Coaster

I'm happy for everyone to do what they think works for them... ... but this is not the practice of meditation, it's the practice of psychotherapy. Meditation is getting in touch with the universe, by temporarily letting go of everything specific. The latter includes friends, enemies, family, strangers, likes, dislikes. When you ask Saint Hot Dog Vendor "Make me one with everything", he always replys "You already are." Meditation is when you click "ignore" on everything.

For years, I posted in various Forums which only allowed you to Edit your posts for a certain length of time, OR only until someone posted a reply. Finally, from reading TTB, I understand Why ! Unlike any other Forum, TTB has many threads "that mysteriously come out of nowhere and discuss an unknown topic". My guess is that Martial Arts attracts guys with low self-esteem. These guys will post something to start a thread, a vigorous discussion ensues, OP decides he is wrong, and then deletes virtually everything in the OP. (so that there is no evidence of his wrong statement) The result is a discussion about a "secret" issue. I think this results in lots of ruined threads littering the Forum, some of which are possibly about interesting topics. So, I now understand why there should be a limit on editing one's posts. So, what is the current implementation ? Are there limits on editing one's posts ?

I'd like to see a little stricter guidelines on signatures here. For me, the top priority would be to prohibit Animated GIFs because they are visually annoying. Forums usually have strict rules about size and content of signatures. Why? Because they are repeated over and over. Example of a thread. Notice that 90% of the thread is signature, because the signature is inline with the thread: Statement about Tao. Signature Line 1 Signature Line 2 Signature Line 3 Signature Line 4 Animated GIF --- Reply to Statement about Tao. --- Reply to Reply to Statement about Tao. Signature Line 1 Signature Line 2 Signature Line 3 Signature Line 4 Animated GIF --- Another Reply to Statement about Tao. --- Reply to Another Reply to Statement about Tao. Signature Line 1 Signature Line 2 Signature Line 3 Signature Line 4 Animated GIF ===== Thanks for considering this request.

That's correct. If you are a Toyota fan, and you go to the Ford Forum and post "Toyotas rule, Fords drool!" that is a troll post. If you are a Toyota Corolla fan, and you go to the Toyota Forum and fanatically post pro-Corolla messages, that is technically not a troll in the original sense.

That's very helpful !

That's an interesting video. I am not a scientific materialist, so I have no reason to doubt, yet I can't help but note that the "guessers" ruin it as a demonstration. Of course it is a sign of the integrity of the video uploader that the guessers were included, but the obvious thought is that if so many people guessed wrong, why couldn't the correctly timed movements also be a guess? In any event, lately I try not to be " TL; DNR" but one can work out for oneself that 100,000 years ago, when people lived in groups of several hundred, that those who trusted strangers who spoke a different language, ended up having their village burnt to the ground, and so we are not descended from them. So, I should said "potential enemies" instead of just enemies. As zerostao reminds us, every friend was originally a stranger. So, there are social cues as to whether someone is trustworthy enough to befriend. One reason why "interest groups" are so popular these days, is that they replace tribes in providing an indication that someone was "us" and not "them". If you join "NASCAR friends of Boise", then you are delineating that these people are your "tribe" and so they can be trusted as "us".

Yes, but that would also hide some of the very positive and helpful sigs as well. One of the best quotes I've seen, I found in a sig on this site.

I can read a post on this site, have an emotional reaction, feel that I want to reply... and then notice the post is from 2005. The poster often is "banned" or long gone from the Forum... he might even be no longer on this Earth. The fact that some current threads have a "back and forth" gives one the impression that it is like a phone call, but it is not. Just read a controversial 2005 thread and you will see what I mean. You will feel the same, despite there being no real interaction with the writers. I can read Plato or the writings of Julius Caesar, but there is no "exchange of energy" with them when I do so.

That is beautiful, but I don't think it is an instinct, I think it is a learned behavior.

Very good stuff in the last few posts! Some points regarding that: + The above posts are concerned with human interactions in the Forums, but there is also the aspect of the primary purpose of Forums, the exchange of Information. When one participates in a Forum, it is entirely verbal and so only consists of symbols. The other persons are not there (unlike a phone call), they may even no longer be a member when you read their post. But a hundred people may later read your post, so IMHO the accuracy of information is important. + Human beings are primates with instincts formed hundreds of thousands of years ago, long before anyone ever lived with a stranger. We instinctively treat strangers as enemies, which probably was very helpful to survival 100,000 years ago. Spirituality includes the practice of control of emotions (the mental manifestation of instincts). Emotions are part of human DNA, they do not "go away". Perfected enlightened masters still feel anger and every other emotion. But they are in control of their reaction.

They don't see any mistakes since their only goal is re-election. Gerrymandering of districts insures re-election. Later they will make milliions working for lobbying firms. Seems like no mistakes for them. Then media makes millions giving voters the idea that politicians care about the best interests of voters.

It is silly to think that we can have any idea what actually went on 100 years ago, when there may have been no one person at the time who knew and understood all aspects, let alone later. A billion people in a day do roughly 16 billion hours of things, now over 100 years, multiply that by 36,500 days is 584 trillion hours of activity since that war happened. Any particular piece of information would have to survive through vast currents of political maneuvering. The same applies to things that happened 200 years ago 250 years ago, 3,000 years ago, etc. This is not to say that there is not some value in the study of history, but rather not to expect that we can possibly have any accurate information about what happened.

I was just posting for the sake of others reading the thread - who might accept something posted as truth if not challenged.

Uh, you are referring to a different universe, the one where Elvis is still alive and where at least one sentence of your post is accurate. I am not defending any particular person, but that belongs in the " Clinton is a Reptilian Alien from Beta Centauri " category.

Here is a fictional example, but similar to what I see happening here at TTB: OP posts " I think Standing Qigong is dumb. It's so much better to have movement, it's like a dance! Bagua Rules !" Then various people post a variety of interesting positive things about Standing Qigong and then the last post is a quote from a Bagua master extolling benefits of Standing. OP thinks "I look like an idiot" and then erases the entire OP (or else replaces it with some arbitrary profundity having nothing to do with the topic). At this point, when one does a search, one wonders why all these people are talking about Standing Qigong...

I think it says that the ability to be thoughtful is not the same as the ability to get along with others.

Note - I am not referring here to philosophical/metaphysical issues, where I am quite satisfied with what I've worked out on my own, and what I have read over the years. Instead, I am referring to mechanics of Qi inside the human body. I have been doing some reading in that area, and finally ended up with "Roots of Qigong" by Dr. Yang Jwing-Ming, considered one of the best books on Qigong theory. Dr. Yang is a PhD physicist, and worked in engineering. So, he is thoroughly grounded in scientific method, and rational appraisal. But, he is also the head of a Martial Arts Institute, studied many arts under many masters, and has taught teachers - so he has significant Qi experience. He grew up in China (Taiwan), so he can read original Chinese texts. But, in the book, at each point where one expects an explanation of how it works, there isn't one (the same gap you can find in all the other popular Qigong books - whether Frantzis or Chuen or Cohen or whoever. Then, towards the end of the book is a big Questions section, and I think "aha!". But it is not Questions and Answers, just Questions. And here he lays out all the questions one might have about Qi theory. So, what seems clear now is that - like most human endeavors - Qi practices were discovered and developed through a practical method of trial and error. Certain "principles" were discovered (such as "relax your body"), but no real understanding of how it all works. Stand like this or wave your arms like that and your energy increases. No one seems to understand why waving your arms one way works, while waving it another way does not. It is interesting that the human body is more complicated and difficult to understand than The Universe as a whole. Note: I'm not looking for a scientific explanation of Qi, an explanation that is verified by the science establishment. I'm looking for an explanation of how Qi cultivation works. Again - no one seems to understand why waving your arms one way works, while waving it another way does not.

Actually, it would be possible to test this. There are plenty of stories of guys who went to Masters, did the practices for weeks, and then had a Qi experience. You could test my premise by having the Master masquerade as some sort of mundane supervisor (or perhaps school teacher), and get people to do the practices without being told that it would benefit or change them in any way (in the same way that most people don't feel that waiting for the bus benefits them). Then if any had a Qi experience, we would know that intent is not necessary. But I don't think any would have an experience. Also, there is the example of MCO (small universe). AFAIK, there is no movement and the posture is not "make or break". So, in MCO, it happens because of intent.

But you are folding your hands in front of the dantien intentionally. Intent may not have to be in real-time. Conversely, I don't think that someone who randomly develops the habit of folding their hands in front of their dantien (in precisely the correct way), and does it all the time for 50 years, would become a super-Qi-charged MA master unintentionally. If a million chimpanzees waves their arms for a million years, somehow I don't think that one of them will randomly develop the power to blow the other ones across the room with his chi blasts.

Okay, here is a counter-example: In November 1992, A plurality of voters polled in exit polling (41% IIRC) stated that they would have voted for Perot for President, but they thought they need to vote strategically instead of for their first choice. So, if everyone had voted for their first choice, Perot would have been President instead of a Democrat or Republican. My guess is that would have applied many times in the past, but people are brainwashed by the "strategic voting" argument and by the Democrat/Republican/CNN propaganda machine.

They say:

I have encountered the exact opposite situation, namely that the two posters whom made the most sense, both had "Banned" under their usernames.

Thanks for the post. Some of that sounds like the "correlation is causation" concept that is epidemic in the NewAge/Alternative community. In other words, if the hand is front of a dantien, and we know that dantien is involved with that qigong, then we think that there is a causation. But that doesn't take into account other movements, when the hand is there and that dantien is not involved, because that would require keeping all those things in mind while going through all the various movements. Then there is the question of why all the same movements don't have qi effects when we are packing boxes in trucks, etc. Any active person is constantly waving their hands in front of some dantien, facing one way or the other. In other words, why does Standing Like A Tree increase your Qi, while Standing In Line Waiting For The Bus does not ? The only answer that makes sense to me is "intent". Standing Like A Tree is done with the intent to increase your Qi, while Standing In Line Waiting For The Bus (or Packing the Boxes in the UPS Truck) is not. In fact, if you read various qigong instruction books, there is always additional information for those who cannot stand, etc. about substitutions. Ultimately, one finds very little which is essential. Then there are some qigongs that have instructions which are ridiculously complicated and precise ("move your large intestine 1/8" inward" - only slight exaggeration ). Some of them look very much like classic teacher-student ploys of occupying the student's mind, so it is focused on the body and not on "what that guy said yesterday", So, the hypothesis here is that one is practicing having the intent to improve Qi flow, and any particular movements and postures are designed for their physical body exercise benefit. But this is just a guess...

I see an interesting psychological trend here at TTB - which is a mild hatred of popular Yoga centers. Every time I see popular yoga mentioned, it is viewed as a negative trend. Even the "sifus" participate in this thrashing of "calisthenics". So, here is one random example, chosen simply because I just saw it: This is milder than most of the sneering I see on TTB. I myself have done a lot of what is being called "higher level" Yoga, oriented around meditation. There are several things going on here: #1 is a big semantic problem. Words are used in many ways. Yoga still means a spiritual path, and there are still plenty of ashrams doing it. It also means "Yoga asanas", which is what you see at the centers. You see the same thing with the word "football", where in England it means soccer, in the USA, it means NFL gridiron, and in Australia, it means Aussie Rules football. The idea that we have to protect the purity of words is pretty silly IMHO. #2 is the irrational assessment that this is a negative trend. The thought in the quote above is that any particular 25 year old woman who is taking a Yoga postures class in 2013, would instead be meditating at an ashram, if these pop fad centers didn't exist. Simple statistics show that this is equally silly. Far more people are doing Yoga postures today than could possibly be interested in a real spiritual practice. The reality is that the pop, watered down, "calisthenics", yoga postures at your local Yoga center are one of the few positive trends of the past 10 years. The real alternative is sitting on the couch, watching an entire season of a TV show on Netflix, while eating potato chips, interspersed with texting friends about what that evil ex-boyfriend said about one's BFF. Instead, you find people doing a practice specifically designed to clear Qi blockages and improve health. Many class teachers do include a short meditation session. For many people, it is their first positive exposure to Asian culture. And, for a small minority, it makes them want to explore the practice in enough depth that they encounter the full Yoga spiritual practice. Whenever anything becomes popular, it attracts commercial interests and Marketing, that's irrespective of the content, and just "comes with the territory". And whenever anything becomes popular, it attracts people who just want to do whatever is popular. In this case, I think the latter is a good thing, and people are being exposed to fitness, health, better qi flow, and Asian culture - even if it is in small doses, but that is better than nothing at all. So, I don't understand the sneering.

The problem is that when no one knows how it works, then no one knows when it is not correct. There is the story of the Abbey where the monks meditated every morning. One of the monks found a starving cat, and the Abbot allowed him to keep the cat. But every morning, the cat would playfully jump on the meditating monks, make noise, and otherwise disturb their practice. So, the Abbot said to tie the cat to a post outside during the morning meditation. Years later, the cat died, and the monks liked having a cat so they found another stray cat to adopt. Enough years pass, so that none of the monks from the beginning of our story are still alive. The monastery cat dies, and the monks cannot find a stray cat in their area. So they go to their Abbot, saying " What are we going to do ? How can we possibly meditate without a cat tied up outside ? " --- So, that's the problem with "no one understands how it works, but just do it anyway".