iain

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  2. Posted · Edited by iain

    Wasn't it that he (and/or the Thule society) were interested in the potential power that could come from the knowledge from those areas? AFAIK he was very interested in the type of archeology and ancient studies that could give him an advantage. Thus all the talk about nazi UFO projects, likely related to the information in ancient Indian texts about vimanas. That would explain why he chose the swastika as his symbol. Also because it's regarded as a symbol of good luck. (And the SS using ancient rune letters is based on the same mindset.) And the name "Aryans" refers to a god race that came from the sky, with blond hair and blue eyes, so that's where that came from.

    BTW, there's a funny coincidence about "88" being code speech for "Heil Hitler" in Germany (HH - H being the 8th letter in the alphabet), but in China, the number 88 is regarded as a symbol of good luck, too.

    Well... ultimately it shows how little symbol worship manifests in the substantial realm, lol. ... Then again, he survived several attempts on his life and made it quite far in his plans.

     

    Well the name swastika when broken down gives the following:

     

    swa = self

    astika = faithfull, having faith in God, pious, the length of eight.

     

    Astika and Nastika can represent the two different directions of rotation of the symbol, and with that masculine or femanin dominance; energetically speaking of course.

     

    But also āstika means "theist", while nāstika means "atheist"

     

    The symbol represents universal growth or upachaya, some say the rotation of the galaxy, solar system, the Earth. The rotation and the 4 kendra being critical to Hindu astrology.

    This rotation and direction are key aspects of the mathematics of hindu astrology the swastika represents the winds of change .Stability is shown in a chart (or the lack of) via this kendra (cross) and its potential for movement. If the arms at the end of the cross go in an anti zodiacal direction this is symbolic of material prosperity where as in the anti zodiacal direction this indicates spiritual prosperity. Known as the savya svastika and apasavya swastika, right and left handed. Now, if the swastika is turned 45° on to its point and is shown to be fallen, then this indicates very strong winds of change.Giving the patita savya svastika and patita apasavya swastika alternately, thus Hitlers usage was of the patita apasavya swastika, or the fallen left-handed swastika, perhaps wishing destruction of religion or spiritual things.

     

    My instinct toward a reference to 88 would be first to 8 and 8 rather than 88 (in matters that concern the swastika) there is a highly important numerical concept used when considering Sanskrit text; that of bhavat bhavam. To understand this principle, which is fundamental to the construction of the chandas or rhythm in mantra, and also the functionality of the kundali or birth chart. We count starting from 1 not 0 and when we arrive at 13 we go back to 1; so when I think of 88 here this thought springs to mind; it could be referring to the 8th from the 8th; the 8th house representing sudden change and the end of things and the 8th from the 8th (the 15th) being thus the 3rd bhava, a house of upadesha or rapid growth perhaps universal (also shows death of the father and or collapse of the temple).

     

     

  6. Posted

    Atheists do not recommend nor support the beheading of those who have beliefs other than their own.

     

    After the separation of state and religion, political and financial excuses are then used to behead nations instead of individuals; higher means & higher stakes ...

     

    Same old human nature.

    • Like 1

  7. Posted · Edited by iain

    Yes, I know. There will always be someone to disagree with me concerning this concept. But I have seen no evidence to cause me to believe it to be so - just like I have seen no evidence to cause me to believe that there are gods.

     

    I am a Materialist. There are many Spiritualists here who agree with you.

     

    And I do not equate Chi with Consciousness, I equate it with "energy".

     

    Perhaps, you are confusing conciousness with ego? ;)

     

    Ego can be possessed in the tradition in materialist idioms and doctrine, for example; " so and so owned so and so, in that conversation"; The universe certainly has no ego. Conciousness just is, and it is aware of that which it is not because it is seeking that.

     

    How else would a flower follow the sun?

    • Like 1

  11. Posted

    Yeah, I think this is likely a carry-over from the Hindu religion. I doubt the Buddha talked much about gods.

    Gautama Buddha is considered to have been an avatar and thus an incarnation of Vishnu by some Hindus; other Hindus are Atheists but are still Hindus; All very colorful.

     

    • Like 1

  12. Posted

    He was talking about the continued search for knowledge and he stated that the universe is infinite but the mind is limited. To seek the knowledge of the infinite with a limited mind causes exhaustion and that is not the Way of Tao.

     

    (Crudely paraphrased.)

     

    Thank you; sounds like he knew his Yo from his Wu ...

    • Like 2

  13. Posted

    Sure, but by having a title in a thread, having some sort of coherence is useful...especially if I'm left "not understanding" your quantum slit analogy, then we have a little chat about it, and then I realise that I made it clear nearly a week ago that I knew where you were coming from.

     

    Yes, the dominating majority, definitely. But let's not forget a huge percentage of these are religious (in their mind)

     

    Fair play to your last statement, and that certain divide indicates to me that atheism is not a religion, because we cannot put everybody under the same roof in this way. Likewise, you could argue this with any religion, due to the fact that they all have schisms.

     

    I don't feel the need for a label, because it pigeon-holes the belief system that one "belongs to". Despite my love for Lao Tzu's philosophy, or Chuang Tzu's, Buddha's, Einstein's, Sam Harris' - if I say I'm a Taoist, I'm lying. If I say I'm a Buddhist, I'm lying. If I say I'm an atheist, I'm lying.

     

    Atheism can be followed like a religion. Then how do we define religion? How does that differ from cult?

     

    Then what about the individuals? The "atheists" that have explored the spirituality? Are they equally as spiritually liberated as those that have the same comfort in claiming to have found enlightenment?

     

    So many variables here...

     

    Atheism sure can be likened to a religion if you string enough similarities together.

     

    My real question then, is...who really cares?

     

    Who really cares?

     

    Most care, but usually only for the pack solely for self defense and procreation; but there are a rare few jem's who elevate them selves from this state of consciousness, to think of others and consider the bigger picture. Mostly it depends on birth circumstances, relating to the past and possible futures.

     

    Theology is an out growth of this same dark energy; the deva are our emotions, they were there before we could label and pigeon hole them into any polytheistic doctrine.

    • Like 1

  14. Posted

    I have spoken to this before. Actually, only 4 percent of what is thought to be the totality of the universe is presently knowable and there is still a lot we need to learn about that. The rest, thought to be Dark Matter and Dark Energy is presently unknowable.

     

    Chuang Tzu warned us of this 2400 years ago.

     

    What did Chuang Tzu have to say on the subject?

     

     

  15. Posted · Edited by iain

    108 is the ratio between the Sun's diameter and its distance from earth; the same ratio of 108 applies to the moon in the same respect; this is why eclipses occur in the way that they do.

    What might eclipse the Mind if it also reflects, just like the Moon?

    • Like 3

  16. Posted · Edited by iain

    All you need do is to realize that all that you think you are; is quite simply the reflection of the Sun of off your mind.
    As light reflects off of either the Moon or a mirror so it reflects from you. Though it first passes first through a biological maze, it is still simply that, reflected light; particle spin included. That biological maze is nothing compared to the time it takes to first leave the Sun ...

    Don't go staring at the Sun, you will go blind.

  18. Posted · Edited by iain

    ya'll heard that steven hawking now has a facebook page

    his opening post

    "I have always wondered what makes the universe exist. Time and space may forever be a mystery, but that has not stopped my pursuit. Our connections to one another have grown infinitely and now that I have the chance, I’m eager to share this journey with you. Be curious, I know I will forever be."

    some of hawking's curiosity is found in this short article

    http://online.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052748704206804575467921609024244

     

    He is describing exactly that which I worship as a Jyotisa, curious to read.

    Though in the line "Time and space may forever be a mystery," I am drawn to think of the statement made, I believe, by Lord Kelvin just before relativity was realized by the Occident. "That all of science is now known, all that remains is to fill in a few gaps.", something to that effect.

    Though a great man, he is a bit of a media Junkie ... Many in the field refute his beliefs.

    • Like 1

  19. Posted · Edited by iain

    So is this your main point for the thread? I'm just trying to get some sort of answer...by "we" are you just talking about the majority of the world? If talking about atheism explicitly, is this a closed-minded type of religion for you?

     

    I feel from your tone Rara, that you are a little irate.

     

    That the universe is 75-80% dark mater, dark energy and unknowable; this was in year one of my Jyotiṣa course; it is fundamental to sanātana dharma and very old news.

     

    I don't make points and write lists, I am a non linear thinker; answers have to be heard. By "we", I am talking about the the most domineering percentage of the human population; the aggressive ones with the technology that is allowing them to destroy the planets beautifully balanced ecosystem. I am talking about an sub group of humans, with a particularly aggressive psychological phenotype, the ones that know no doubt and who certainly do not need God to encourage them when in doubt, due to their distinctive lack of self doubt.

     

    Atheism, to my mind : there are two types of Atheist; those who have realized the highest aspect of reality in consciousness and have discarded the sheath that is God, and those who have no feelings at all, who can not understand why any might need a God in the first place. To my mind, those that lack the empathy to perceive why one might need a God, are often the cause of the more sensitives empathetic angst in the first place; denominating them selves as God and then enslaving others.

    In response to your question; "is this a closed-minded type of religion for you?" ...

     

    I will reply that; it is ignorance.

     

  20. Posted · Edited by iain

     

    These suggestive “parallels”, as interesting as they are, fall short of a proof. What would be required of a proof would be an exact mathematization of the concept of the Akasha Tattwa and a demonstration that this mathematical model was related to quantum mechanics in general and the higgs boson in particular. I myself model akasha as four dimensional substance, but I have not worked that out to any great precision, it is more of a conceptual investigation.

    Jyotisa is that. I have seen enough to be convinced; also direct experience of that in the form of śaktipāta; I have already expressed why I believe the scientific axioms fall short if we want to measure a relative world.

     

     

    What can be inferred from Quantum Physics relative to materialism is a reductio ad absurdum disproof of both mechanism and atomism as conceived of by science from the time that it was “grandfathered” in to the “Scientific Revolution” at the end of the the Seventeenth Century to 1900. This model was derived from the revival of Epicureanism circa 1600 by the efforts of Pierre Gassendi, and which, for reasons that have more to do with the religious controversies of the Sixteenth and Seventeenth Centuries than with any newly awakened spirit of "objective" investigation, became an unexamined and later unquestionable proposition at the base of the “Scientific Revolution”. It was never directly subjected to scientific scrutiny itself, but rather simply assumed to be the truth. Quantum Physics is its formal and experimental refutation.

    A pleasure and experience to read you as you are clearly highly learned in these matters. The Higgs Boson was a mathematical glue the existence of which was stipulated so as to balance the particles in the standard model; It is not a particle neither are any of the particles particles; there is a problem in the inherent assumption of the linearity of time.

     

     

    I don't think formal causes would be like karma as I understand it, formal causes are one of Aristotle's four causes, a set of ideas that have been very useful to me in my studies, you can read a fair introduction to them on Wikipedia here:

     

    Aristotle's doctrine of the Four Causes

     

    Also related to formal causes and very useful is Aristotle's doctrine of Potentiality and Actuality, again Wikipedia is satisfactory:

     

    Aristotle's doctrine of Potentiality and Acuality

     

    and of course Hylomorphism:

     

    Aristotle's doctrine of form and “matter”

     

    These are some of the useful ideas that Aristotle has, but I don't think that it is very useful to get too caught up in him. What is important is how these ideas were integrated into a Platonic framework by the Middle Platonists, finally reaching a well formed synthesis in the work of Plotinus and further developed by his successors.

    Thank you for the links, You are quite right this is not similar to Karma at all; I just had a thought though, karma is rather like a Feynman diagram. Plotinus looks interesting and at least refers to the importance put on astrology at that time, our current history books seem to be rather forgetful of this fact. Indian philosophy, to me, seem to be far more advanced; though the lack of importance that they put on linear history, make it difficult to explain to what extent. Sanskrit its self, is a non linear language, containing many mathematical elements within the text. Rather, in the sutra.

    The upaniṣadaḥ are indicative of an understanding of the nature of reality as demonstrated in the quantum slit experiment, showing just how different our styles of thought are. The upaniṣadaḥ or upanishads as proses predate any of these philosophies and being accompanied by a verbal tradition of knowledge that runs much deeper. The different style of living and thought is exactly why we are still struggling today in the Occident to accept the reality of the quantum physical world. As I have previously mentioned, there is already a fully working mathematical model which demonstrates how the quantum world interacts with the relative world and our experience of it. But the Western world seems to be to self obsessed to investigate it. Thus my suggestion that the Higgs boson is Akasha tattva, I am currently studying a fully functioning predictive model that clearly shows the importance of Akask tattva in our daily lives and have no need to prove that it fits with the Occidental model.

     

    I keep hearing "World this and that" world health, world bank; but to my mind it is all occidental cerebral projection. That is the fundamental nature of our ancient boards of scholars, and why I have made that reference in a previous post.

     

    F. Max Muller wrote from a generally Protestant and specifically Lutheran perspective. This is a man who left the Roman Catholic and Greek Orthodox Churches out of his "history" of Christianity. He is hardly a representative of an “occidental establishment of traditional scholars”, much less an “ancient” one. Regrettably, since he was one of the founders of modern Sanskrit and Indian studies, his eccentric point of view colored subsequent inquiry longer than it should have.

    I am very ignorant of the different branches of the Christian faith and the first to admit that. I have heard it suggested that these translations were shoehorned into the prevailing occidental world view, with the same aggression as that of the world colonizations of that time. That it was was a planned perversion, the tantra of later years of Indian thought had already been percieved as devil worship and those who practiced it in the Occident were killed as heretics, the fabrication of Aryan theory is fundamentally the cause of the Nazi movement and those responsible to my mind are also practicing these tantra "in the family" as it were. This will appear radical to one who has not studied Jyotiṣa.

     

    It is a pleasure to communicate with someone so knowledgeable in Occidental philosophy studying Indian philosophy myself, it is enlightening to see and try to understand a little more of another perspective.

     

    Kind regards.

  23. Posted · Edited by iain

    it doesnt have to be the poet per se, could be the quantum physicist, the artist, the philosopher, the psycologist, neurologist, etc but from any area one great thinker can come along and upset the status quo

    and a new way emerge.

    but in ancient greece i think the poet was onto it first. and this idea arise in sufi thought as elsewhere , i mentioned previous, da vinci tells us to closely study the ancients rather than the modern.

     

    कवि kavi in Sanskrit, it has interesting connotations, meaning Poet, but also; Enlightened, Venus, Singer Sage; pick your meaning. To what was being referred and how has our understanding possibly change from the original intention of the author? I changed "Writer" to "Author" after the thought, intentionally as my understanding of that period is effected by my understanding of now, so I correct for that. We might well consider that higher knowledge is both transient and transcendental. Not junk knowledge which is attached to material things; lasting only short period of time, like for instance; knowledge of a typewriter ...

  25. Posted · Edited by iain

    Certainly not because of this:

     

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26YLehuMydo

     

    or wait a moment maybe it is because of that.

     

     

    Erwin Schroedinger became deeply involved in Indian thought in his later life and wrote:

     

    My View of the World

     

     

    I enjoyed Werner Heisenberg's:

     

    Physics and Philosophy

     

    more. Heisenberg had an excellent grasp of the history of Philosophy and Science.

     

    Great points Zhongyongdaoist,

     

    Best that I do not start a tangent about the damage caused by the calculated mistranslations of vedic works by Max Muller; All of course funded by the ancient occidental establishment of traditional scholars.

    Apparently it has been cited by the BBC that this was intentionally done, but I have not personally read the article; so I won't mention that here.

     

    The epitaph was given to CERN by the Indian Government in celebration of the work of Fritjof Capra.

     

    http://www.fritjofcapra.net/shiva.html

     

    Shiva's Cosmic Dance at CERN

    On June 18, 2004, an unusual new landmark was unveiled at CERN, the European Center for Research in Particle Physics in Geneva — a 2m tall statue of the Indian deity Shiva Nataraja, the Lord of Dance. The statue, symbolizing Shiva's cosmic dance of creation and destruction, was given to CERN by the Indian government to celebrate the research center's long association with India.

    In choosing the image of Shiva Nataraja, the Indian government acknowledged the profound significance of the metaphor of Shiva's dance for the cosmic dance of subatomic particles, which is observed and analyzed by CERN's physicists. The parallel between Shiva's dance and the dance of subatomic particles was first discussed by Fritjof Capra in an article titled "The Dance of Shiva: The Hindu View of Matter in the Light of Modern Physics," published in Main Currents in Modern Thought in 1972. Shiva's cosmic dance then became a central metaphor in Capra's international bestseller The Tao of Physics, first published in 1975 and still in print in over 40 editions around the world.

    A special plaque next to the Shiva statue at CERN explains the significance of the metaphor of Shiva's cosmic dance with several quotations from The Tao of Physics. Here is the text of the plaque:

    Ananda K. Coomaraswamy, seeing beyond the unsurpassed rhythm, beauty, power and grace of the Nataraja, once wrote of it "It is the clearest image of the activity of God which any art or religion can boast of."

    More recently, Fritjof Capra explained that "Modern physics has shown that the rhythm of creation and destruction is not only manifest in the turn of the seasons and in the birth and death of all living creatures, but is also the very essence of inorganic matter," and that "For the modern physicists, then, Shiva's dance is the dance of subatomic matter."

    It is indeed as Capra concluded: "Hundreds of years ago, Indian artists created visual images of dancing Shivas in a beautiful series of bronzes. In our time, physicists have used the most advanced technology to portray the patterns of the cosmic dance. The metaphor of the cosmic dance thus unifies ancient mythology, religious art and modern physics."