forestofemptiness

Buscon, MCO and LDT practices are in fact concentration practices. I disagree with others who say to practice something else to improve your concentration--- these practices themselves can improve concentration. Dissolving practices or vipassana type practices are different. The best advice I saw on concentration practice is to imagine that you are a pioneer in the field, the first one ever. Pay close attention to your mind during practice and learn from that.

Let me take a stab, because I've been there: Re: feeling of "me-ness": you say this is a feeling. Does it come and go? Also, if it is a feeling, then it is not you because you cannot be what you experience. What experiences the feeling is not the me-ness. No-mind: the mind without form is No-mind. You should go there because it is freedom. It's like Hui Neng said: Freedom from form means non-attachment from forms in the midst of forms. Freedom from thought means having no thoughts in the midst of thought.

Reason has its limits, too: http://www.ditext.com/carroll/tortoise.html

I've been carefully studying the difference between the inner and outer world as part of my practice lately. To be honest, I'm having trouble finding a dividing line between the inside and the outside if we look at our direct experience.

How can one become immortal by adding on to your own nature? If by nature, you are not immortal, how is it possible for this nature to change into one that is immortal? And if by nature, you are immortal, then how is it possible to gain what you already are?

Cow, There is room for all that and more! Of course, if outer nature were accumulated, then it would not be one's "original" nature.

I would like to get the place where I have no goals. Of course, this sounds trite, but I would like to put an end to the wanting, gaining, going, moving toward, craving, desiring, needing. Game plan: 1. Meditation, typically vipassana type concentration-investigation. 2. Outside of meditation, mindfulness coupled with investigation. 3. Exploring all things as they appear in direct experience. 4. Learning from those who I can learn from. 5. Chi kung, physical exercise, and Intu-Flow for balance.

Thanks. Yes, that blog contains my notes.

I have a book on my desk in my office called the "Unencumbered Spirit" which was written by a Buddhist/Taoist/Confucian.

Not too long ago, Susan wrote: Many of us on here took KAP 1. I'm sure many of us fell off the bandwagon and did not press with this sort of simple program for any length of time. Recently, I've added KAP back into my repetoire--- the last time I did, I had a spiritual roller coaster and this time is no different. I would challenge all the Taobums who have done KAP 1 and fell off the practice to pick it up again. For those who kept with it, I encourage you to post your experiences. The guidelines are simple: daily practice, 2x a day, at least 20 minutes. Let's see what happens. Create some data.

It sounds to me, Sloppy, that you aren't reallyletting go. The impression I get is that you want to let go to get something, to go somewhere. This isn't really letting go, this is just clinging in a different direction. You're looking for a certain state of being. Real letting go (and this is not to say that I'm a master of it by any means) seems like it would be about just letting go, and whatever happens, happens. Maybe you don't get bliss. Maybe the thoughts don't die down. This is really letting go.

As before, my experiment has done very little by way of energy sensations and quite a lot by way of spiritual development. Overall, I feel lighter and better. I would say that I feel more conscious, and I feel that a lot of blocks have dissolved or are dissolving. Some bliss here and there, but not much in the way of sensations. Overall, my practice has calmed down from more explosive spontaneous movements to quieter MCOs while I sit down. One of the dangers on the spiritual path is expectations. I suppose if you expect to go through a certain experience or set of experiences (i.e. a Gopi Krishna-like explosion through the top of the head), you will likely miss something very important (i.e. the messages of the cosmos meant for you). My KAP experiences have either preceded or ignited my natural spiritual growth. Casual? Non-casual? I don't know if I even care. Looking back, I'm about 2/3 of the way through the 3 month trial.

This is what I do: Practice, practice, practice. Along with a healthy dose of attention. Spiritual practice, in my opinion, is nothing more than self-knowledge. As we study ourselves, we begin to see how these things arise. As we see this, these things have less impact on us. Our old habits begin to dissolve. Specific for you: what would happen if you did atma vichara with the same energy that you brought to the Buddhist v. Advaita debates?

Pain and pleasure go together, like yin and yang. You can't have one without the other. If you want pleasure, you also have to learn to deal with pain.

It sounds like you've found the arrow in the chest. The question isn't, Why is there an arrow in my chest?, it is, How do I get it out?

The disagreement arises simply because of the different levels of truth. TNH is speaking from the level of relative truth. Tzu is speaking from the level of ultimate truth. No contradiction, no wrong, no problem.

I disagree with GIH here. If you practice concentration, then it is clear that your chi calms down, your mind settles, and you are better able to see clearly what is happening. On the other hand, if your chi is agitated, it is hard to focus. If your mind is scattered and your thoughts are wandering, you won't see clearly. If you don't see clearly, then you won't realize the nature of things. I don't think that working on your chi itself is sufficient, nor is concentration itself sufficient. But it certainly makes it easier.

Two negatives don't make a positive--- a Buddhist hating on Hinduism doesn't warrant the reverse. I'd like to see something behind this statement that Buddhism "ripped off" Vedanta. Buddhist practice is very different from any other I've seen, and I don't mean this in a hierarchical way.

When I said sloppy and imprecise, I was referring to what everyone else means, which you say you adopted as your own. So what is intent? A vague, fuzzy mental feeling that precedes physical action? A mental plan? Physical tension, as when you close your eyes tight and try to move a ball with your mind? A wish? A desire? All of these? None of these? Some of some, not of others? What psycho-physical phenomenon are you labeling "intent"?

Most people tend to be sloppy and imprecise with these things.

GIH, What do you mean by the word, "intent"?

Actually, fraud is probably too harsh a word to use here. I would say, JCs demos feel like a trick. I don't mean to say that JC is a con-man for money or a criminal. I remember an old story from my anthropology class about a student of a famous anthropologist (I want to say it was Levi-Strauss) who learned to heal people by sucking arrowheads out of their bodies. Now the student knew the trick--- the healers would hide the arrowhead in their mouth beforehand, then they would "suck" on the body and produce the arrowhead. Nevertheless, it was found that he could in fact heal the tribe members. I think that what JC does is something along these lines.

Rich people lie, cheat, and steal all the time. Wealth is obviously no guarantee of virtue--- one of the reasons that many monastics take a vow of poverty.

I also heard of some woman who healed herself of schizophrenia. On a more serious note, Gurdjieff used to say that one has to become familiar with occult tricks if one does not wish to fall for them. I don't know much about plywood and physics, but I know JC feels like a fraud. This comes from years of dealing with criminals and liars. One of the problems with pursuing powers, or bliss states, or whatever, is that it takes away from the "work of the soul". You can see in Jane's story the work she has done on herself that shows in her ability to see what she did, where she went wrong, and hold herself in a critical light in public. This type of work provides insight into the mechanics of the mind, which is far more important in the long run than developing a power or state.

Nice post. Interesting reading.