Sloppy Zhang

Or maybe I am tired of EVERYONE claiming they have awakened kundalini?

 

If you want to inflate your own ego buddy, go for it. I don't do that shit. Not every energy movement is kundalini.

 

You all have very big ego's. Its pretty embarrassing.

 

"I experience something minor, and now I have raised kundalini!!!!"

So how do you know Robert Bruce has done it?

You don't get it.

 

I am pretty sure Seth is playing a joke on us. A non-funny joke, but a joke nonetheless. I feel sad if you take it seriously.

I feel sad that you can't take it seriously, as Raduga adds some interesting insights on projection in a way that is devoid of some overlying structure- he just describes what happens and what to do when stuff happens.

By the way, Robert Bruce has several easy "instant projection" techniques. Thats how I got my first OBE.

Sounds cool. Mind sharing some of these?

Is this Raduga stuff supposed to be a joke?

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ACLPGnm8AGI&feature=related

 

 

Seth, if you are just playing a joke on all of us, just come out with it. This was not a very funny joke.

Breaking news! Man advertises product using sex appeal! He obviously is a fraud!!!

Seriously, maybe you should give his material a serious read, there's some good stuff.

And as Seth has been pointing out, Robert Bruce's method is far reaching and broad, but to someone who just wants to get out of body, is rather cumbersome. Even if you just want to get the bare bones of how to get out, you've got to read dozens and dozens of pages. Not to mention there's a lot about developing the energy body. Which is great if you want an all encompassing method....

But some people just want to get out of body.

Raduga's methods are pretty straight forward and take advantage of natural phases of sleep/wake that can be used by anyone pretty much immediately after they learn them- he also gives lots of alternatives and a strategy for how to manage changing scenarios depending on the type of person you are.

It's devoid of the larger system that Robert Bruce's material is, which can be good or bad. If you want a system that will help you grow and develop, maybe you should work with Robert Bruce's material, develop your energy body some, and things like that. If you just want to get out of body.... maybe Raduga's is better.

(I've never actually seen any of the videos, I just read the material was a pretty lol-worthy video, though).

Perhaps you should take a look at this thread. It seems that even the notion of losing chi through orgasm varies, and there are people all over who have orgasms that actually boost their energy.

So maybe rather than getting into some view of "oh, orgasms/losing chi is bad" maybe you should think of "it's something spontaneous that has been happening since I was a kid, maybe I should ride the wave and enjoy the moment."

And again, like scotty said, you lose a TON of chi worrying out whether you are losing chi, far much more than you would if you were just doing the activity without mentally attaching to it.

The legal case in Sweden is just this back and forth deal, but I've been reading various people around the net saying that Assange/his lawyers might be giving this a lot of their attention, because the more things get mucked up with this case, the more trouble the U.S. would have to go through to get their hands on him (though Sweden on sex assault/rape vs. U.S. on espionage... who gets the prisoner?).

In any case, the legal dilemma facing Assange would be interesting, especially if he was tried for espionage. The Espionage Act is pretty broad. Nevertheless, there are still some general guidelines which cover it- Espionage Act

For example, in the section for "Gathering, Transmitting, or losing defense information", there is this bit:

Whoever, for the purpose of obtaining information respecting the national defense with intent or reason to believe that the information is to be used to the injury of the United States, or to the advantage of any foreign nation, goes upon, enters, flies over, or otherwise obtains information concerning any vessel, aircraft, work of defense, navy yard, naval station, submarine base, fueling station, fort, battery, torpedo station, dockyard, canal, railroad, arsenal, camp, factory, mine, telegraph, telephone, wireless, or signal station, building, office, research laboratory or station or other place connected with the national defense owned or constructed, or in progress of construction by the United States or under the control of the United States, or of any of its officers, departments, or agencies, or within the exclusive jurisdiction of the United States, or any place in which any vessel, aircraft, arms, munitions, or other materials or instruments for use in time of war are being made, prepared, repaired, stored, or are the subject of research or development, under any contract or agreement with the United States, or any department or agency thereof, or with any person on behalf of the United States, or otherwise on behalf of the United States, or any prohibited place so designated by the President by proclamation in time of war or in case of national emergency in which anything for the use of the Army, Navy, or Air Force is being prepared or constructed or stored, information as to which prohibited place the President has determined would be prejudicial to the national defense; or

Many sections of the Act include little phrases like this. It would be up to the U.S. to actually prove not only that he got the documents (which everyone pretty much knows), but that his intent was deliberately to cause harm to people.

So far as I know, it is shaping up pretty close to the aforementioned Pentagon Papers case. From what I know, a lot of the same issues that they brought up back then are being brought up now. And the Pentagon Papers were covered under the first Amendment. Not to mention the fact that, from the perspective of the Supreme Court, the government did not succeed in proving their case that the Pentagon Papers were causing enough harm for them to be censored.

And I haven't really seen anybody citing examples for the harm that wikileaks has caused. A lot of "hypotheticals", like "what if someone gets hurt because of the info?" and "what if other countries stop working with us?" and things like that. Nothing solid (at least nothing that would sway me if I were in court). So just from what I know, seems to be following the same kind of road....

In fact, here's what a senator said from the 1971 case (the senator supported the release of the pentagon papers):

Birch Bayh: “The existence of these documents, and the fact that they said one thing and the people were led to believe something else, is a reason we have a credibility gap today, the reason people don't believe the government. This is the same thing that's been going on over the last two-and-a-half years of this administration. There is a difference between what the President says and what the government actually does, and I have confidence that they are going to make the right decision, if they have all the facts.”

Sound familiar to anyone???

However, there's been a lot of misdirection/misrepresentation of the whole situation in the media these days. I don't know how the Pentagon Papers were covered in the media in their day, so I can't speak to that.

Parenti's article does the rounds every now and again. Michael Winn posted Parenti's article on the Healing Dao forum and also this critique:

http://forum.healingdao.com/general/message/15159

 

There's also this:

http://dissidentvoice.org/2008/04/a-lie-repeated-the-far-left%E2%80%99s-flawed-history-of-tibet/

 

And for an analysis that's still on my 'to read' list and challenges claims on both sides:

http://www.amazon.com/Authenticating-Tibet-Answers-Questions-Lilienthal/dp/0520249283/

Thought provoking stuff, there!

Interesting stuff ninpo, thanks!

tummo is simply body awareness in the subnavel region plus awareness at the perineum.

 

while maintaining this split awareness, take a deep breath and hold it for as long as you can.

 

Now you are a tummo master.

Where did you get this from?

Quite often A lucid dream IS an OBE in a real time zone if one projects out with memory.

 

There is very little difference within astral concepts.

 

Point remains: survivability.

Anybody mind asking Alfred E what he means by "survivability", how one would go about developing this skill, and otherwise a bit more elaboration?

He's ignored me and I don't think he can see my posts (I wouldn't know, I've never put someone on an ignore list )

that all makes sense and I, like you, look forward to more scientific evidence of things that are possible.I don't know why it is, but it seems the world over that the fewest people get to see the most far out stuff, so you had best learn whose word to trust if you aren't going to go to the trouble to find someone to show you in person or learn to do it yourself.

 

Also, there is a dictate in Taoism ... and myself, being a True Blue Taoist of the old school, I recognize great danger in personal display. It's a delicate thing, and best to show only your friends; in this case students and teachers being the friends. We don't wear no steenking uniforms and go around bowing in our family.

Yup, pretty much.

Sorcerer's Rule #1. Look for what is hidden.

 

If you learn to feel the force you could possibly sense the metal in the gun from a distance, or know of it because you can see his thinking.

How would you (star to, at least) go about doing this?

Hey, all! Didn't even see this topic untill now! Its great to see everyone being so passionate about this subject.

 

I my self cannot vote, because wikileaks kinda makes me sad. Went to school to learn about the history of propaganda and now I see media wars all over the world. So I try to avoid wikileaks, as I don't feel well the last few days.

 

Anyways! Have fun, everyone.

Yeah, wikileaks and the media frenzy has been the focus of several of my classes on the same, or similar subjects.

Interesting (and sad) to see different mechanisms in action.

I haVe wondered that too, have any theories? I think it has to do with Karma/rules. Funny, I know. But if rules didn't exist we'd probaBly have people performing amazing and unbelievable feats daily.

Maybe. I dunno how I feel about karma. It does make sense, and in some situations I'm likely to agree with it. But in others it just doesn't sit right with me though.

Who says these things don't happeen though? I say they do, but that is oonly. My opinion.

Oh well I fully believe that they do. And see this is the thing about me personally that doesn't always come across well....

I'm a junior in college right now. I have to do a lot of things academic. Paper writing, research, etc for both the humanities and the sciences. Now in such an environment, you see a lot of differences between personal and professional opinion. For instance, there are plenty of religious/spiritual scientists out there, but they make a distinction between what they believe to be true and what they can scientifically prove.

I am pretty similar.

I personally believe that humans are capable of doing awesome things. I believe there are people who HAVE actually done amazing things. I believe there are people PRESENTLY who can DO amazing things. That is my personal opinion and my personal belief.

Now, if I were going to write a research paper for a science class, would I have any support? Well..... it would be scarce, at best. There have been some interesting studies with tummo (see the thread). There have been some interesting studies with psi (Dean Radin is pretty vocal on that front). You can (quite successfully) make arguments that the scientific/public community is just not open to accepting these things even if they do see them, which is why there is not a lot of good research, and the good research that is out there doesn't get funding.

And that's all well and good.... but at the end of the day we are left with sparse amounts of research.

On top of that, there is the prevailing attitude in the spiritual community that, "I do not have to do any work. If you want to know, you must come to me. You don't believe me? Too bad, I can do X,Y, and Z, and I'm not gonna show you just because you ask, if you want to know, do it yourself!"

And, you know, that's fine. It's their prerogative to say/believe whatever they want. It's just that, from an investigative view, that is not a very promising sign. It doesn't mean they are lying. It's just not promising. And if everyone gave everyone the benefit of the doubt and tried things without proof, we'd all spend a lot of time and money figuring out who is a fraud and who is not, when a great way to expedite the process is "the burden of proof lies on the people making the claim". This way people don't have to spend significant amounts of time with potentially fraudulent systems and get nothing out of it (some claim you have to do a system for months or years before results, and if that person is a fraud, that's months/years down the drain for someone!)

So, yeah, personally, I'm a "believer". But nobody gets anywhere if we just pat each other on the back every time someone makes a wonderful claim about (as we understand the term now) superhuman feats. So on occasion I prefer to take up the "professional" approach, and investigate and ask questions.

And some people don't like that, and I'm sorry.

Trust me, even I feel like a dick saying, "why don't you prove it?" but, you know, as I said before- I would want people ask me tough questions and investigate me if I made claims, ESPECIALLY because there are lots of people looking for genuine methods. As a person who is dedicated to this path, and as someone who has been duped before, I know it's hard to find something real and good. And asking questions and being critical is a great way to weed out frauds, and help find a genuine person/practice.

And hopefully there are people who are helped by such critical inquiries.

The point is Not: how to get there - we all do that each night in the dream state - the point is how to survive there, in the mentaly conscious mode, within the enviornment of your own mind.

 

As a primer I would suggest you go to see the movie Inception so that you would at least have a small Idea of what the guardian of the Gates is... http://inceptionmovie.warnerbros.com/dvd/

What part of that film would you describe as "guardian of the gates"?

******SPOILER ALERT******

His subconscious memories of his wife that kept on getting in the way? The subconscious defenses of other people? The abyss that they could fall into if they were killed?

Yes, it is a bit...

Although it is also a test of who can survive in the 100% mental enviornment of the astral.

 

So many advice givers, Egomanical wannabe teachers reading from books, unable to see the realities of the enviornment they wish to boast of mastering.

 

In actuality, I did not issue a challange to Mal but rather I have given the point that all must answer to both visit the Astral and/or live within ones own mental confines.

 

suninmyeyes, if you are one of the ethinic Yiddish speaking peoples of the Balkans - you may have access to the key to the doors I am describing - listed here: http://bwtinc.org/default.aspx

You will need to be able to understand the language of Alchemy.

This is a College specializing in the the occult where my teacher of the Astral and Yoga had attended in the 1960's.

Interesting stuff.

Reminds me of http://www.thedivinescience.org/. A couple of the teachers are frequent posters on http://forums.vsociety.net/ (Prophecy and Veos), teaching a mix of Yoga and Franz Bardon's material. Bardon's material (Initiation Into Hermetics) is also said to be connected to the White Brotherhood/Lodge (a bit can be found in the book Frabato the Magician).

Though I did come across this article on Dr. Doreal. A bit old and seems to be incomplete (or maybe it's just that short?)

Hey Sloppy!

 

Dude... you are so thorough!

 

I am enjoying this discussion, thank you for participating.

 

I need to clarify that I think I am coming off as someone I'm not.

I do believe in corporal punishment for the offenders of our governmental

system. The constitution and all it stands for, is a masterpiece of governance.

 

I do not mean to sound so "dove" like. Because I am not. I do hold high standards

for my own conduct and treatment of others. This is because I find having a high

standard to be something that, even though I may not be able always attain, I like to

aim as high as I can. I guess it's a way of trying my best.

I have enjoyed this conversation as well

I am in agreement with most of what you said and commented.

I do choose to take issue with two things:

 

1:

 

The idea that a focus on what's simple and most important to me, my family and living

a full life, equates to ignorance because of my disgust for the slanted news media.

The news media, even not purposely watching tv, we are bombarded with constant news

related items. I would have to go live in a cave on a dessert island to really get away from it!

So, event hough I do not actively pursue watching TV, I am far from ignorant of what is

going on in the world. At the very worst...I'm just a little late getting up to speed.

And if something was to happen, such as world wide destruction... I'd be happy

right up to that last second before my eyeballs evaporated.

Well that's very good to hear!

I do agree with you that every news resource is going to have a slant. Many things are not reported even in large, mainstream outlets, though, and even if you are bombarded with stuff everywhere else, you still might be ignorant about lots of things. But when I say "ignorant", I don't mean it as harshly as the word itself comes across- it's just a statement about what one does not know. Even "well informed" people who routinely cruise the news sites (ABC, NBC, CBS, CNN, CNBC and things like that), would still be ignorant of a lot of things!

It's hard to know what you don't know!

2:

 

The second idea being, that physicality is so frequently necessary to resolve conflict.

I do agree that it's nice having people who look out for others, physically when

there is no recourse, but a reliance on solving problems with force is unconscionable

to me, if there is an alternate and non-harmful path to be taken.

I agree that physical force should be avoided, because it has a nasty way of mucking things up for everyone involved. However, we do live in a physical world, and I like to keep physical concerns in mind.

Sloppy, you sound to

me like a natural protector of the people. Like a present day Shaolin monk, ever

prescient for wrong doings, and ready to handle things physically. Not a bad thing

when warranted, and the body does not react without the say so of the intellect.

I don't know about that, but I do appreciate the kind thought

I just favor more peaceful means of solving problems, more so now then when I

was a younger man. So I am content to chock it up to my softening with age!

I wouldn't say softening up. Fighting really does take up a lot of resources, and causes a lot of wounds (physical and mental and spiritual). It's just hard to tell that if you haven't gone through it yourself, and most people go through fighting in their younger days, so by their older days, they realize it's best to avoid that.

Sloppy, thank you for your time and honesty!

 

Peace!

Thanks for yours as well!

Ahh, cool! Thanks Sloppy Zhang

Newport looks good...

Seth.

Yeah, I've seen some communities that don't like the way he markets stuff, but to be honest I haven't really looked into many of his products or considered buying his products, so I can't speak to that.

But what he does have up on youtube contains some pretty solid advice, IMHO.

Don't have much personal experience with the area, but I find that last bit intriguing.

I don't understand the poll - is the third option supposed to say 'wikileaks?' cos it says 'wikipedia'.

 

I think it was supposed to be a joke.

Like, you don't know what wikileaks is, and the only thing you've heard of that sounds vaguely like that is "wikipedia", so you're wondering if that's what everyone is talking about....

Right?

I personally think Michael Raduga's - School of out of Body travel, is by far the supreme book on the subject.

 

Nothing against Robert Bruce, and I recall enjoying astral dynamics many years ago, but he adds a whole bunch of his own unnecessary elements to the process.

 

The OBE process is

 

1. Relax deep.

 

2. Get to vibration state.

 

3. Exit.

 

Now different people get better results with different exit strategies, and vibration inducers, so a variety of techniques have to be available. Raduga's work offers that in the most [scientific?] no nonsense way I have seen in an OBE work. You do not have to believe in anything, be it energy, chakras, points in your fingers or esoteric...

Its just there as a variety of simple exercises that work to greater or lesser degrees depending on each person, and you experiment to see what is good for you.

 

Seth.

I agree (this is his site.... yeah, looks kinda sketchy, but the download pdf is legit, as is the material).

I have also come across these videos

One thing that Raduga recommends is to start doing exit techniques as soon as you start getting strong vibrations. The Newport (if I recall his name correctly ) actually says to wait until vibrations have subsided. He says that vibrations can be thought of as two different energy waves, the "physical" energy waves and the "non-physical" energy waves, and as non-physical energy waves reach a certain point, they react with physical energy waves, and produce vibrations. If you try exit techniques then, you will be doing a lot of work and struggling to overcome all the energy. But if you let the vibrations subside, then the "energy waves" will have reached a point where you are ready to exit, and the physical waves will have subsided to the point where you aren't at risk of moving your body.

Newport's movement free reality checks and exit techniques are also good because, as he accurately says, if you try one and fail, you are still relaxed. While some people suggest "just getting up", if you fail and get up using your body, you have to relax all over again. But if you fail in a movement free reality check/exit, you are still relaxed and can try again in minutes if not seconds.

Not to mention that sometimes you have situations in which you don't experience vibrations at all, but can still exit! So having other signs/methods of doing so help, and that's something that Robert Bruce talks about a bit as well.

Change your focus, from one of watching the world outside your widow with paranoid

apprehension, to one of accomplishing what is necessary to live a fuller, more content life.

Observation does not mean you are paranoid. Just because you see scary things does not mean you are afraid. Just because you reveal scary facts does not mean you are fear mongering. Just because you turn off the tv does not mean you are free from the shackles that bind. Just because you are a nice person does not mean you are changing anything. Just because Chen style tai chi is fast does not mean it's not tai chi.

Focus on what you do know.

Know yourself... know your life...

know that its up to you to make the best of your life right now in this moment.

I agree with this, however with a caveat of my own: not to the exclusion of all else.

Is filling this moment with fear for what's unknown or even unknowable, the best use of your existence?

Just because the truth is scary does not mean you are filling this moment with fear.

If you say yes, then I'm glad you are happy. But look deep to fully understand your motivation for your

acts/thoughts, if they are based on fear then most likely they are irrational as well.

As I have said in threads concerning self defense, preparation is not paranoia. Investigation is not fear. There is nothing irrational about looking through history and seeing, "wow, this is how tyrannical, dictatorial governments are formed out of republics (such as Rome)". There is nothing irrational about saying, "wow, there are people who wouldn't think twice about stabbing me and taking my money, we should have a profession of people who can apprehend such people (police)."

Only when we see clearly

why it is for the way we act and think does the opportunity to change present itself. Only then will you know

the possibilities, that you can choose to live a life not motivated by fear, but a life motivated by everyday

compassion, awareness, and reverence for the life you live.

I agree.

Fear is a tremendous weight, it is a burden you can choose not to carry. Just put it down, and walk away.

Again: preparation is not paranoia, caution is not fear.

You may ask, what kind of life is that?

I can only speak from my own experience( more boasting...sorry )

Life's focus for me has changed from being about all the business of the world to being about

what's right here, right before me. To m, that is my family, my friends, and the people I work with.

Have you ever seen the 2002 adaptation of the film "The Count of Monte Cristo"? I find it is a great movie, and illustrates exactly what it is I am talking about:

The man, Edmond Dantes, has done nothing other than live content with is life, has a successful business career, and is loved by a childhood sweetheart. This being his only wrongdoing, his jealous childhood friend betrays him, frames him for a crime, and sticks him in a conspiracy that sends him to prison for years. Though events of the movie took a fortuitous turn, he could just as easily have rotted away in prison until death, his childhood sweetheart living the rest of her life believing the lies she'd been told.....

Being a good person does not make the rest of the world good. I'm sorry, but it just doesn't.

Taking everyday just as it comes. Taking that days moments one by one and living within them fully-

feeling all that is happening within them fully. Experiencing those moments like they are their own complete

lifetimes, each one as full of mystery and pleasure as the next. The time spent with my loved ones is fresh

and new with this perspective, there is no hurrying or thinking about something else, there is only what's

happening right then at that moment, and it is the most important thing in the world.

Even at work or around complete strangers, all are opportunities to practice living fully,

to show compassion, to give of yourself without expectation.

 

Focus on the NOW and see how your life changes. It did for me.

That's good. But I wonder through what circumstances would that carry you through?

Poverty? Depression? Grievous injury? Grievous injury to your loved ones? Your powerlessness as those "above" you in society do what they want with you and your loved ones?

Though I'm sure you might consider that fear mongering, I consider it awareness and preparation.

Turning off the tv does not mean that there are no longer those who would take advantage of blissful ignorance and apathy of those who just don't want to deal with such scary things because they don't want to fill their lives with fear.

When someone says I'm American... what does it really mean?

Other than identifying your place of birth on this world, what does it say?

The only real use of such statements of other than factual reference, is one of pridefulness.

I am an american as well, but I do not succumb to thinking of myself or the country I was

born into as better, just because I'm here, and consider my countries rules to be better than yours.

Neither do I. It is a reflection of certain values which we have founded the country upon, and which we find to be right.

Just as you believe that people should not be controlled by fear or forced to do anything, well, so too did the founding fathers when they said that a government should not subject its people to doing things that they do not want to do, which is why they created a representative government!

If there are actions being taken which are NOT the will of the people, and if in fact there are actions being taken which are not in the best interest of those people, then the people doing such acts in government are NOT acting in accordance with the job they have been granted by the PEOPLE, and they should be removed and, if it is revealed something unlawful was done, they should be brought to trial.

If you believe that a certain group of people, because they are born into a certain family or have certain amounts of money, should be subjected to different laws or can act in their own interest even at the expense of others, well, that's not American. And if those people did the same things in that country, then they would not be doing anything unAmerican, and they would be breaking no laws, and there would be no reason for their people to bring to any sort of law.

(now whether you think it's okay to go into that place and "set things right", well that's just a whole other topic entirely )

All people's of this world can point to examples of patriotism, of honor, of peacefulness, and great intellect

within their own cultures history. The country we live in has NO ownership of being better somehow, we by

example, are no better than any other country, and so to the people living in that country.

No one is saying anything about "better". I am referring to certain parts of America which are written in law and which every American is held accountable to. If there are people in America who are breaking those laws, they should be brought to trail. That's how America works. If you don't like that, you either work to change the law, or go somewhere else. If you don't like how America is run, try to change it, then leave. If you think there is something "better" or "worse", then do something about, or go somewhere else. That's just how it works. That's how America was founded.

It's not a measure of value, it's just how the system works. I'm not saying it's "right" or "wrong" or "better", I'm just saying that's how the process works.

We live as a people who believe they possess, real, actual freedom, and that no other people of the world

experience freedom such as us. What we "americans" really have is the illusion of being free in a society that is

structured for slavery of the mind. We move about freely everyday, and can not see the shackles that bind

us, because they are not evident on our bodies, they exist within our minds.

We are confined by the limitations of our thoughts.

We are controlled by the approval of ignorance within our society.

I do not disagree with this.

There will always be governments to control world populations. This is inevitable.

I refer you to your own words above about the "structured slavery of the mind"

Furthermore, even though you may say "this is just how the system works", that does not excuse harmful behavior.

There will always be

those wishing to create chaos for their own benefit.

As above, so here

It is up to us as individuals to change.

Again, the keyword.

Fear mongering and the institution of united paranoia.

These are my suggestions to break the cycle of paranoia.

Turn of the TV whenever possible. Stop watching news programs! If you do, take what is said as just what it is,

"their story". Try taking 2 weeks off from watching any news program or any internet news.

See what a difference it makes to live your life without all the judgment being spoon fed to you thru the

TV or internet. Remember that the news is never impartial, you will always be presented with the side that

is motivated by what they have to gain, whether that be power of fortune. Fear is used constantly within news

stories. Fear is the most useful tool in evoking a response and destroying a rational ability to think.

All this does it make you ignorant of what is going on around you. Unless you work personally with many key members in Washington D.C. and you have friends who you talk to frequently and tell you about what's going on in the Pentagon, and you have friends who are members of the armed forces stationed all over the world.....

Turning off the T.V. doesn't change anything except allow you to be willfully ignorant of what's going on.

When you have all the available information and knowledge about a given situation,

and are able to see a course of action that allows for an outcome that is beneficial to all parties involved,

and causes no intentional harm, then this is rational, and (I Believe) wise decision making.

Well what happens when a criminal doesn't want to go to jail? What happens when someone who stole a bunch of money doesn't want to give it back? What do you propose we do then?

This ability is precluded if you are ruled by fear. When fear is your master there is no thought made that is

not clouded by its shadow. Stop the fear. Only speak of what you know to be true. Stop making judgments of

things you have the minimal amount of comprehension of, better to say you don't know or understand.

You are never going to be able to learn all the facts about anything if you turn off the tv and live in willful ignorance of what's going on, just because you think the news is scary and makes people afraid.

(I am going to make another post for the second half, as this is getting long!).

Self deception.

What is it?

Deluding oneself from something judged to be obvious? Wearing rose colored glasses and seeing a

distorted view of the world that is not real? Lying to oneself in a destructive manner, creating discord and harm?

Not necessarily- you could be deceiving yourself and life could turn out better.

"I'm not a mean person", "people love me", "my spouse is not cheating on me", "I love my job", can be lies that you tell yourself to get you to enjoy a life that, deep down, you do not enjoy, or things you do not agree with. It is still deception, because it does not line up with the physical reality that most of the rest of us interact with. But it helps you get through the day (and sometimes, helps you get through life).

Since "reality" is self-determinate, then can one on the outside say that someone else is being self-deceptive?

Or is it merely their judgment becoming an extension of their own reality, therefore making understanding of

someone else's view not possible? Of course anyone can call anyone else self-deceptive, but saying it doesn't make it true.

The world is what we determine it to be based on how we think.

I see that my speaking from my own experience is seen as boasting.

I guess everyone posting on TTB is guilty of that as well!

Speaking from one's life experiences could, I guess, be seen this way,

but the intent was not to boast. I do apologize if that is what your perception was.

I don't know that I can fully agree with the notion that we make our own reality. We may make our own CONCEPT of reality, and then, through various types of cognitive bias, accept or ignore different types of data which either support or deny the things we have already determined to be true.

Again, you can tell yourself that your spouse still loves you and would never cheat on you, and you might cite as evidence of this all the time he/she was nice to you, said they loved you, did nice things for you, but reject absences that could not be accounted for, phone calls to numbers you don't recognize, and purchases that you had no clue of.

lets say that all thats being said about this world and country, and government is correct. (And it really is, to you.)

How do you suggest that we proceed in making this country a better place? What in your opinion should we be doing?

I am honestly and sincerely interested, and ask that you please elucidate on what needs to be done and how this might

be accomplished. If you have awareness of what needs to be done, please share this information,

so we may participate if we so wish to. Logically, if we know what to do, and a course of action is clear and rational,

then it's just a matter of walking the walk and stopping all the talk.

Full scale investigation on everyone and everything. Total transparency. Of course, to a certain extent, as long as there are ongoing operations, not everything can be fully revealed publicly, because some people have raised valid concerns that certain released info could put lives in jeopardy. However, if it is discovered that military operations, known or covert, have transpired in an illegal fashion, if other types of illegal action have been taken, then the people who authorized it need to be found and brought to justice in accordance with the law.

I do have some caveats though......

 

The using of force to push people into action is a tactic of a mind controlled by fear.

So I would not participate in anything like that.

I don't know what you mean by "force". Are you suggesting that some might be suggesting that we "force" people to investigate? That we "scare" them into thinking that the government is scary and is doing illegal things to get them to act? Or that we "force" the perpetrators to go to prison for their crimes?

Because work WILL be involved. A change will have to happen. And there will always be those that resist change, there will always be those who will want to cling to their perfect la-la land of "as long as I didn't see it, I don't have to think about it!"

It's easy to believe all we are told. It requires no thought.

With thought there is a questioning of why, what we perceive to be, is.

The point Is when the outside influences of the world create a life filled with fear, and winnowed perception,

then life itself closes in on us. Things start to become all gloom and doom. Negativity is an all consuming fire.

Being cynical, pessimistic, and constantly looking for what's wrong leads to a pretty unhappy and dismal life.

It is the easier path, to give in to all of the imposed judgment and meted out portions of personal fear.

But it can reduce people to acting without compassion or understanding, thinking only of themselves in the end.

Not a pretty picture, negativity can do all this and more if you allow it.

You can face and deal with negativity without being a negative person. Drawing an example from spiritual cultivation, a cultivator can come across some very negative things, within themselves or in others.

But just because you realize that deep down inside you are a greedy, jealous person, that those around you are twisted and sick, and that life itself is an endless spiral of debauchery, ignorance, and hate, doesn't mean you should stop cultivating just because everything you see is "doom and gloom"!

What you should do is work through it and reach a point where all of that is resolved. That involves some work. Some people see this work as "force", kind of like how some people look at a Chen style tai chi form, which has fast movements and some fa jin, and say that it's not tai chi because it doesn't look slow and gentle!

The challenge is seeing the imperfections of this world as part of it's actual completeness.

I agree, but that does not mean we should excuse criminal behavior, behavior that purposefully damages (and loses) lives, simply because "imperfection is part of living in the world".

It is possible to look at the world, look at governments, look at the people you see everyday, and be positive

and make a difference in a way that is neither combative or contentious. Become more appreciate in your

everyday existence. Become more aware of the people and the stories of their lives. Show more empathy to

those you meet. Be slow to anger, but quick to smile with forgiveness. Make it a practice to feel compassion

for someone or something everyday.

You can feel compassion towards and forgive those who have done wrongs, but that does not mean you excuse them for those wrongs and let them off the hook.

The world changes because we change.

There's a keyword here, and I put it in bold. The world changes because WE change. Not just you. Not just me. But EVERYONE.

If I am the only nice person on the world, and everyone else is mean, and I am always nice, and everyone else is always mean, am I changing the world? No, I'm just the only nice guy.

But if one mean person changes to a nice person, and another mean person changes to a nice person, THEN the world changes.

And with our own small changes, we culmatively create the world that will be in the future.

Are you helping to create a world you want to live in, by your everyday actions?

If not isn't it time to do something differently?

Gandhi said, "Be the change you wish to see in the world".

Don't wait for permission to enact this principle. We create the change by the people we are, our actions,

our thoughts, our influence on all of the people we meet, these are the elements of real meaningful change.

If compassion and understanding are needed in the world, you are the first step in the manifestation of this

new reality. It always starts with you.

The question is not if it will start, but if it will continue.

Though you may be the change you wish to see in the world, that does not mean others will change along with you.

(had to break it up, it was too long!)

Some things, many things, are best left unshown; particularly when it comes to combat.

I'll clarify my position a bit-

I'm for people backing up their claims with evidence. Lots of people have heard of tummo, of monks being able to heat up their bodies. It's a claim that's been around for a while. And there is evidence.

There are claims that have been around for a while, but for which there is little (or no) supporting evidence. I am an avid supporter of the position that there should be evidence for these, and that people making the claims should step forward and allowed themselves to be tested in a manner similar to that of the monks in the original post.

However, everyone has a right to privacy. There are those who do not want to reveal their arts to the masses. They live and teach (and sometimes do not teach) in obscurity. No one knows who their are, what their arts arts, or what they can do- and that is perfectly fine. I do not advocate hunting down people in obscurity and forcing them to step out into the public sphere if they don't want to.

I advocate finding people who ARE in the public sphere, who HAVE made claims, and holding them to their word.

And I think they should learn from these monks' example and not be afraid of subjecting themselves to such tests. If they have a valid, reliable, successful method, they have absolutely nothing to fear. If they are honest, and can do the things they say they can do, they have nothing to fear, and the only thing that will happen is that we will learn more about what humans are capable of.