 

Do you have ideas about this you'd like to share?

Yes.

That the golden elixir is luminous and radiant and can be directly cultivated.

To transmute the bodies energies to pure spiritual gold that resonates with the core of this planet.

My question is extended to the WuliPai guys as well....

Do you see Golden light when you train internal or externally?

Given your training what do you think the golden elixir is?

In my experience, extreme experiences were exciting, but not helpful. They were more akin to chemically encouraged experiences - temporary and out of our control.

 

After having many such temporary experiences, all of them different and educating, but none permanent, I began to realize how important constancy, refinement, and gradual progress were, in terms of cultivating the conditions to lead to stable, harmonious and permanent results.

 

I've had one run-in with the golden elixir, and it happened when I was in a more stable, egoless, very refined and calm state, and even then I could not maintain the delicate balance enough to slip into the mysterious pass. But it was enough to understand, and was unmistakable. But the key is not to attach to the experience, to put it on a pedestal, but to learn from the experience. Any experience is just a stepping stone for the next experience - if we attach to it, it becomes more difficult to get beyond it. Even the golden elixir is just a minor blip on the way.

 

Refinement is key. Refinement is balance. One needs to be fully balanced and harmonized in every aspect of themselves in order to work with the golden elixir and mysterious pass. Extremes tend to work like a sine wave, drawing you up and down repeatedly. Even when you think you are stable, an extreme from the same time last month or last year might can pull one out of balance. This is why it helps to pay attention to the solar and lunar cycles - the more balanced we become, the more we can tangibly feel the ebbs and flows of these cycles.

Thanks for the reply and that sounds like a cool exp.

Thanks for sharing.

Now heres my question to the board in general. Shouldnt the Jindan alchemy fill you to over abundance of the golden elixir?

I don't think that in neidan, golden light could be cultivated directly, .

Why?

Practitioners of the Secret of the Golden flower the descendants of the Golden Lotus. If there are practitioners of this then why cant the golden elixir be made manifest?

I think that in neidan the golden light surrounding the practitioner is a sign of progress.

When it comes to the Jindan the golden elixir

The Gum Guang or golden light....

Does anyone see this when they train either internally or externally?

My other point is Ive seen on here that a lot of qigong teachers like and respect the secret of the Golden flower but there methods are different and the book is used as a reference.

Then this becomes the questions is there just a direct method that culitvates the Jindan as Gum Guang golden light?

 

Moderator Message

The hijacking of threads by use of staccato posting is not encouraged on the forum and adds nothing to discussion.

Please discontinue this practice.

Gothcha wasnt my intent please side step my post I dont want to ruin any prior conversation.

Well then the question became and just to be sure does the practitioners of Mahayana buddhism attain rainbow body?

The answer is Yes.

http://www.jamesabarrett.com/page1/rainbow.html

Mahaparinirvana, meaning, "great complete, Nirvana", where as Parinirvana is the “final nirvana”. Mahaparinirvana on the other hand is the sublime state realized by the soul; a state in which the Buddha being full attains "the Eternal Pure" no-self state of awareness.

It is considered the ultimate attainment of Buddhist practice and implies a release from the bhavachakra, Saṃsāra, karma and rebirth as well as the dissolution of all worldly physical and mental aggregates.

This level of release has the potential of dissolving the physical form completely beyond three dimensional time based reality.
In fact in Dzogchen there are four general classifications called "appearances".

Now what of the 5th guardian the most powerful the golden dragon of the earth?

This is what i was running into....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Light_Sutra

the sutra describes four Buddhas who dwell in the four cardinal directions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Light_Sutra

The Golden Light Sutra became one of the most important sutras in Japan because of its fundamental message, which teaches that theFour Heavenly Kings (Chinese: 四大天王; pinyin: Sì Dàtiānwáng) protect the ruler who governs his country in the proper manner.^[6]

In neidan people cultivate the golden elixir, or golden light

Very very very correct

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lotus_Sutra

Shakyamuni himself. In the vision of the Lotus Sūtra, Buddhas are ultimately immortal

This lead me to believe that it was the Lotus sutra is what lead to bhuddha becoming immortal but what of the 3 vehicles and vajrayana

and then I read this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lotus_Sutra

that there are not actually Three Vehicles (three kinds of teachings, each tailored to the capacity of a specific set of practitioners) as previously taught, but only One Vehicle (Skrt. Ekayāna, the Buddha’s ultimate teaching transcending limitations in the capacity of practitioners) leading to Buddhahood.^[20]

So then I understood that there is no difference between great power and great attainment because buddha is said to belong to another well known powerful sect.....

Sorry forgot to post sources so ill post this

this is for the lotus sutras http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lotus_Sutra

Which mostly correlates to the Mahayana Tradition

So I learned more about the Guardians and associations.

So then the question became if there is a practice for every guardian then the golden dragon of the earth has to has one.

So this lines up with what max said as far as golden dragon being the highest attainment.

But

lore also indicates that the golden dragon is unfeatable and has a very strong connection to earth.

but none of the rainbow practices reseembled this and I looked.

There was nothing that increased your earth chi while building the rainbow body.....

This indicated a problem in methodology.

Now I had to go back to rainbow body by the tibetans who turned out to have various light bodies with classifications.

Now I came across repeatadly that the rainbow body needs earth chi.

Now this correlates to jing yin and essence and the golden dragon.

ok cool.

Now I noticed that the taoist have practices related and named after the 4 main guardians.

like phoenix, tiger, and so forth

but there was literally no med of the main primary and strongest guardian.

My answer was

1. the golden lotus and other lotus methods are different and various

2. it was introduced by lu dongbin

3. The golden dragon has such a history in china but it looks like its history was also covered up as well.

So this brings me back to methodology

I questioned everything.

This led me to the question what is the core method of the golden lotus and why is there no temple to the main and primary guardian?

literally there was none which was odd...

So then this made me wonder how did the golden lotus get into taoism?

So then led me to ask how does this fit in with taoist astrology?

Then the golden dragon popped up

This led me to research the legend and taoist astrology affect onto taoist alchemy.

Then I started to search for temples related to the earth guardian.

So then this lead me to the history of the secret of the golden flower which lead me to the golden lotus sutras and then to the lotus tradition of china.

Here is a quote from the site you referenced which clearly states;

 

 

 

The quote stated the "Yellow Dragon Is" The use of the term (is) denotes an absolute statement. That is why I challenged your assumption, which you are calling a theory.

its cool man.

Even though Max and other taoist read the secret of the golden flower they didnt use the exact method in the book.

So then this came down to via the known methods what does the methods that actually work point to.

and to be even more critical is what he's attained the real golden dragon body?

Now I look into all of this.

To the methods the legends and so forth.

and with what I now know.

I think max attained rainbow body but not GDB.

In neidan too is a representation of the center.

And in the Secret of th Golden Flower it is mentioned:

Yes ive read the secret of the golden flower.

Heres my problem with its its too vague and too coded to actually be sure of anything it needs a control.

Like someone living who attained it.

So then this brings up Max and golden dragon body.

Max says its the prize of the secret of the golden flower.

Now I have a theory and a living example...

Now I have to forget everything I know about the secret of the golden flower.

And research it via the attainment alone and then its suppose source.

and what i came away with was a lot different.....