laughingblade

What's the video abt (haven't watch it ).I take it u disagree with the sage being reclusive.

 

'selfless service' is the next stage after 'naturalness'? I don't noe. ...

I do disagree.

Forgive my frankness: My opinion FWIW is that you're too idealistic right now. I know 'cos I can be too. Easily solved by putting butt-cheek to cushion.

They dont care much about teaching,helping and enlightened others.

Bodhisattva, won't you take me by the hand?

Contending with the monkey...

stumble and grumble, at the "those who know do not speak" implication. Isn't that just so tired by now? Anyway, I can't get everywhere, so I have to rely on others' experience to pre-filter (especially when it comes to brain surgery to investigate consciousness, or re-running the Stanford Prison Experiment). What should I do? Head East, or is it West? Maybe Kwai Chang Kane had the right approach?

Just one Tulku to be sure, but a Tulku is supposed to be a conscious reincarnation isn't he? And also trained in precisely the inner practices that elaborate on the mystery of death. And AFAIK he didn't just smile inscrutably, he actually admitted to not knowing.

But yeah! I'd LOVE to travel, and meet folks, and do long retreats, and all sorts. Just haven't got (and can't quite see how to, without causing a deal of suffering to others) the setup to do it right now. Sometimes I grumble about that as well.

Sorry, misheard you

Did read from Buddhism( Theravada) , but cannot relate to the 'approach' part. It was given as a whole fixed set of teachings in which many of them needs to be accepted on faith. :-)

Look again: Samatha (jhanas) and Vipassana require nothing to be taken on faith. Empirical, repeatable, attested to by many.

...death can be simulated...

I stumble here, as I stumble when people tell me their NDEs tell them something about what happens after death. And an outdated belief that you're dead when the heart stops beating. It's like some other monkey-brain takes me over yelling "you weren't DEAD dude!"

I used to think the Buddhists knew a bit about it, but then when I finally read the Abidharma it weaselled out of the bits about how we come in and go out: shame really since it's so detailed on just about every aspect of experience.

Then I used to think the Tibetan Buddhists knew a bit about it: Book of the Dead, indestructible drops etc. Then I read (English philosopher) Juilan Baggini in The Ego Trick where he pins a well-respected Tulku on precisely this question and the Tulku admits he's just learned that stuff.

Maybe the Taoists know something?

(edit: monkey-fingers)

If suffering is your thing then maybe investigate the original meaning of dukkha.

Buddha Gautama had a lot to say about increasing happiness, reducing suffering, and a consistent approach leading to those outcomes.

Actually you're not really around to experience what's going on now either: it's just that the light seems to be on where it's happening.

What happens after death?

Same sort of thing as happens now, except you're not around to experience it.

Yes, but please don't put words in my mouth. I never said that mantra "merely leads to concentration". Read my above posts carefully regarding the vibrational and resonant qualities of both Mantra and Dharanis. I think I made my position clear. 

I am not a Christian, but I do concede that all the religious doctrines of the world hold an element of Universal Truth, however obscure. One of these Truths I believe may be found in the description of the 'Word' which according to the Abrahamic religions is what created all things. According to the Vedas "Om" was precisely the Word which gave life to all things, and Om is known as the MahaMantra for that very reason - the highest Mantra. Mantras have or provide a direct connection with certain universal archetypes which are identified variously as deities, gods, devas or some other description, and these are beings with immense power. When one ingests a hallucinogen or has the sort of experience I was describing in my previous post, one is exposed to these archetypes, which can be absolutely terrifying if one has not developed sufficient mastery of the mind. This is the stuff of the worst bad trip imaginable. But my point is that mantras are powerful in and of themselves, they are not to be limited to a mere mechanism to get from point A to B in consciousness, although in one sense this is also true. Another way to view a mantra might be as a highly condensed form of the consciousness of the being associated with it. The language is also important. Sanskrit and Pall are both very unique languages due to the quality of the sounds. In one sense Sanskrit could be thought of as the mother tongue of all languages. Interestingly one can use the science of Cymatics in order to verify which of the world's existing languages have this resonant quality. It shows that not all languages do. 

 

For those who still doubt the power of vibration, I recommend doing a search on Youtube or elsewhere for Tibetan Singing Bowls. Look for a video which shows the effect of playing such a bowl filled with water.You will be surprised when you see it. There are also larger versions from different parts of Asia such as Japan, which have handles which are rubbed to create a similar effect. The water actually leaps out of the bowl as a result of the effect of the resonant frequency of the bowl upon the water. A search for 'Cymatics' will also provide a broader view of the subject of vibration from a more scientific perspective. 

David I think you need to take to your cushion mate.

Many tibetan masters have stated that the mani mantra is a complete path all by itself.

 

It should be used along with bodhicitta

 

You should also see everything as manifestations of deity, mantra, and wisdom.

Que?

I'm reminded of Monty Python's Spanish Inquisition sketch. All you need is the element of surprise, and then it will be a complete path all by itself.

I am a he, and my name is David. You accuse my logic of being corrupt - I don't feel that was really called for, but I am not about to let that affect me. 

You say enlightenment isn't omniscience. That too is a fallacious statement, because if you read the Buddha Suttras, the enlightenment Gautama Buddha describes is without limit. You however are placing limits upon this attainment without presumably having attained enlightenment yourself? therefore your argument is presented within your own experiential framework. And if you have experienced some degree of enlightenment, the limitation you place upon your perception which is presumably passing through the filter of your enlightened state is indicative of the fact that it is no where near full enlightenment, thus you are in no position to judge what enlightenment is or is not, and this is also why you are reacting in this way to my request. Does that sound logical?

That is precisely why I said that I am not interested in opinions. As far as I am concerned, if someone is truly enlightened, they become inseparable from Truth, and as such are able to identify that which is Truth and that which is not Truth (without attachment or clinging to whether it is Truth or not Truth). So unless one has come to that point I feel that the only thing they can offer is their opinion based upon their own experience and understanding. In such a state they are in no condition to judge whether any Dharma is or is not Truth. 

Incidentally my own glimpse of the enlightened state showed me that enlightenment is indeed omniscient. If one ceases to experience the separative consciousness, then what do you think the expression of being is which remains if not omniscient? Do you not believe that Tao is omniscient? What is not Tao?

 

I have no difficulty with regard to concentration, or at least I know how to concentrate. But that is no more than the first step on the path, the pinnacle of which is supreme enlightenment, or liberation from Samsara. And yes, I am trying to make sure that my remaining time is not wasted, or to put it another way that my efforts are expended in the right direction to enable me to achieve my potential during this lifetime. 

So I am doing my best to intelligently sort the wheat from the chaff. 

Hi David! No offence intended - it's all fairly fluid gender-wise these days. And yes, corrupt *was* a little strong.

While making no claims myself to enlightenment I know plenty who do so I'm basing my comments on what they tell me, and while they have varying abilities none are AFAIK omniscient. I think you're misinterpreting the phrase 'without limits' to mean 'with and ability you can imagine'. Such abilities are functions of various vehicles, while enlightenment is beyond the conditions of any vehicle - liberation from them all, as you say.

With respect, I think when you're enlightened (and I sincerely hope you get it) you'll see that the 'glimpses' you've had so far were nothing of the sort, and that the realisation blows anything prior to it to smithereens.

We do agree that concentration is but the first step on the path. You'll agree then that if mantra leads (merely) to concentration it doesn't lead to enlightenment.

Mantra is supposed to cause concentration. Look at the example DSCB57 gave above.

DSCB57's logic is corrupt - s/he wants a person enlightened by another technique to argue why mantra cannot get enlightenment - that's fallacious. If I got it via X then why should I know anything at all about Y? Enlightenment isn't omniscience. Based on his/her inability to put the point I'd have to say the example is suspect too.

Anyway... lots of practices assist with concentration - anapanasati for example. Concentration isn't enlightenment... so with anapanasati ther are other practices/aspects once concentration has been achieved. With mantra... well. I assume the same... so mantra will aid concentration, but not get enlightenment.

Isnt it all thought ? 

Are you having a laugh? Even if we're only hacking the meat there are surely levels of brain function way below the thresholds of conscoius thought... or can you watch individual nerons firing?

How can thought take you beyond thought?

*******

 

You only need but a minute or a few seconds to receive a transmission. You can make that transmission last a lifetime by sincerely and mentally aligning with that energetic information every day.

 

However (and this is key), you may not ever be able to accurately vet what transpired in those transmissions. The majority of cultivators will never know the energetic truth in their lifetime. And in that vein, it is wise to be prudent with deities, gurus, energy masters, and people who talk openly about their spiritual achievements. There is extreme risk in degrading the positive spiritual condition with which you were born.

 

 *******

BOOM! Home run. (but what do I know, I'm just the window cleaner?)

x

^^ What he said, plus intense aerobic exercise & weights.

Agree with Gerard: foundations first. Something like Bruce Frantzis' Opening the Energy Gates or  Eric Yudelove's 100 Days book might be good places to start as both very gentle and easy to follow. Better still, find a local teacher.

I'd ignore the idea of Medical Qigong until you're well established.

Fascinating. Seems very appropriate to the position I find myself in.

Hexagram Fu / Return is 24. I suppose there's a sense of Innocence in the idea of the return of primordial energy.

I have the Wilhelm / Baynes translation:

 

The trigram Ch'ien points to great creative power; Ken indicates firmness and truth. Both point to light and clarity and to the daily renewal of character. Only through such daily self-renewal can a man continue at the height of his powers. Force of habit helps to keep order in quiet times; but in periods when there is a great storing up of energy, everything depends on the power of the personality.

Think I'll get a copy of Cleary's version: I really like the neidan emphasis. It speaks to my internal state.

Thanks 9th. I think I derailed myself, but I really appreciate your pointers back into the historical origins of these ideas in this second post. I've got a lot to study from the material in both.

When I've consulted the I Ching in the distant past and went too far there was always the same hexagram and reading that seemed to hint "I already told you", so I'm going to do some study to open out these ideas.

DNA is a bit like Gaia's version of the Akashic records.  Its a living memory bank, and as such is also the source of what can be called "destiny" in terms of the earthly realm.  Its literally raw information - recorded, archived and encoded.  These records can be accessed and decoded by transmuting sexual energy - but actually this area is often misunderstood.  It does not refer to transforming semen or eggs back into sexual "energy", since they have already become sexual "matter" - because if you can transmute matter back into energy, you wont have much of anything to worry about at all anyways...  The correct understanding refers to the conservation and retaining of sexual energy before it becomes reproductive fluids.  Not in an absolute sense, as in stopping the flow altogether - but certainly much more than the average joe that is "leaking chi through the eyes" by lusting after every round curve and bouncing bit of flesh.

 

Sexual energy is the living connection which interacts with DNA.  Once it has become reproductive fluids or materials, it has "crystallized" in a certain formation which requires a complimentary external element for completion and wholeness.  This is necessary for a new life to begin.  If we wish to communicate with our DNA as it is and establish our personal connection to the Gaia mind, we must provide the equivalent space for a new life within our own being as well as the required complimentary element in its original energetic state - which is no small task, in fact it is a key aspect of the Magnum Opus, or "Great Work".

 

DNA contains the memories and recorded actions of your family, your ancestors, as well as the memories of those before them and so on - all the way back to the origin of all living beings on this planet.  DNA is the body's knowledge, it is what your body knows by way of "instinct" - and it is so vastly superior to the knowledge of your "civilized, human mind" that its like comparing the Library of Alexandria to a fortune cookie.  Its hard to overstate how much knowledge is contained in DNA, when properly decoded - and Im not talking about TCAG, codons and amino acids and so forth.  If you want to strike up some interesting resonances for yourself and your own situation, find a good translation of the I Ching and read it as much as possible, then look around for connections to its wisdom in your daily life.  The original writings of the I Ching are directly sourced from a holistic understanding of DNA in action, as are the underlying structure of hexagrams themselves.

 

Many peoples and cultures have esoteric teachings which speak of Dragons, Serpents and so forth - and these are messengers of DNA wisdom.  If you encounter such beings in visions, meditations, dreams, etc. - you will understand why that is so.  It is a universal phenomena in regards to human encounters with the Gaia mind - the Earth mind - the global network of consciousness where humanity is only one part of the whole picture.

This post just cracked my head open. Thanks.

There's a further angle which interests me. Although it may derail the thread I wonder if you have any suggestions:

DNA covers the predecessor / successor dimension of consciousness manifesting.

What about rebirth? It seems orthogonal to the DNA process. Abhidamma (sp?) says the consciousnesses are pretty much the same pre / during / post life, and that karmic load comes along for the ride. Impressions during life are stored in 'bhavanga' in the heart centre. It's unclear to me how those impressions get rolled into ongoing karma, let alone made available to successors. Then you have the indestructible drop in the heart - the coming in and going out place. Obviously I've done my procreating before death, but how does any Immortal Embryo development carry forward? So I'm mixing Buddhist with Taoist here I know...

 I am quite proficient at meditation and can clear my mind completely for periods of time.

It's easy to get into states of relative torpor with 'clearing the mind'. These can be quite pleasant, but not really moving things along. Even with simply sitting after a while there's always something else going on to pay attention to, investigate, let go to go deeper.

I wonder if some more active approaches might energise and/or move you on? Shamatha / Vipassana from the Buddhist tradition where the idea is strong concentration and insight into the nature of things. Nei Gong leading to Nei Dan in the Taoist tradition where the emphasis is on energetic cultivation.

Regarding QiGong practice I'm in favour of doing a standardised form frequently. Something like 8 Pieces of Brocade perhaps. Over time that will work your physical structure consistently as a support for further development. When we're starting out it can be tempting to 'let it happen', but usually there's quite a bit of purification and healing to be done before energy flow is possible along all channels. Going free-form early might result in energy moving where it moves easily rather than where it 'should' move for a balanced development. I've met teachers who have free-form alongside prescribed forms, and those who give an initiation to "light the fire" so that free-form has a particular 'flavour'. But for most of us starting out without such a teacher it's valuable to keep to the well-trodden paths.

DNA is passed from species to species.

 

As we transcend time and space we are owning our body's energetic connection where we are tied to time and space in our wei and qiao vessels, and our transcending this connection comes with the harmonization of various aspects of our DNA.

I'm not sure how DNA is passed between species. If you meant to say that perhaps you cold clarify a little.

I'm quite interested in the radical idea that spiritual practice might change a person's DNA during their lifetime, and that maybe somehow by association with a lineage some aspect of that lineage might get baked into DNA. Is our childrens' DNA different as a result of our practice? We know that senescence occurs partly through DNA mis-writes when cells reproduce - maybe this can be affected by practice. Then there are epigenetic effects where inheritable changes to gene expression occur causing cells to 'read' the genes differently.

I've not heard anybody discuss DNA and spiritual practice before - is there more you can say, or sources you can reference?

You needn't play like a coy jackass - be the open jackass that you are:

 

Quote from Lauging Blade:

"It's really really simply not OK, not reasonable, not correct, to assert that people know. Stop living in la-la-land and provide some proof, or some reliable path to verification. Mate I've been on this kick for 40 years - the proof just isn't there objectively, and of the practices that folk say get you such insight none of them work reliably except oddly enough for the cult leader."

 

You apparently want to parade your failings around here like a peacock in all his puffery - have at it - jack away.

 

Some of us are tired of the positioning.

 

DullBlade quote from "life after death"

So you've got nothing but insults? Is this your awakening? Is this what you teach?

TBH I thought I'd take a different approach, and you did say I could be a sceptic until the last drop. Still, per the quote you kindly included: show us the proof, or a methodology. Should be easy if you know.