Shagrath

I cannot agree more. The thing is am I not interested in powers such as they are but in the underlying principle. I want to understand how they manifest, what person must do to obtain them, how can someone control energy on that extent, etc.

Thanks Dorian for saying it clearly what I didn't know how to say. I think this is good thread with good amount of very great information, but it all went sidetrack. Lets focus on cultivation of energies and please if someone has any more information or experience please share your insights. I also heard that Flying Phoenix Qigong system is also very strong. And that the teacher of Terry Dunn Doo Wai is also very very strong energetically. Anyone?

That is so true :|

What do you mean by TE? Did you learn only Clymans nei kung or you also learned temple style tai chi? What material would you recommend for tai chi? What is must have material (books/dvds) from Master Liao? PS: are those Clymans DVDs easy to learn from and have clear proper technique explanation?

Sarcasm at it's best When you pursue something that it's dreamy you have your excuse for not doing anything because you are waiting for the perfect moment who never comes

Nice! So we covered Jing and Fa Jing What about Fa Shen? Anyone?

In practical sense from my experience in energy work there is a concept of prenatal energy. Some authors refer to that energy also pre-energy (like in prehistoric), super energy (super in latin means above) or some call it also spiral energy. It is called prenatal because it is beyond concepts of yin and yang, it is energy from which yin and yang energy differentiate. Healing or activating some processes with that energy is much much more stronger than any other kind of energy treatment. And then on the other side of spectrum you have normal energies and energy structures that were created in pregnancy and some after birth, that you must develop to make sure that you can later cultivate prenatal energy. In meditation and spiritual growth is also important pre natal state, because it is silence, nothingness. As one shaman would say "in that state there is nothing but yet its not empty". So you also have to deal with post natal psyche. Because in order to be able to obtain prenatal state you have to deal with all sub-conscious mind, with all destructive emotions, with all mental blockages that prevent you from the state of flow.

Look at these articles about fasting. All are scientifically backed up and really really great source of information. Why Fast? Part One – Weight Loss http://www.marksdailyapple.com/fasting-weight-loss/#axzz24HiGEToi Why Fast? Part Two – Cancer http://www.marksdailyapple.com/fasting-cancer/#axzz24HiGEToi Why Fast? Part Three – Longevity http://www.marksdailyapple.com/fasting-longevity-lifespan/#axzz24HiGEToi Why Fast? Part Four – Brain Health http://www.marksdailyapple.com/fasting-brain-function/#axzz24HiGEToi Why Fast? Part Five – Exercise http://www.marksdailyapple.com/fasting-exercise-workout-recovery/#axzz24HiGEToi Why Fast? Part Six – Choosing a Method http://www.marksdailyapple.com/why-fast-part-six-choosing-a-method/#axzz24HiGEToi Why Fast? Part Seven – Q&A http://www.marksdailyapple.com/fasting-questions-answers/#axzz24HiGEToi

Well he should from our perspective but from his I'm sure he doesn't care. If you want that knowledge you will pay 3.500 dollars and he'll have a thicker wallet. If you are not ready to pay that amount F**K OFF. It's cruel but that's life. PS: in 10-15 years when I gather the money I will tell you are the dvd-s worth the price :D

WOW! Thank you immensely for explaining the whole process. I got my hands on Tai Chi Classic from Master Liao. Really great material. Everything is much more clearer now. Now I should start saving and in 10 years buy Clymans DVDs :|

Thanks Dorian Black. It sounds simple, but that doesn't mean it easy How can somebody do what you wrote? With doing Tai Chi regularly? Do you recommend some books? Teacher?

In my opinion there is nothing to like or dislike. You agree with his words or not. He had matured consciousness and he was having fun. In one speech he talks about open marriages and in another he speaks about monogamy And in both cases he is right. It all depends from which angle he is talking. Before he died he said that everything he said in his life was a lie because you cannot describe Truth. It's not that I disbelieve its more that I am careful what to believe in. For example lots of students of my teacher are saying lots of information about him, what he said on some subject, what he did, etc. And when you ask him is that true, on 99% cases he said that is bulls**t he never said that. And then when I asked my friends and other students why the lied they said because if the say teacher said its more believable. Another kind of experiences that I had is in martial arts. My friends who are 4th-6th DAN in aikido and Bujinkan Budo Taijutsu said stories that in seminars with some famous masters the master demonstrated to them how he can mentaly stop their attack and he stopped everybody in the room. Next seminar he also did that and I also tried but he couldn't stop me and he got a punch in his face. Why? Because I don't have any subconscious belief that he is above me, better than me and I don;t consider his ultimate master as 99% of people present did. Lot of energy sensations and experiences with teachers are placebo. Watch movie Kumare. My teacher always said "Do not believe nor disbelieve, always check." So am not saying that there are no true masters, I would really like to meet them and train under them, but I am not buying every story about them.

It makes perfect sense. Thanks again snowmonki. You know somebody, some system, book, meditation or practice that are teaching those kind of electric jing skills?

How can you tell that they are not in the same league or that somebody is higher level? Energetic abilities doesn't mean anything. They are horizontal development of individual, while vertical would be just spiritual development (Nisargadatta, Osho, etc). Most of the stories of those famous teachers are just stories. I don't believe in most of them, I just listed those few names so everybody who reads the thread better understands what I am asking. Especially I don't believe in John Chang stories in Kostas book. I consider them pure fiction just to make people attracted more to energy arts.

So you are saying that if somebody wants to have energetic abilities must develop itself both in and out, to have strong core energetic structures and the most important to be in contact with emptyness from where he manifests his intent?

Now I can relate to what you are saying. I was one of those people Yesterday I went to my first individual training of Da Cheng Quan and it was mind blowing. Different then anything I read before.

So you both are saying that if you have a genuine teacher and you practice a lot you'll achieve energy powers. It makes sense but what about everybody who trained Xingyiquan and only one person was Wang. Why didn't all students of his teacher had the same level of energy control. Or Morihei Ueshiba, who created aikido. He was the only one with absolute control with energy processes and from all of his students the was only Gozo Shioda who came very close to Morihei. And other hundreds of people who trained even more then Gozo with genuine teacher could not do what he did. I don't think there is a system guarantees energy powers.

And on the other end of the spectrum you have Padre Pio (Francesco Forgione) who didn't do any particular energy cultivation, nei gong, or dan tien exercises he was just a monk and he prayed entire day and he was stigmata and very famous healer. He could cure cancer in few seconds.

Yes that is true, and I cannot agree more on that. But I know a few people that are practicing Zhan Zhuang for 2h per day for few years and they have only health benefits and on the other hand you have Master Wang who also practised Zhan Zhuang and he was well Master Wang There most be something more to any cultivation beside exercise.

Thank you

In past few weeks I got really interested in Penetrating/Thrusting/Center/Chong Vessel and Taiji Pole. Some resource say that Chong Mai is in the Taiji Pole, and then others call Taiji Pole Center Vessel which is the name also of Chong Mai. There are lot of information about them but they are not clear about neither of them. So, is Taiji Pole different name for Thrusting Vessel? What are they? Can you recommend some good resource upon that? Thanks.

Thank you endlessly for your effort and patience to bring me closer understanding of zhong mai I really appreciate it.

Or you just try to pull your abs toward the spine and automatically your cremaster muscle will be activated. So you do that a lot of times and soon you will be able to feel cremaster muscle isolated, and then VOILA. When I was in the high school in second grade I trained a little shaolin wushu and the teacher told us stories how monks can pull testicles into abdomen so I practiced and in a month of every day fooling around I succeed it. But it has its consequences.

It certainly is by far the best story, character development, philosophy I have ever saw in any movie or tv series. I like Legends of Korra too. It is also very good because characters are older then they were in Last Airbander and the series are in some ways deeper because characters have more mature emotions and more mature questions are broth to light.

Thank you again snowmonkey for your answer and recommended reading and yes you have left me speechless I think that I have understood what you are saying in total but please let me just recapitulate your posts with my words to see if we are on the same page, to prevent any confusion and distortion of words. Please in few word just correct me if I’m mistaken at any point. You should not believe everything you read or hear just for the reason the author is Chinese. The are many perspectives on the energy processes and it depends on the focus of some system. For example I will take chong mai because it is the main reason for discussion here. If you take too books and they’re both using name chong mai it doesn’t mean that they are talking about the same thing. You should take in your consideration authors background, profession, etc. And on the other hand if one author uses name zhong mai, another chong mai and third middle mai or centar channel they may be talking about the same thing It is not the label that matters it is the function and principle that matters and underlying experience author is trying to explain. I have found Tao & Longevity and read the part where Master Nan explains the channels. He said that he hasn’t found central channel in old Chinese books but that there is one part in Yellow emperors book that it addresses to Central Channel but there is called Chong Mai and that he found parallel in Tibetan channel system Middle Mai with its parts Right Mai and Left Mai. I have also found in one of Ken Kohen audiobooks Taoist version of alternate nose breathing where he describes central channel exactly as Master Nan described it in his great book. Both description of that channel are exactly the same as Indian yoga description of Shushumna, Ida and Pingala. After long period of inner work with my teacher we firstly opened chakras and than after a while we worked at rising kundalini. I also had vision of columns and spirals. Isn’t that interesting I searched for your recommendations if practice and they are very very similar to what yoga teaches to open shushumna (central chakra channel). So my bold conclusion here is that shushumna (central channel in yoga) is actually the same thing as Zhong Mai (central channel in Taoism). That the only difference between them are slightly different descriptions (I think due to different uses of words in their systems) but the end experience and method are overlappin, the same consequences if they are played with AND they both are alchemical approaches (kundalini tantra/yoga and alchemical qigong). I really want to fully understand what you are saying so please correct me I didn’t understand any of your points. Thank you again for your very kind answers.