Icedude

That passage means that heaven and earth (and sages) isn't partial, which is extremely natural. I mean "benevolence", as in the absence of ill will. In contrast, holding benevolence as a virtue means trying to infuse oneself with the unnatural urge to help people. In reality that just ends of in catastrophy: Jails full of the "bad" people, death penalties, cruelty, just because we don't understand eachother. A society that doesn't accept a certain percentage of people, isn't a just or good society. It only deludes itself that it is.

I find that benevolence comes automatically with understanding (together with seeing no real reason for opposition). Once you understand that you would have done exactly the same thing, it's unnatural to hate someone. It would be like hating or hurting yourself. I don't believe in benevolence as a virtue. I believe in it as a natural state.

Just a bridle.

Are you coming on to me? ...because there is just no way that you'll be able to convert me to a simiasexual.

The thing about taoism is that it teaches you that a lot of things aren't real - that things like virtues and sins, laws and morals, are relative constructs. ...and when you learn that your virtues aren't real virtues, you gain an understanding that makes it impossible to pour your heart and soul into opposition. As a real taoist you eventually become more than human. You cease to value the world, at least as you've learned to value it. You learn to see things as they are, and this is enlightenment. A lot of people don't seem to get this. They think that taoism is about validating that everything they do is "right", and they don't realize that that makes everybody else "right" too. Instead they practice worship of their own virtues, just like Confucius did, and then you end up with personal confucianism instead. ...so no, taoists aren't "just normal people".

Don't be silly. You're a cat.

Look, there's a way to deal with faults, and lashing out at other people and searching for faults in them, isn't it. That's just distracting yourself in order to ignore them. I am not looking for any kind of student, so I'm not going to take you on. You can most likely fix these things on your own.

Ah, the tyranny of eloquence... At this point I am convinced that you are a woman pretending to be a man, because this is not how a man behaves. A man does not focus on "suitable" things, nor does he focus on being "popular", and he certainly isn't preaching politeness at your extreme level. This is why I come across as impolite to you: I was born this way. I was born to handle critique, I've been called all kinds of shit that a woman has the priviliege to stay clear of, and I've learned to "man up". I can't rise/lower myself to your impractical expectations, especially when you are inventing your expectations because you're simply butthurt and don't want to admit it. I can play your game too: "Why are you accusing me of being insensitive and stupid? You are such a meanie, and I'm going to go somewhere to cry now." Just go away.

Sigourney Weaver used to be male back in the day?

Exactly: Women want a man with diplomas, not one who's just "having visions". "Wait! I had another vision! I see you and me and your sister, in bed with... ...is that a tiger mutant?" "Oh, that's just 'Buddha'. He's completely harmless, and shares my affection for hot zen masters like yourself."

Is it really necessary? Yes. Either I'm doing silly shadow boxing for your amusement, or I'm striking nerves that should be struck for the sake of self-improvement. I very much count myself as a taoist. I've also seen how gravely taoists in general can fail to understand the very obvious core of taoism. You can try to convey positive messages to them, and they'll look at them and think that they're just alternative busy-work. If you instead give them a friendly jab in the stomach, they'll take more note of it. I am not looking to beat up taoists for my amusement, but I've seen the alternative up close. It took years for my friend the wu wei master to stop reaching for his cola with his "mind powers". "Beating them up" a bit is preferable to them for example gaining health problems due to obesity. ...but at this point, why do you even care? The thread is over and done with, isn't it? It was pretty much a "one post joke". Is it an eyesore to you? Does one topic of critique soil the serenity of the entire sub-forum? You've tried to claim that it "doesn't belong", that it makes me "unpopular", and that it's "taking jabs". These are dishonest tactics, Rara. These are tactics trying to exploit the forum environment we're in: Attempts at tricking mods, attempts as bullying me, and an appeal to tranquility. How on earth can you have become so upset with this topic? If this topic disturbed you, then consider this a wake-up call instead. Re-read the Tao Te Ching and understand what it is really trying to convey.

I have never understood people who claim that you shouldn't sleep until you wake up not feeling tired. Some even claim that sleeping more will make you feel even more tired. Sleep is about cleansing your brain of biochemical waste products. It all depends on how much waste you'd like to have in your brain, and how well you would like to function while awake as an effect of that. If you think that you have more important things to do than clean your brain and avoid health riscs, then it must be important to you. If it's a matter of life and death, I suggest that you don't sleep at all.

If you doubt me, you're free to explain how you would differ from a typical paranoid schizophrenic. I'm listening.

無

Yes, common, unenlightened people "who does it for money".

Women must be unusually clever people, because if I walked up to a woman in a bar, I would imagine the conversation to go something like this: "Hi, babe. You know, I'm an enlightened zen master." "Really? I happen to be the only woman in town who's really into zen masters. Do you have some kind of diploma to back that up?" "No, but I had a vision." "A vision?" "Yes, and I can sell you these healing papers for only $200." "Good bye."

Just you wait 'til I get my diploma. I'll make your heads spin.

I guess I have my own personal firm ideas about rock gardens being primarily rocks and sand because they are "permanent", beyond the lifespans of flowers and humans. Man, I thought I knew rock gardens.

Well, that just makes your zen even more wonderous, if you can teach without even knowing what you're teaching.

Don't get me wrong: I'd love to attend one of your classes to recieve your scorn zen.

Spirituality is for master Juni to quickly scale rock walls with hands and feet, wade barefeet through snow, and jump pools of boiling lava. You can learn much from master Juni.

Class has assembled, and TheExaltedRonin strides in before turning to look at the students. "Look at you!", he frowns. "...sitting there, claiming you know anything about taoism practice. What do you know?! Have you ever read the Tao Te Ching? ...huh? What about Tao For Pooh? Chuang Tzu, anyone? Nobody? ... Such ignorant hypocrites, you are. I pity you. I mean here you are, in an actual taoist class, and yet you know absolutely nothing but semantics! All you know is how to bicker amongst yourselves! I am so very disappointed in you. ... Class dismissed."

I feel for you, man. The ability to reason is a treasure that I wouldn't want to part with. I'd probably end up just like you, resorting to scare tactics so that people will stay and listen to me, "warning" them so that they'll value me. I wish I could help you get your bearings, but I don't think I can. Maybe anti-psychotics would work for you.

Often the addiction itself is not the biggest obstacle. It is friends and family. Hopefully you can convince your friend that drinking and dukkha is "being a pussy", and you can convey the idea that there are greater feelings than drinking. It won't be as easy as telling him he's a pussy, and it may take some understanding for why he chooses to drink himself. Maybe some other friend, or his father, told him that he was a pussy if he didn't drink.