sunchild

PS, if you don't mind, how old are you?

mid twenties.

you know that time of "life" where you should be most "alive". that time when you should be established within society. that time when you should be well on your career path. that time when you should have your own place. that time when you should be exploring your world. that time when you should be meeting new people and learning.

does that answer satisfy?

At this point I must reiterate something that I posted to another member a few days ago.

 

What you have said here is your choice. You have chosen to believe this...this is why you are so defiant to accept another philosophy.

 

All you have to do is invert your belief. I make it sound easy...and it so isn't but once you do it, you realise it IS easy.

 

But in your current state of mind, you can't and won't be helped. Not by any of us, but yourself. Only YOU have the power to overcome this mindset...once you have, you can pick the advice you feel works for you.

well said.

it just becomes quite tiring, the 'believing', the 'living'.

i don't particularly want to die, but i haven't a reason to live anymore.

i think i engage in self destructive acts around these times because it temporarily relieves me of the stress of living a meaningless existence, as it draws my attention/focus elsewhere, and that it brings me that much closer to death. i used to think suicide was something that could be "worked up to"- now, i think it just happens once you've had enough.

honestly, i don't want to live anymore. losing my last friend shot my optimism.

death murder suicide, it's all the same right. same source right. all is one right. all going to the same place right.

When my partner was in the height of his depression he eschewed the whole idea of enjoying life. The idea that happiness is for shallow fools is common among those with chronic mood difficulties.

 

I don´t think happiness--or even fun--is antithetical to spiritual development. You can be enlightened and still have a blast in life. In fact, I´d say spiritual development expands a seekers ability to feel good exponentially. Gurus have a good time, they just do it without a "self."

 

Liminal

"among those suffering chronic mood difficulties".. you mean like everyone?

feeling good "exponentially" doesn't seem too realistic or balanced.

they just do it without "self"... doesn't sound humanly possible.

"gurus have a good time"... could you specify please? i haven't heard of gurus doing much else but trying to "teach" others to erase there sense of self/personality to the point of most of them becoming "exponentially" happy subservient slaves of a hive mind variety that only seem to be concerned with "enlightening" others as they are and "healing" others with varying techniques- they like to keep it all very "positive".

Depersonalization and spiritually losing yourself are two very different things, depersonalization is a form of dissociation where you become less and less in touch with your body and genuine feelings, the only correlation can be if your suffering gets so bad that you let go and in that you become open to what you really are.

that's most likely what happened.

i don't think "fun"/"happiness" is something to be had/revel in, in this world. i don't think we are here for any of that. this world feels more like hell everyday, especially with all the new technology.

if most of the people here are only achieving peace of mind/happiness through methods of detaching from the world around us, what does that say about the world. perpetual pain, suffering, war and loss...

the thing i find most interesting about many people who've had a spiritual experience, or reached a certain level of attainment- is that their main focus in life afterwards is almost purely spiritual. it's like they can't return

I can relate to this actually because I felt the same thing happening to me. You realise that nothing is 'solid', nothing lasts, nothing has any innate meaning other than the meaning we ascribe to it. The world isn't what we imagined it to be for all those years and "I" am not what I imagined myself to be. I think maybe depersonalisation is the realisation that there is no person as such...it's a construct, a dream character like whoever we happen to dream ourselves to be at night.

 

Also the moment we chase after something in the world and attain it is the moment we lose it because of the ever-changing nature of the dream. I got very depressed and demotivated over this. I had similar symptoms to you, Sunchild. Friendships slipped away and my emotions evened out so much I didn't experience great elation about anything anymore but neither did the little things (or even at times fairly 'big' things) bother me.

 

I like the teachings of vedanta though because they help us see that the emptiness is not the final stage, that the emptiness is actually a fullness. James Swartz says that after all this realisation stuff, it's important to give the mind something to do -- the mind is goal-oriented so it helps to still do things we enjoy...not because we seek to gain something from it, but just to give the little dream self some projects to keep it happy and ticking over Whatever floats our boat, as they say. I write. And I got a puppy. Animals rock.

dogs love me.

i don't really care about many things i used to do. it is all so trivial/inconsequential now.

i like to write, but i've had no motivation for months- the most writing i do is on here seeking advice/attention for my latest spiritual/mental crisis.

so the 'demotivation' i can relate to, but as of now the 'depression' has taken an exit in favor of indifference. life has become highly impersonal and empty.

i don't really care what floats my boat anymore, because it's like i don't have one anyway.

It's temporary - you are expressing exactly what it feels like for an energetic sensitive to transit through the 2010-14 ascension process.

 

We've lifted the earth up from the 3rd dimension to the 5th and are now rooting in the new grid.

 

What you are describing is end times symptomology.

 

Focus on what you love and desire.

i don't believe you.

so i should so narrowly focus on something that i selfishly desire, to the point where 'the bigger picture' becomes obscured and all that i can see is exploding pixie sticks and unicorns? i guess that's what most people are doing.

You are loved.

 

Know that to be true beyond everything else.

 

We don't know what spiritual/meditation work you are doing if you'd care to elaborate.

 

Beyond your spiritual work - much work is being done for you right now on a cosmic level. We are poised on the brink of entering the new earth grid. Go and read Karen Bishop's blog, she expresses these ascension symptoms beautifully.

 

You are feeling de-personalised because your whole psyche and energetic framework has been cleansed, rewired, and is about to be re-rooted into a new grid - an multidimensional earth grid.

 

That is not to dispel your personal life experiences - that is the true playing field upon which you are unfolding those adjustments.

 

Yes, you are right - the time to give up is now. But, what you are giving up is the old self, allowing for the new to restore itself.

 

Things will get better soon, I promise.

 

You are loved

or it could have nothing to do with that.

"you are loved"- i believe you are simply projecting onto me, it is all so pointless.. so many people speaking and yet there is rarely, if ever, a genuine conversation taking place

As I understand it through the senses everything is basically "as it is" and thus perfect.

 

Then comes the thinking mind after milliseconds and judges the experience as good or bad. The practice is then to zoom in on the senses and train oneself to see perfection.

i don't need someone attempting to coach me on how to be a more non-functional member of society, i am quite capable of the feat myself.

Can you remind me where I called you cypher?

when i created a thread about how my writing was affecting my daily life as if i was 'scripting' it. i began to see the depth of this 'illusion' and i quite desperately wanted to return to my past self/mainly my world views and 'personality' of past.

i took your comment personally, my mistake. but i would rather you not assault my character with word/thoughtforms bearing such negative connotations, seeing as i do not do so unto you.

Curious, your energy feels "alien", odd.

 

Trying to say this, in a cool way, but

 

If you get high, a lot, the mixing of energy practice and "herbs"- some of them- can exacerbate the negative tendencies

 

Peace

point taken, although rarely partaken. use of marijuana on average is 1-2 a month, maybe less.

just might be an alien.

...

 

Well i am.

 

Sure.

 

We ARE supposed ta enjoy Life!

still unsure of that sentiment. it seems as though source/creator/tao/yhwh is fairly indifferent to human life as a whole, it's more of a 'business transaction'. we being the means to an end. all very impersonal.

Balance, balance, balance.

 

Neither good nor bad, but in the centre.

easier when not in the midst of the world/american society

throwing out the bathwater for now. taking up contemplative prayer and a better attitude.

stimpy don't ever call me cypher again.

time to give up.

To me, it sounded like the OP wasn't able to get too upset about the break up due to the depersonalization. Like the practice had led to apathy more than anything.

life is more beautiful to me now, although with an overpowering observer perspective. the whole muted emotions thing, my desire/passion is now a husk, Dreams are gone and i don't dream at night.

i'm not sure if we are supposed to enjoy life here anymore

i've read a couple threads on this site of how a practitioner has been suddenly overcome with symptoms of depersonalization stemming from a meditative/spiritual practice.

upon a closer examination of myself and my shortcomings i've seen that i also have been suffering from symptoms commonly attributed to depersonalizaton.

my question is. is a form of 'depersonalization' the aim of many spiritual/meditative practices?

it seems that there are those who have an adverse reaction to the sudden distancing between themselves/'emotions' and their surroundings, then there are those who openly welcome the effects of the 'depersonalization'.

i'm just curious to know what the position of others on this topic.

because as of late, i'm content, but i realize how sad i would normally feel- i feel very detached from many things around me. i've watched in slow motion as my personality has been disintegrating along with my relationship with my family, girlfriend and close friends. yesterday my girlfriend deemed our relationship to be too unhealthy to continue. a part of me was very upset but it's like it was frozen somewhere deep within me, i couldn't allow emotions to surface that i wanted. it constantly feels like this cold logic is present in my mind, sometimes it borders on sadness but it is more of a loneliness/emptiness i've never known until recent months. i don't feel like me. and i know that's probably due to egoistic wants, but having that degree of emotional stability amongst other things is a recipe for cognitive dissonance within this american society.

i just lost my best friend i've ever had. i'm sad, but i feel so far away from everything.

it's like i'm losing everything that made me, me.

feel free to move or delete this.

You replied but you really didnt understand my above post....

 

I said you can reach stillness and oneness that wasnt the arguement at all...

 

Both replies wasnt in reply to what i was actually talking about.

i don't understand what other process you could be addressing, when people speak of the "I", i find what i described is usually what they are speaking about.

could you please be more descriptive?

hahaha seems as though kasuku has beat me to the post button

The surge while reading spiritual or religious books can be due to 2 things it could be due to the spiritual power of the words themselves or by the spirits that follow one who reads that certain book.

 

Ive seen and exp both.

 

If you have spiritual power than the book can actually work as a charm warning you of a evil or negative presence on a spiritual nature.

 

There are tales of muslims of buring pages of the koran and then eating the ashes there is some truth to this.

 

Like writing, burning, and drinking the ashes of fu's in the taoist tradition.

 

So let me say this having some books can be a blessing others not.

 

The written word has power.

i find this process interesting, i'll look into it further.

i find your post about the earth to be quite condescending. especially considering the nature of this forum.

Well Ive never heard of any practitioner actually reaching this.

 

As a practitioner you can have mommnets of great stillness and oneness.

 

A practitioner can reach light body and so on or move on to another realm.

 

But ive never heard of a practitioner disolving into nothingness with out going into some other realm or something to be honest i dont think its possible.

 

Its like when Kosta tried to explain to john about wuchi and John said he, "never heard of it"

 

I think that there is a lot of what people read and actually misunderstand....

 

Look at Lama dore hes reached the golden dragon body which is a higher attainment than the rainbow body and he is still himself even if he would decided to leave this realm...I dont think you can actually literally and permanatly become the all.

 

An yes I know the demo of wang li peng walking thru the door but he was before and after having tea with some one....

 

As practitioners one has to be utterly honest with himself and ask yourself do I actually know someone that has literally attained nothingness to where they no longer exist or did they attain and are only able to hold on to it temporarily?

 

There is a difference.....

i believe you took my statement as literal.

when i said that, i meant as far self-indentification goes. an aspirant going from being stuck within the illusion of I/ego with all of it's trappings/suffering, to them gradually identifying with/"dissolving into" 'all' their surroundings and seeing the world as an extension of themselves. self-realization.

there are users here who have attained such to a degree.

the state i was referring to is know as nirvikalpa samadhi.

i appreciate this quote and teacher-

"Samadhi is as the ocean to which all Sadhana flows. The seven streams of Yama, Niyama, Asana, Pranayama, Prathyahara, Dharana and Dhyana all find their consummation in it. Every trace of name and Form disappear in that Ocean. He who serves and He who receives the service, he who meditates and He who is meditated upon, all such duality is dispelled and destroyed. One will not experience even the experience, that is to say, one will not be aware that he is experiencing! Oneself alone, naught else - that will be the Samadhi. If there is aught else, it cannot be Samadhi. It is something like a dream, a fantasy, a passing vision at best. Samadhi can admit of nothing other than Brahman.

- Sathya Sai Baba.

i believe you can/do reach a point on the spiritual path where the "I" is dissolved into the "All", there are many teachings/descriptions of the process available from an array of different paths/schools/religions.

^**i believe it occurs during an advanced stage of samadhi, but i'm not completely sure**^

i think that sharing ones practice/results therein with others not only dissipates energy, using breath, but tends to fall into the arena of egoistic boasting, instead of teaching. sometimes.

i also think that sharing results in the loss of will/the single-pointedness(concentration) required to advance through some stages of the spiritual path.

this is all in my opinion

i can relate to the energy surge while reading spiritual texts, i don't think it was shen though :/ but during a time of intense cultivation last year my energy would go absolutely haywire whenever i tried reading through certain prayers/texts.

that bit about africa is interesting.

thank you for sharing

Congratulations!

The false personality is not enjoying this but you are emerging to your intuition and all that is available to you.

 

Your quote with my comments in underlined:

 

"the meditative advances i've made recently, have seemed to manifest into my day-to-day routine outside of my spiritual practices. it's like the more "progress" i'm make, the more inept i'm slowly becoming at holding "normal" conversations with those around me. (You have been dis-assembling your reactive machanisms which is largely what "normal" conversations are - they are mostly robotic - meditation ebbs away at these connections) waving with a greeting in mind already is one thing, but to sit down and hold "light"/casual conversation is beginning to seem like pure cognitive dissonance. it's like my mind is a lot more calm than it has been in the past, to be completely honest it feels quite empty sometimes- which is what makes me feel so inept sometimes and "very boring".(Your self image is a projection of "your story" and again it has a robotic nature once attached to a picture you have of yourself within some context - it is expecting the typical sparring and vacouous filling of the voids that is part of our sleepwalking daydream) i don't have those fantastical daydreams or crude far-reaching jokes anymore. (You have also started to dis-assemble the thoughtforms that have a mechanical effect of generating spontaneous blabbler that creates a false air of quick wittedness and creativity - these thoughtforms interact with like vibe thoughtforms and can increase your vibration quickly, thus allowing for a whole host of beings to enter into the topic - it is often the precurser to becoming intoxicated) which is odd because whenever the conversation calls for "deeper"/philosophic thought, i instantly just start rambling coherent sentences that surprise me sometimes (The you that is not you is speaking) , but small talk is becoming harder to take up- it kind of worries me now. this is most noticeable in my relationship (deteriorating) because of this and my "changes" i've been going through. (be aware that the angst you are feeling is the loss of "the animator" and or the automated response as the "animated", it has been a part of your story for most of your life - it feels empty because you have not replaced the behavior - and you do not need to replace it with some false impression of self improtance - your are loosing the bozo) i feel it's somewhat due to the isolation- many things my mind seems to have "dropped" on its own accord.

(there are few things your mind should not drop - it has no need to take up most things - it grasps them - this is not to say that a good well honed mind is not extremely useful because it is fairly necessary - but for the most part the dropping is a fair indicator that you are doing very well on your path - your choice of the word "dropping" is extremely apt and telling. The loneliness or isolation is for a great number of reasons - one - you have dropped a whole group of robotic thoughtforms and other mechanistic circuitry that you took as who you are. Secondly - you are becoming established in your intuition - trusting this seems very awkward at first - for one thing you are probably looking at things or people without judging them - without thinking - without accessing - just sitting there viewing - it kinda seems stupid - like - your brain is dull or on hold or something.

It is not - this is when something like Qi Gong can be of great benifit - you build upon the lower dan tien and move out of your head a bit - the physicality is very helpful, particularly if you find this isolation/"dullness" emasculating)

 

End of Quote and comments.

 

Being present (quiet) may not seem so easy because of prior inertia but notice when you slip into future concern - this can be noticed by the dis-ease, edge or angst it brings - let it be noticed as incorrect thinking, incorrect action and be back again in now.

This happens less on a full battery so again - Qi Gong is very helpful. The less you vasilate the less you dissipate your energies. Posture is very helpful - the subtleties of posture within most practices are the reasons that most teachers cannot work with you on a high level - very fine subleties take time to feel and as you feel them you make adjustments that have tremendous effects. There are physical postures and energetic postures - for the most part the physical postures are what I am talking about above, energetic postures would be dealt with in higher teaching and addressed mechanically by mere practice.

 

Thank you for giving us such clean insight into your situation by the construction of your original post.

All the very best to you!

 

(By the way - you have a considerable build up of white blocking energy just above and around your navel and out to about 4 inches - like a thick cloud) No worry but thought you might like to know - for some reason this showed itself to me quite clearly.

thank you for that thorough critique.

i am taking up qigong soon (probably sfq) as well as mouni sadhu's "concentration". just have to save up a little

(By the way - you have a considerable build up of white blocking energy just above and around your navel and out to about 4 inches - like a thick cloud) No worry but thought you might like to know - for some reason this showed itself to me quite clearly.

what does this mean in terms a novice can understand? is there an immediate solution?

you are advanced.

the meditative advances i've made recently, have seemed to manifest into my day-to-day routine outside of my spiritual practices. it's like the more "progress" i'm make, the more inept i'm slowly becoming at holding "normal" conversations with those around me. waving with a greeting in mind already is one thing, but to sit down and hold "light"/casual conversation is beginning to seem like pure cognitive dissonance. it's like my mind is a lot more calm than it has been in the past, to be completely honest it feels quite empty sometimes- which is what makes me feel so inept sometimes and "very boring". i don't have those fantastical daydreams or crude far-reaching jokes anymore.

which is odd because whenever the conversation calls for "deeper"/philosophic thought, i instantly just start rambling coherent sentences that surprise me sometimes, but small talk is becoming harder to take up- it kind of worries me now. this is most noticeable in my relationship (deteriorating) because of this and my "changes" i've been going through. i feel it's somewhat due to the isolation- many things my mind seems to have "dropped" on its own accord.

has this happened to anyone else? any advice?

i've been shaving my head bald for the last couple weeks, and i've noticed a clarity that wasn't present before. i'm not sure if this is just gradual meditative advancement or if in some part due to my 'new hair'

throughout the waking hours i feel much more aware of my surroundings and the people within them. a new level of 'connectivity', but also a marked detachment. my thinking has been noticeably 'sharper' than before, people around me have also suggested as much to me. i just want to investigate this further before i jump to any rash conclusions. i'm learning not to jump to conclusions

i appreciate you all giving your input, i hope there's more to come

**i'll report back with any more articles/material i see as pertinent to the matter

http://fractalenlightenment.com/12477/culture/long-hair-related-to-higher-consciousness

i've heard that story about the native recruits before, it's very interesting

i think their sudden drop in awareness could possibly be tied into what seeker of tao stated, as far as attaching them attaching certain characteristics to their hair/image of self.

Hair is just dead keratin, the same stuff rhino horn is made from, so I don't think hair itself does anything. If keratin amplifies awareness, rhinos and narwhals would be sages, which I find hard to believe.

 

However, someone who chooses to shave their hair off or keep it long as an expression of humility, lack of vanity, realising that you aren't your body, and dedication to cultivation may have heightened awareness because of that. There's probably also some role for the placebo effect.

_________________________________________________________________________________________

I always thought monks shaved there hair because hair is wrapped up in beauty and ego. So shaving it is a sign of humility.

I do think think there may be something to long hair. Could be an electrical static thing or something else at work, but long hair may do something. Or as Edward said, long shiny hair means kidneys or some system working very well.

 

Certainly in several chi gung's there is hair breathing techniques.

!!!, this is news to me. i'll look into this further

throughout the internet are discussions/examples of hair and how it is thought to affect the neurosystem/psychic centers of a person. so i thought why not have one here

i've heard of groups such as the native americans and indian sadhus claim that their long hair is directly correlated to their states of heightened awareness.

i've also heard of groups like the druids and tibetan monks keeping their head shaved to attain a higher and also "clearer" states of heightened awareness.

do any of you have experiences in which you think your hair length may have been directly correlated with certain states of awareness?

or

are you of the belief that hair length does not affect the pursuit/attainment of greater awareness?

i'm excited to hear from you all

true will is forged in the fires of hell

do any of you have any personal experiences with any of the works of mouni sadhu?

from the reviews that are available of his work, he seems to be highly recommended.

i'm currently considering purchasing a few books of his,

"samadhi: the superconsciousness of the future"

"meditation"

"concentration"

from the way reviewers speak of his work, his methods seem to be fairly rigid.

at the moment i have been searching for an internal practice and from what i've gathered from the reviews of "concentration" in particular, it is essentially mental yoga.

i've begun working on belly breathing/stretching and emptiness meditation. i believe that those coupled with one or all of these books will help to give me a stable foundation for when i have the funds to go visit a qigong master for proper instruction.

**many have suggested overcoming anger/aggression, depression/frustration to an extent before engaging in a practice, as that will promote a 'cleaner' entrance into the art.

if any of you have any experiences with the teachings of these books i would very much appreciate your input