Icedude

"an" what? An ambulance? An orange? No, there wouldn't, because there's a rule that says something like "employees are not supposed to talk to customers" or something like that. ...and if there wasn't, one would shortly be invented in order to serve more burgers and put out more fires.

So you'd be okay with schools of wisdom then? ...with diplomas for wisdom? Also, there's no point to all these huge pictures and videos.

Funny, funny. ...but isn't that just knowledge? "Don't read this book. In fact, don't read this sentence. Too late!"

Common sense. You can hardly make those kinds of predictions. However, I don't think I phrased that as them having a reason against it. I just don't think they saw a point to it. Buddha sat under a tree talking to people, and Lao Tze lived in a country that had an emperor with complete opposite views. You'd be counting on common people to suddenly realize that what you're blathering on about actually makes sense. It rarely happens.

Hundreds of years from now, my name will be cherished all over the globe as Diplomabuddha.

I'd like to ask for quotes, because I think you're taking things out of context now. The concept association went from enlightenment, to diploma, to schools, to knowledge. There is knowledge (as in preconceptions), and there is knowledge (as in experience). It's also said that you'll know when you're enlightened. Am I supposed to step away from that knowledge as well? I think you're over-interpreting things, and as for christian genesis, the tree was only dealing with the knowledge of good and evil.

(I am going to trim your post in my response because I simply get what you're saying, and I have nothing to add to it.) Just because they didn't promote schools, it doesn't mean that they would oppose them either. They just didn't bring future schools up, also because they had no idea that those schools would survive that far. Self-doubt is good advice to give to somebody who doesn't possess self-doubt. It is superfluous to give to someone who already possesses it. However, actually deterring somebody, is just being in the way. ...yet that is the only "wisdom" that most of this forum has to offer: "Don't seek enlightenment. Don't seek buddhahood. It only leads to fame and fortune. We already have a buddha, and one was quite enough. Let him die and stay forgotten."

I apologize. At this point I'm pretty fed up with non-straight "circling prey" behavior in general, and I took it out on you. I'm sorry.

Well, "Evil Taoists" pretty much gives it away.

It's because these questions come from just one question. Imagine somebody coming home asking "What's for dinner? What kind of sausage is it? Did you buy spaghetti? I hope it's not spaghetti again. Do you know how sad that would make me feel?". What if you didn't make dinner, or you're making hamburgers? If I see a root to the problem, I'm going to focus on that instead of bothering with all the leaves.

Yet you are the one asking the questions. A definition. A title. A name. I don't know yet, but it's obviously possible, otherwise we wouldn't have buddhism or any definitions of enlightenment, if it's just something that somebody can claim to be. You're here because you believe it's possible, aren't you? I guess that makes taoism and buddhism one big lie then, if it's just a matter of charlatans lying to charlatans, or falsely believing in them, ego boosting them and giving them an illusion of authority. It's not a matter of what I prefer. It's a matter of if I already am or not. There are clear definitions for enlightenment - clear fetters to clearly not have. Ways of preceptions to possess. Enlightenment is something tangible. The only question is if somebody can tell or not. After I've gotten my diploma, I'm free to retreat back into my apartment and possibly never speak of it again. That's how "part of that" I want to be. "Test me." Decidedly indecisive.

On the contrary: I've described enlightenment as best as I can in other threads. If you want answers to actual questions, ask me.

Aww, I'm sorry. No, wait. I'm happy for you? What am I supposed to be here? How are you feeling yourself? Are you feeling confused right now? ...because I am.

Do you? ...because to me that sounds like yet another lame joke, put down in an extremely convoluted and insincere way: "Have you possibly maybe considered that you're psychotic? ...not that I'm saying that or anything." That's not testing me. That's you choosing to misinterpret me, thinking that as I want validation, all you need is to lie about offering it, and you can make a fool out of me. You don't even seem to believe in enlightenment, as you reckon monks wouldn't take askers seriously. ...so you come across as an atheist heckler. If you want an honest answer about what awakened means, you can check dictionaries. "Awakened" is a word that fits criteria. I can tell you that I'm a good chef, because maybe I'm that too, but it's useless unless it fits the criteria. Maybe all awakened people are good chefs too, but I wouldn't know, as I haven't read about that part yet. I only know that what I've read so far fits. I can read about the big bang, and understand the big bang, but that doesn't make me the big bang. However, if I'm happy, and I read about happiness, I understand that I'm happy, and that makes me realize that I was happy all along. ...or maybe I read about happiness and realize that I'm not happy. ...or maybe I read about happiness and that makes me happy while I'm reading it, or able to be happy later. Some people become awakened, and some people are already. It's pointless for you to try to decide if another person would let me in or not, because you're not that person. I very much doubt that these "Buddha energies", whatever they are, can be sensed through the internet. You're not even able to detect if I'm smiling or picking my nose right now, so don't act like you are. According to your culture, Buddha is unemployed. You'd put a McDonalds cap on him, take him to McDonalds, and he'd be a slow and weird cachier. That's the result of people "knocking people down a peg or two". I feel like I'd be here giving you private lectures all day. You write far too many words. The need for humor in this case, is the need to degrade me for being larger than you. It's disbelief. It's disrespect. It's you making clowns out of yourselves, and at this point, after 14 pages, I'm fed up with clowns. How much unbelief in the religion that you claim to have, can you guys possibly have?

I guess that makes sense. ...although we need to keep in mind chinese censorship as well. A lot of chinese people have legitimate reasons for using proxies.

I'm going to bed now. I'll answer tigers post tomorrow.

Like what testing? See, I'm only answering this part, because I want to know whether or not I'm going to humor your questions any longer. Most likely not.

Unfortunately it's not that easy. I don't know if other people managed to realize something that made them fully awakened at once. That seems unlikely, though. For me it happened over the course of many years, carrying with it understanding for everything I later read. I knew that I didn't think like anyone else, but I didn't think I was *that* special. I just had my own weird perception of things, that nobody else seemed to understand or agree with. I could copy and paste things I've read from the scriptures, and simply go: "I get this. I get this as well. I get all of this, and all of this, and this too." If I tell you that I understand something more than that, you're just going to say that as it's not in the scriptures, that just proves that I'm not awakened. I don't get *all* of the scriptures, because some of the scriptures are actually wrong. At least that's what I think at the moment. For instance, I'll get back to you if I transform into a lion, but I don't think that that's likely for anyone to do. Further, I don't think it's possible to formulate the full nature of the ultimate truth in a brief description. It would have already been done if that was the case. What to say differs from person to person, because it's actually doing away with misconceptions, and people have all completely different misconceptions. I'd have to discuss things with you, and make you understand the ultimate truth yourself, to prove my understanding of the ultimate truth, and that could apparently take lifetimes to do with a normal person, so "we'd be here all day" so to speak. It's not like I haven't tried to explain, but people don't get what I'm saying when I do "the brief version". I go too fast for them, and end up saying "ridiculous" things.

Yeah, well things got stale after a few days of mockery, and the mockery carried over into other threads, and you're so busy coming up with "clever" things to say, that very few of you actually came up with serious advice. I realized the comical side to it all even before I came here to this forum, and I'd like to move on to more serious territory now. Laughing at it won't make it go away. Sure: What exactly would you like me to demonstrate? ... See? I've been begging for a testing all this thread, to prove that I'm not just saying it, but you don't really know how to test me. I didn't expect you to either, but I figured that someone would at least know someone who knew how to test me. ...but I can actually call a few temples in America now, or visit a few closer temples, so I've got the testing bit taken care of, hopefully. See, it's not funny. Imagine that you're in an exclusive library, and every book you opened whispered "Chosen One...". That's not awesome, and it's not funny. That's actually really creepy. I am trying to come to terms with what I've got, but at this point books make me uncomfortable. They're just full of stuff that I already know, making them boring and creepy at the same time. the best outcome that I can imagine at this point, is it turns out that I'm not awakened at all, because that would actually be a relief. Yeah, so I'm asking to be tested. I've said that ten times over at this point, so what is it about that that you guys don't get? Instead you're telling me to make my own diploma, and after that you're telling me to get followers with it. What's wrong with you? Why would I want to get through the door? Either they do tests or they don't do tests. If they don't let people who want to be tested through the door, then they don't do tests. If they get cynical or angry about it, then they don't even acknowledge that self-awakening is possible, so they don't do tests.

He only got a stern talking to - not suspended - so you can ask him yourself in a straight-forward manner.

What exactly is it that you're so furious over? Do you hate diplomas and the academic world that's associated with them? Did you become spiritual to "get away from it all"? Are you kidding me? This forum would be bustling with proved enlightened people educating non-enlightened people. ...but even if it was emptied by this new spiritual revolution, I'm sure that the mods would close the forum in complete satisfaction. My natural talent is that I am awakened. I don't know exactly how awakened I am, as I'm still searching for my limits, but I'm apparently pretty high up there as a holy person according to the scriptures. I wouldn't exactly know how to formulate awakening into words better than Lao Tzu or buddhistic scholars did, and it's fairly complex stuff that would require awakening to fully understand. If I ever make an attempt at putting it into words, I imagine I'd do it in book form.

Aw, come on. Be nice.

I got the diploma bit down - no worries. It's called something like a "record of mind transmission" that I have to get. It's kind of weird that you guys are making fun of me, thinking that "awakening is too mystical to get certified". Yes, there is a certain kind of transmission that occurs from teacher to student, which you're going to have to work for in a remote temple, but when you have natural talents like me, who don't need no teacher, you still get a transmission, but from your own mind. ...so I just need to get it validated - that's all. It's kind of like coming to a bakers forum and asking to get a working permit as a baker, and then get countless replies in return, from people who are just baking at home in their kitchens, mocking you for "wanting to show off". So most of you guys don't know, and that's fine. Just don't act like you have to compensate for it. You don't see me belittling you over not being awakened. Have some respect for people.

How to become a taoist master: - Watch Karate Kid and The Empire Strikes Back. - Want to sound profound like Mr. Miyagi and Yoda, because you want to be respected for everything you say. If the Dalai Lama can just sit around and sound like Yoda, then that's the easiest job in the world. - Read a bit about taoism and Wu Wei. - Learn that everything you do is already part of the Tao, so that must mean that you're already spiritual. Anger, hate, discrimination, people crying when you beat them up, all part of the Tao, so you can't really be not part of the Tao. - Learn that as the Tao is unnamable and indescribable, nobody else can tell you what Tao is and isn't, because that puts them at fault. - Practice responding that everything people encounter is part of the Tao. That makes you sound really profound and wise. - Learn that everything has a buddha nature, so that must mean that you're a buddha. You just have to believe it. - Learn that zen teachers can beat students with enlightening sticks, and the student will just be grateful and enlightened for it. That must mean that you can go around and enlighten all your enemies with your enlightening stick, conveniently in the shape of a bat. It's a natural thing and part of your spiritual way. - Learn that Wu Wei is about everything working out automatically, without you really having to lift a finger for it. You just have to reach for that Cola without getting out of your chair, and sooner or later some friend-servant will get annoyed enough to hand it to you: You're a wu wei master! - Learn that if you call sitting for long periods of time "meditation", people will think you're awesome for doing nothing. (Of course I'm not serious! *whacks repeatedly with enlightenment stick like Yoda.*)