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As I know chinese mentality always assumed that a disciple must not only do what teacher says but also do some works for him without arguing that its too much etc.

From the other side someone who teaches also lives to some extent in society and also needs money to buy necessary things.

This is a simple rational why it is fair that teaching costs money.

Rgrds, Ilya

Take with caution Wang Chongyang works.Hardly is he Xian when he die because of big health problems in his 58 year.

His wife expell him from house because he was acochol addict.

His meeting with Zhongli Quan and Lu Dong Bing in tavern where they drink vine can also be his alcoholic halucinations.He say that they initiated him in tavern,can you imagine this?

 

In his first works he speak about refining Jing,Qi and blood and not Shen.

 

His intervention to separate Ma Danyang and Sun Buer hardly is moral and not to mention respecting others will and self choice.

 

 

Ormus

Wang Chongyang is one of the greatest taoists.

He is a founder of Quanzhen school and one of the 5 northern patriarchs of this school.

He is a known person.

Do you have any source for your conclusion or may be you have been confused with some other person?

Rgrds, Ilya

The more good things in live we have,the easier life is. But the easier our life is the smaller intent to become stronger, more smart etc. we have.

Why do I need to calculate numbers? There is a calculator for it.

Why do I have to remember my plans? There is an electronic adviser with reminder system.

Why do I need to grow plants for food? There is a shop, mechanic machine etc.

We lose smth with every step in technical progress ad it will last on and on untill we become absolutely dependent upon machines, mechanisms and comfort conditions.

I do not deny ming cultivation. I am alive and well now thanks to it. What i deny, is the existence of a separate and secret ming cultivation practice, particularly in the commercial neidan.

 

I personally know very well what i cultivate, thnk you very much.

 

There was a good question in another thread. If you understand Ming practice you could answer the questions:

- Where is Ming located?

- How do you notice that your Ming (yuanqi) is being regenerated?

- How do you distinguish it from ordinary qi? How does it correspond with ancient Daoist writings?

 

The reason you addressed your post to me is obviously to get my opinion. Here it is: in a few years from now, with youthfulness gone and the clock ticking, you will blame your lack of results on a bunch of reasons. No money to buy the secrets of ming, work, teachers, worldly distractions etc etc...but you will overlook the real reason - your wrong choice of the obvious now.

 

Taking into account your detailed emotional description this might be a result of your choise and your way. But as we go different ways it is likely that our results will also be different.

A pure karma concept as I understand is not regarded in Taoism. It's main target is to develop a body and mind in this current life regardless on what a practitioner has brought with him from his past.

TT,

If you deny ming cultivation then it is clear that you don't need any methods. Just relax in meditation and claim that you reached smth you say "Dao".

But if we agree that ming practive is important, then it is obvious that it needs some actions which are based on methods. Otherwise you will be trying to cultivate smth-don't-know what...

But you seemed to place focus on the scholary part rather than the mystic practice.

I think that mystic aspect is mystic only for those who do not know concrete steps in the practice and then it obtains some "unknown" mystery. If someone really achieved results in practice then it should be like an algorithm of specified actions that can lead his disciples to the same achievement.

Rgrds, Ilya

Of course i did.

If you have reached Dao can you explain what have you obtained?

Or the answer will be smth like Dao put in words is not the constant Dao...?

King Huang said, “Without thinking and without pondering, you will understand Dao. Without conducting and without acting, you will be peaceful in Dao. Taking no route and using no method, you will arrive at Dao.

May be you have already arrived to Dao, without method and road?

If so, then may be you are already free from sleeping or taking food?

I think that the best way to improve karma is just to have regular practice, to do smth good and to share your methods with those who are willing to develop. And no matter if it is a martial art or some qi gong practice, the only thing is that it should not lead people to the wrong way and wrong results.

Yes, there must be some method, the method is "no method", ha.

 

I don't cheat you.

 

That is how I cultivate every day.

If someone practices something without any concrete method then there is a little chance to achieve a result. It's like you want to go somewhere but do not have a road.

Rgrds, Ilya

My current understanding is that enlightenment is not the cornerstone of Taoism, but the elixir. Of course you are not able to achieve realization without successful xing practice which can be considered as analogue to enlightenment, but only approximately. So in this case enlightenment is only one part of practice, from the other side you need to do something with your body.

Rgrds, Ilya

As I have read there is no enlightenment as a pure concept in Taoism, it is very close to heart stability which is one of the results in Xing practice, but not the only. Taoism doctrine assumes the adept to train both heart and body, xing and ming, and only in this case harmony is possible.

Rgrds, Ilys

One thing that does always work is being active. Moving around a lot, even if just washing up with some "gusto" can help. Doing light exercises, gentle jogs, martial arts, weight lifting. All those things say to my body "you need to breathe so I'm going to allow it"

Pushups are quite useful in this case - when you stay with your hands and foots on the floor and then move the body down and up with your hands. This thing always helped me in 100% cases.

"Thousands of years ago the immortals known as the Shining Ones shipwrecked on the Chinese coast. Passing their shamanic practices--such as ecstatic flight and how to find power animals and spirit guides..." Mantak Chia

 

 

Is it really possible that immortals used shamanic practice? Shamanic practice as I heard does not do anything with energy cultivation and lifetime prolongation...

I believe that a teacher should have a clear picture of expected progress, a system of trainings for development of his disciples and methods appropriate for each training. If anything of it is missing then the results of the study may be unpredictable.

Rgrds, Ilya

 

 

Idea number two... Did you have smokers in your life in your childhood? I'll share idea number two if you respond to this question first.

If you smoked earlier and your training provides you with some ridding of toxins then may be it is your own pollution with smoke leaving you.

Taoist Alchemy as taught in diverse schools seems to be made artificially complicated to dillute the clearness of the original teaching and to give power to the schools and teachers.

The raja yogi and yogis of other traditions get the vajra body without all this BS and with a simple and straightforward method.

I heard enough, I am out of here...

Seems a bit strange to claim Chinese tradition as a bs due to its so called difficult concept and at the same time to say that analogue teachings give vajra body easily. Or may be I misunderstood smth in your post or you have some valid secret method?

We should distinguish between facts and theoretical knowledge. Experience of qi will be a fact. Lots of practitioners will have this experience, so you can't really call it BS. As for how yuanqi behaves over the lifetime - I'd say very few people really know if at all? Because reference to the old textbooks might as well be just a theory, what matters is actual experience and practice.

That's what I was trying to say - we can not ignore qi itself and a huge scope of I trainings such as qi gong, cultivation or alchemy. May be some systems are invalid due to absence of transmission line or other reasons, but the qi concept itself has a long years base and strong cultural and practical traditions. This is all from my point of view.

 

Rgrds, Ilya

Should the true teacher have a high level of qi and how to understand it?

Should the true teacher have a harmonized heart and how to feel it? Should the true teacher be perfect in everything if this is possible?

It's not my duty to prove your claims,

it's yours.

And so far, no proof or evidence was given that people after birth receive yuanqi through some obscure continuous transmission from som obscure source until they are 17 years old! I call BS!

This is my general understanding of the process based on what I have read. The exact mechanism of this process I guess is a secret, no one will explain it in details in forum discussions. It's your choise to think that its a "bs" but in this case all methods of qi gong, qi itself are also a "bs", isn't it?

"Heaven and earth are ruthless, and treat the myriad creatures as straw dogs; the sage is ruthless, and treats the people as straw dogs."

 

What is this?

 

May be this means that people should not take heaven as something to help and should put efforts for own development by themselves?

A. A marketing hoax in the western commercial neidan.

By the seminar-sellers, Ming work is touted as a recipe for becoming physically younger . When asked to show their before and after photographs, the seminar-sellers vehemently refuse to do so. Therefore it is a bait-and-switch hoax,

Ming practice is a subject of alchemy schools. As I understand qi gong does not deal with ming methods.

Do you have your personal experience in this practice?

If you say that ming practice is a fake then why do you think ming methods still remain in secret and are treated as most valued ones in alchemy schools? Is it reasonable to keep in secret “low” methods and in the same time show openly xing gong methods if they are higher then ming ones?

Rgrds, Ilya

I guess there is a big difference between sudden enlightenment (becoming aware, understanding oneselfs nature etc) and constant nourishing/accumulating ones qi level.

Ones mind can be enlightend, but nourishing qi requires time and regular work, for me it is obvious.