NLP and Max (Conman) Christensen

[Heidi1975]

i assume you're referring to me.

i'm not at all hostile. look at some of my posts from 7 months ago. THAT was hostile!

 

i'm making a valid point. it's not an attack on any of you who are getting a lot out of your practice.

 

but freedom of choice is hindered when so many other threads get pushed into oblivion because of all the kunlun discussion.

 

i guess i just don't see why a subforum can't be made since mantra's site is apparently not working for everybody.

Not just you. I think this and the other thread on the front speaks for itself.

 

I don't know what it was like before, maybe your reactions are reasonable.

 

I totally understand your concern regarding the disappearing threads, and of course it would be nice to have subforas for the most discussed practises, not only kunlun.

[AugustLeo]

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[passenger1980]

You've been a member of this forum since October '07, with a total of 31 posts. If you want this discussion forum to change in a direction you're interested in, then post more on topics you're interested in. If the TTB community wants to discuss your topics, they'll float to the top.

 

The only reason that Kunlun topics seem to dominate is that the active TTB posters choose to post on those topics.

 

Be a more active poster. It's that simple.

 

AugustLeo

 

I don't think it's all about posting, views counts too i guess. Hell, i've been reading posts and visiting the forum for information as a guest more than as a member. My concern is that i feel, like me, many posters, old and potential new members can be turned off with this Kunlun stuff. I really think that this looks like an official kunlun forum than anything else. Perhaps i'm over reacting, or i have the wrong impression.

 

I don't care about posting here, which is a kunlun topic after all, i feel something is wrong and this great forum is dying, i don't care how many posts i have either. Also, i really don't understand WHY Kunlun (Please don't tell me because it works...). I smell something fishy...

 

-NLP and Max (Conman) Christensen

-Is KunLun Bogus? A Complete Path or Complete Fluff?

-Spiritual Politics and Practice kunlun, mantak chia, and everything else

-Are you tired of kunlun too? But you dont want to leave Taobums?

-Kunlun helmet

-What is the Kunlun Energy

-A thought on Max

-Kunlun Europe

-Kunlun Questions Thread

 

Is that for real? opening page...

 

Not to mention that almost every other topic you visit, the third or four post references Max, Kunlun, or whatever.

 

Wake up people...

[AugustLeo]

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[passenger1980]

You're a member of and read The TaoBums (which is a discussion forum), you don't care to post, yet you feel justified to complain about what active posters choose to post.

 

Okay. I understand now. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

 

AugustLeo

 

Great reply, amazing. Copy & pasting a line out of context...

 

Do i need to have something to say in every post? Sometime is better to be quiet, in my case, i don't have that much knowledge as i said, i want to learn and read about other experienced members, but all i get is kunlun nonsense, and how a guy named Max is the messiah.

 

Perhaps i should be forced to post some mumbojumbo or reference kunlun in every topic like all these brainwashed (or salesmen) people do? That's a better behaviour? That will get me 100 more posts.

 

Do i need 500 post to speak up?

[AugustLeo]

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[Aetherous]

I don't think you have to post a lot to have a say here. I used to read here only, and can understand. There's a lot of interesting stuff to learn and sometimes the best way to learn is just by being quiet and watching everything.

 

Why do you have to bash kunlun, though? Max isn't at all considered a messiah and the practitioners (myself included) aren't brainwashed. That's kind of offensive! It's just a great practice.

 

Like others have said, most of these topics that involve kunlun are people who don't know much about it either asking about it, or bashing it. The demand is high. It can seem like a controversial thing. As someone who has done it, I try to help sometimes by giving my point of view, especially for people who genuinely seem interested in it. And the only reason why I feel any need to respond to the negative posts about it, is just because the people are make it are spreading misinformation. That'll turn off someone who might actually be looking for a decent cultivation practice like this one!

 

I mean, I probably would've never gone to the seminar if I read all of the stuff that's been being posted recently. Like how Max is an NLP conman, how practitioners think he's a messiah, how they're brainwashed, etc...I definitely would've been like, "yeah looks like a cult". But it's not, so please stop spreading lies about it just because you don't want to read about it. Just skip over the topics. Let others be interested in it, and don't try to dissuade them, thinking you know more...because the fact is that you don't know enough about this practice to comment on it. I don't mean to say that in a mean way, but it's just true.

 

I don't see what's so hard about letting people talk about what they want to talk about. If someone has a question about kunlun, they should feel free to ask here. It IS a taoist practice. This place DOES have to do with qigong and cultivation, which is what the whole kunlun thing is about. So, I hope this helps.

[Spectrum]

Feel free to post a review of the kunlun training after you've attended a workshop and trained face to face.

 

Video would be awesome.

 

Oh and Unban Ron Jeremy while were policing ttb...

Edited May 30, 2008 by Spectrum

[passenger1980]

I apologize. I thought you were saying that you don't care to post here (on The TaoBums). Looking back, I see that I was wrong.

 

Thanks again for sharing your thoughts with us.

 

AugusLeo

 

Then sorry for my harsh words.

 

Scotty, I also apologize for my words about Kunlun, but i'm being honest. I also find it incredible that you ask me to learn more about Kunlun (and that means buying their product...).

 

All i can say about it is what i see and read, and i see lots of members writing in every topic imaginable about this practice as it is supposed to be a cornerstone of spiritual development. With all my flaws and wrong choices in words, i think no one can deny that almost 50% of the topics on the opening pages are Kunlun ones, and what i said that in almost every topic, in the third and four posts the whole thing goes into kunlun mode, no matter what the initial thread was. Do a search for Kunlun, Max, etc in google, it's all in taobums...Kunlun is not something you find in every esoteric, buddhist, taoist, new age forum or portal, it's just here.

 

To the practitioners maybe there is nothing wrong with this, for someone like me who still can't understand what the hell is this word and practice, and why it is all over the forum, that is another story.

[Spectrum]

To the practitioners maybe there is nothing wrong with this, for someone like me who still can't understand what the hell is this word and practice, and why it is all over the forum, that is another story.

 

That's because Kunlun school has had (what could be considered an advantageous position) here in Taobums where the teacher and teaching has had a "forum" following it. Those of us who are from other schools and have also been on TB for a spell, have had a longer time to observe the forumite following.

 

I am not saying that I disbelieve the teachings,or even the 'wordplay' of which I am most guilty, terms like 'kunlun' basically being the sign and signet for the whole thing and all. I like many have been trained in chi gung/taiji under the basic Taoist precepts of transforming Jing Chi & Shen for the benifit of martial healing.

 

What I choose to 'speak' is based on personal experience, face to face, about anyone, not just Max. So until I meet Max and get to play in the Kunlun crowd for an hour, a day, or more, I can not say. These words do no justice to anyones practice.

 

What is Kunlun? Lets follow the Story and we might find out! Follow the personalities, and we may be dissapointed.

 

In this free spirit of inquiry another member of the forum has sponsored me to attend a Kunlun workshop at our earliest convenience. Hopefully the Hawaii workshop.

Edited May 30, 2008 by Spectrum

[Aetherous]

Passenger,

 

Honesty is the best. It's all good. I am not asking you to buy anything, or learn more. I just said it's not cool to bash things that you don't know enough about.

 

About the money thing, for the book...lulu charges quite a bit for anything. I made a book of my poems to give to family and to buy it they charge like 30 bucks. Totally ridiculous...but I guess that's what you get with a publish-yourself-publisher. It's not an unreasonable cost for a book, anyway, for the Pillars of Bliss book. 14 bucks I think. If you go to a barnes and noble and want to buy some kind of spiritual book, it's usually that much or more. So I don't see where the problem is? Maybe because the info on how to do the practice isn't readily available online for free? I don't know...I just respect the wishes of the guys and don't give out the info for free. There's a lot of nice little tidbits in that tiny book, that even after a little while of practice I still find myself going back to it and learning something new. So I think if I just told people how to do it for free on a forum or something, it wouldn't contain enough useful information. Like: what to expect from the practice, preliminary techniques, how to know you're doing the celibacy thing wrong and what to do if things go wrong, etc...a lot of info.

 

By the way, I'm not trying to get you to buy the book..just talking about this to share my experience.

 

And the seminar, I used to think 300 bucks was a lot...but the hotel cost like 150-200 a night per room where we were at. The crew of kunlun tour people (which was like maybe 5 of them) stayed for more days than I did. They had to eat. They had to rent out the conference room in the hotel...they might make a LITTLE. Oh yeah, they had to get plane tickets too. So in the end when you take that all into consideration, it's a fair price to pay.

 

Other seminars for similar subjects cost quite a bit more. Could these guys do it for free? Yeah, and I'm sure some kunlun teachers that are being approved to teach the kunlun stuff are doing just that. I know I would if I got the okay.

 

So anyway, the point I'm trying to make is that this isn't such a ridiculous thing to pay for. Just saying this to make sure people aren't thinking it's some huge scam. Not saying it to convince you to do it!

 

And it's all over the forum because it's an all encompassing practice. People who've done it are for the most part still excited about it...I'm definitely still like, "hell yeah!" People who have seen the website and stuff are interested in it, and want to know more, so they ask. Experienced people answer. So that's why it's all over this website.

 

It's not an essential thing to learn about and do. Not required for spiritual stuff, or whatever else your goal may be in coming here. If you don't want to know about it, then just ignore it. Make a topic about something else.

 

Things will calm down here I think, as more of the seminar-goers have the chance to discuss their personal practice on the seperate kunlun forum which recently appeared, and more beginners are told the basics: get the book, go to a seminar, see for yourself.

[AugustLeo]

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[Yoda]

Hundun,

 

So what's the other forum like this one? I have a hard time fitting into one forum myself, so I'm always open to visiting others. (Overabundance of posting chi.)

 

Yoda

[Guest winpro07]

None of these posts, either for , or against KunLun matter in the least.

 

Argueing against what you do not like is a very good way to stay connected with what you do not like.

 

Argueing for what we love wastes energy that might be better spent elsewere.

[Sahaj Nath]

Hundun,

 

So what's the other forum like this one? I have a hard time fitting into one forum myself, so I'm always open to visiting others. (Overabundance of posting chi.)

 

Yoda

 

 

i'm talking a long time ago, bro. that forum doesn't exist anymore. it was a kundalini support group founded by a woman named el collie who died some time ago as well. she'd had a very intense K awakening that was very debilitating at times. i don't know how much you've followed my posts on this forum, but i talked a bit about that time period for me way back in august, i think. i even talked about meeting the guy who would become my teacher and taught me a couple of tricks for easing the intensities of what i was going through. he touched my third eye and things in my body immediately calmed down.

 

 

you're welcome to look up el collie, but i doubt you'll find much. the forum went off line ages ago. but it was a place where lots of folks went and asked questions and shared remedies for their kundalini trials. people shared their practices sometimes, too. but it could be pretty new-agey at times, and that sucked.

 

i guess it wasn't really like TTB but it's the only other forum of a spiritual nature that i've ever been on, and a lot of advice was asked for and shared.

 

i miss her.

 

 

 

btw,

 

i hear there are some good topics and experiences shared and explored over at AYP.

[passenger1980]

Passenger,

 

Honesty is the best. It's all good. I am not asking you to buy anything, or learn more. I just said it's not cool to bash things that you don't know enough about.

 

About the money thing, for the book...lulu charges quite a bit for anything. I made a book of my poems to give to family and to buy it they charge like 30 bucks. Totally ridiculous...but I guess that's what you get with a publish-yourself-publisher. It's not an unreasonable cost for a book, anyway, for the Pillars of Bliss book. 14 bucks I think. If you go to a barnes and noble and want to buy some kind of spiritual book, it's usually that much or more. So I don't see where the problem is? Maybe because the info on how to do the practice isn't readily available online for free? I don't know...I just respect the wishes of the guys and don't give out the info for free. There's a lot of nice little tidbits in that tiny book, that even after a little while of practice I still find myself going back to it and learning something new. So I think if I just told people how to do it for free on a forum or something, it wouldn't contain enough useful information. Like: what to expect from the practice, preliminary techniques, how to know you're doing the celibacy thing wrong and what to do if things go wrong, etc...a lot of info.

 

By the way, I'm not trying to get you to buy the book..just talking about this to share my experience.

 

And the seminar, I used to think 300 bucks was a lot...but the hotel cost like 150-200 a night per room where we were at. The crew of kunlun tour people (which was like maybe 5 of them) stayed for more days than I did. They had to eat. They had to rent out the conference room in the hotel...they might make a LITTLE. Oh yeah, they had to get plane tickets too. So in the end when you take that all into consideration, it's a fair price to pay.

 

Other seminars for similar subjects cost quite a bit more. Could these guys do it for free? Yeah, and I'm sure some kunlun teachers that are being approved to teach the kunlun stuff are doing just that. I know I would if I got the okay.

 

So anyway, the point I'm trying to make is that this isn't such a ridiculous thing to pay for. Just saying this to make sure people aren't thinking it's some huge scam. Not saying it to convince you to do it!

 

And it's all over the forum because it's an all encompassing practice. People who've done it are for the most part still excited about it...I'm definitely still like, "hell yeah!" People who have seen the website and stuff are interested in it, and want to know more, so they ask. Experienced people answer. So that's why it's all over this website.

 

It's not an essential thing to learn about and do. Not required for spiritual stuff, or whatever else your goal may be in coming here. If you don't want to know about it, then just ignore it. Make a topic about something else.

 

Things will calm down here I think, as more of the seminar-goers have the chance to discuss their personal practice on the seperate kunlun forum which recently appeared, and more beginners are told the basics: get the book, go to a seminar, see for yourself.

 

I really appreciate your time and dedication to explain me some particular points of this phenomenon. Either way, the basic problem is that i'm not interested, so i won't be getting the book any time soon.

 

So i guess i'll lay low for the next weeks and hope for the best in the forum. Thanks a lot for everyone replying and sharing information and advises.

[Eric23]

Oh and Unban Ron Jeremy while were policing ttb...

 

I'm pretty sure Ron is around in a different persona

[gendao]

i'm talking a long time ago, bro. that forum doesn't exist anymore. it was a kundalini support group founded by a woman named el collie who died some time ago as well. she'd had a very intense K awakening that was very debilitating at times. i don't know how much you've followed my posts on this forum, but i talked a bit about that time period for me way back in august, i think. i even talked about meeting the guy who would become my teacher and taught me a couple of tricks for easing the intensities of what i was going through. he touched my third eye and things in my body immediately calmed down.

you're welcome to look up el collie, but i doubt you'll find much. the forum went off line ages ago. but it was a place where lots of folks went and asked questions and shared remedies for their kundalini trials. people shared their practices sometimes, too. but it could be pretty new-agey at times, and that sucked.

 

i guess it wasn't really like TTB but it's the only other forum of a spiritual nature that i've ever been on, and a lot of advice was asked for and shared.

 

i miss her.

Yea, she has a great site and story. What exactly do you think killed her, though? Possibly side-effects from the kundalini awakening? Or nonrelated?

 

What ARE the possible risks or side-effects with kundalini, anyways? And how can we avoid them?

[joeblast]

good little tidbit:

 

What causes these kriyas? Most of the literature I have found says that when the 'prana', or life-force is increased in the body, it's crudely analogous to water pressure being increased in a hose. If the pressure is radically increased and the hose is narrow, the force of the water will make the hose whip around furiously.

[voidisyinyang]

It's a fascinating video nonetheless! Basically when he gets the man's valuables -- essentially what's happening is just STRONG MARKETING -- like impulse buying in reverse. I'm sure we've all be subjected to salespeople -- and all of us have "given in" on occasion.

 

What the typical salesperson relies on is SEX ENERGY to sell -- this is subconscious kidney energy projected to the person -- as FEAR or ANGER or LUST.

 

So, as in the video, if you can make direct eye contact (an essential tool) and if you get them to exchange something physically (say a PEN or in this case a BOTTLE) and then if you can keep them distracted (point of in the distance, step back, change hands, etc.) you can usually get a person to BREAK THEIR WILL -- which again is just their subconscious energy.

 

It's basically like strong flirtation but with a specific material goal instead of physical sex -- taking their physical goods, etc.

 

Again these NLP techniques rely still on the subconscious manipulation of other people's subconsious energy.

 

True alchemy is much more powerful than NLP or other "strong marketing" tactics since alchemy relies on the CONSCIOUS resonance of the body's emotions into not just "magnetic" charm but also LIGHT AND LOVE.

 

People are into NLP because it fits the marketing corporate culture of the U.S. -- and there's tons of these New Age business cult conventions teaching similar stuff.

 

I'll just explain in detail - so for example a coworker the other day, when I was talking to him about qigong -- while sitting in full-lotus said:

 

YES BUT ISN'T DANGEROUS?

 

He did this as his subconscious kidney energy in order to try to break the power of the third eye. But I registered CONSCIOUSLY his activation of my kidney energy and therefore the location of his consciousness in his body.

 

This is typically how a man flirts with a woman -- why horror movies are so popular -- etc. -- Fear is just the kidney energy reversed which then activates the sex energy -- subconsciously.

[Vajrasattva]

Yea, she has a great site and story. What exactly do you think killed her, though? Possibly side-effects from the kundalini awakening? Or nonrelated?

 

What ARE the possible risks or side-effects with kundalini, anyways? And how can we avoid them?

 

Ellie was a close friend of Dr. Morris.

 

Glenn & I always said her issue was a lack of ROOTING. Grounding is not enough.

Peace

 

Santiago

Edited May 30, 2008 by Vajrasattva

[joeblast]

Ellie was a close friend of Dr. Morris.

 

Glenn & I always said her issue was a lack of ROOTING. Grounding is not enough.

Peace

 

Santiago

Perhaps a good direction for discussion (if not here, another thread) is grounding vs rooting.

[gendao]

Perhaps a good direction for discussion (if not here, another thread) is grounding vs rooting.

I agree. WTH is the difference?

[Sahaj Nath]

Yea, she has a great site and story. What exactly do you think killed her, though? Possibly side-effects from the kundalini awakening? Or nonrelated?

 

What ARE the possible risks or side-effects with kundalini, anyways? And how can we avoid them?

 

in a nutshell, proper training is the only real antidote. there was so much we didn't know about the process back then. we were all wandering around in the dark trying to figure it out. a few people claimed to understand it all, but very few of them actually did.

 

i trust that Glenn's system has worked it out. Glenn wasn't bullshit. he did his homework, which so many would-be masters always want to avoid for some reason.

 

i plan to do the KAP workshop at some point. i want to learn everything i don't know, about the process so i can be more skillful with my students and clients.

 

 

 

good little tidbit:

 

What causes these kriyas? Most of the literature I have found says that when the 'prana', or life-force is increased in the body, it's crudely analogous to water pressure being increased in a hose. If the pressure is radically increased and the hose is narrow, the force of the water will make the hose whip around furiously.

 

 

'crudely analogous' is how i would put it. but yeah, i think that's a functional analogy. i've only had really minor kriya episodes, which is one of the reasons i'm not quick to say that i have a fully awakened K.

[Heidi1975]

Yea, she has a great site and story. What exactly do you think killed her, though? Possibly side-effects from the kundalini awakening? Or nonrelated?

 

What ARE the possible risks or side-effects with kundalini, anyways? And how can we avoid them?

Thanks for sharing that link! It was very enlightening....and a bit scary to think about at the same time. Now I know what my body is actually doing, but at least I'm in control so far.

 

Here's our chance to hi-jack this thread and make it non-kunlun.