Indiken

spiritual traditions on fools

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hello.

 

i did realize in this forum, that i am a fool.

 

it is sad and very personal,

 

my question is,

 

what views do have different spiritual traditions about fools?

 

i promise not to troll this time

 

:blush:

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, stirling said:

Ironically, The Fool most often indicates new beginnings. 

 

https://www.thetarotguide.com/the-fool

 

oh,

i was called,

also, a child tarot in another place. :)

 

god to know.

tahnk you.

and 

deep bows to you.

Edited by Indiken

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14 hours ago, Indiken said:

hello.

 

i did realize in this forum, that i am a fool.

 

it is sad and very personal,

 

my question is,

 

what views do have different spiritual traditions about fools?

 

i promise not to troll this time

 

:blush:

 

You may not know that the most suitable type of person for Taoist Inner Alchemy is not a smart person, but rather a dumb one.   A smart person usually has a lot of desires, a quick mind, in-depth thinking.  All these are harmful to stilling the mind.  A dumb and dedicated person, willing to take all the boredom, loneliness, without query, is more ideal.   As to whether fool and dumb are the same or which kind of fool is more suitable, it is not clear.

 

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Quote

Tao Te Ching - Lao Tzu - chapter 20

Give up learning, and put an end to your troubles.

Is there a difference between yes and no?
Is there a difference between good and evil?
Must I fear what others fear? What nonsense!
Other people are contented, enjoying the sacrificial feast of the ox.
In spring some go to the park, and climb the terrace,
But I alone am drifting not knowing where I am.
Like a new-born babe before it learns to smile,
I am alone, without a place to go.

Others have more than they need, but I alone have nothing.
I am a fool. Oh, yes! I am confused.
Other men are clear and bright,
But I alone am dim and weak.
Other men are sharp and clever,
But I alone am dull and stupid.
Oh, I drift like the waves of the sea.
Without direction, like the restless wind.

Everyone else is busy,
But I alone am aimless and depressed.
I am different.
I am nourished by the great mother.

source -- https://www.wussu.com/laotzu/laotzu20.html

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7 minutes ago, Indiken said:

 

thank you, dwai,

 

i was too shy to tell this to people here,

 

same words from different mouths do differ, don't they?

I’ve found that each individual goes through a journey to reach this conclusion. Sometimes the journey spans lifetimes :) 

 

 

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13 minutes ago, forestofemptiness said:

"One who teaches oneself has a fool for a student." 

  --- Lincoln Tzu 

 

hey, forest,

could you explain?

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On 4/21/2021 at 5:24 AM, Indiken said:

i did realize in this forum, that i am a fool.

 

Hi Indiken,

 

So am I...

 

 

 

- Anand

 

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On 4/21/2021 at 6:04 AM, stirling said:

The Fool most often indicates new beginnings.

 

 

 

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11 hours ago, Master Logray said:

As to whether fool and dumb are the same or which kind of fool is more suitable, it is not clear.

 

th?id=OIP.jP96ggasuoUb1KDRsSZevQHaEg&pid=Api&P=0&w=285&h=175

 

7f96409a8e9402621dea5cc7306fc7ab.gif

 

 

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, forestofemptiness said:

"One who teaches oneself has a fool for a student." 

  --- Lincoln Tzu

 

7 hours ago, Indiken said:

hey, forest,

could you explain?

 

 

th?id=OIP.I31zL_FQTS3FxqNAFl4JFAHaJj&pid=Api&P=0&w=300&h=300

 th?id=OIP.54ucDvSd6bgwhdeMefgm-AHaHa&pid=Api&P=0&w=300&h=300

th?id=OIP.gb5fecdGD-2ZEkX2LVQpEAHaJj&pid=Api&P=0&w=300&h=300

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Limahong
Enhancement

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8 hours ago, Indiken said:

same words from different mouths do differ, don't they?

 

 

th?id=OIP.4jZUcC-CCY-806PSKqkocQHaE4&pid=Api&P=0&w=268&h=177

 

 

all_about_me_rainbow.gif

 

 

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1 hour ago, Limahong said:

 

 

 

Ah... but the fool DOES learn. The journey is through the major arcana. In terms of the tarot, the subject of ALL readings is understood to have begun as the fool.

 

Yes, this means you and me as well. :) 

 

The real fool is the one who believes there is any journey (path) or agency at all. 

 

 

 

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hey, Limahong,

 

i had thoughts about you and questions to ask,

 

but i did hesitate to write pm to you,

 

and here you came and answered them,

 

there is possibility that you did not realize this consciously,

 

interesting the life is, isn't it? :D

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8 hours ago, stirling said:

Ah... but the fool DOES learn.

 

Hi stirling,

 

Thanks to Indiken ~ there is something humbling about this thread.

 

YES ~ 'the fool DOES learn'. Why?

It is cool ~ to be a fool. But don't dump me into the pool.

 

 

8 hours ago, stirling said:

The journey is through the major arcana. In terms of the tarot, the subject of ALL readings is understood to have begun as the fool.

 

I am not into the Tarot. But I live Life on a road less traveled as...

 

th?id=OIP.JX6v820dH9OQrYPw3IKXJgHaEK&pid=Api&P=0&w=330&h=187

 

 

8 hours ago, stirling said:

Yes, this means you and me as well.

 

But of course ~ yes.

 

 

8 hours ago, stirling said:

The real fool is the one who believes there is any journey (path) or agency at all. 

 

Heaven forbids ~ I do not want to walk in his/her path.

Why? Only a real fool leaves behind a foolprint...

th?id=OIP.rQUO_ghPvoSYNyEIGFA1aQHaHa&pid=Api&P=0&w=300&h=300

 

But an ordained fool leaves behind...

th?id=OIP.cHjP-TlvXsFsy9FEkIO7PQAAAA&pid=Api&P=0&w=220&h=165

 

 

Thank you for...

.th?id=OIP.fmJc1k7BMz3Ui7WRc6gB0AAAAA&pid=Api&P=0&w=300&h=300

 

I am hearing it for the first time...

 

- Anand

 

 

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On 4/21/2021 at 7:48 AM, dwai said:

 

 

 

I keep this in mind all the time.  Because my brain is getting confused about worldly things (like what day it is.  seriously) I take a little comfort knowing that the sage too considered himself a fool.  A fool would be the same as the beginner's mind, no?  The beginner's mind is what is strived for.  A mind which has no pre--conclusions or as void of conditioning as possible.  Dementia is doing it for me on the natch, but I also wonder if worldly thoughts haven't taken a back seat to metaphysical thinking.

 

The fact that someone comes to the conclusion that they have been a fool is a momentous event.  It means, for that moment at least, that arrogance has been conquered, true humility is within reach.  I applaud you, @Indiken, for your courage and your willingness to share your evolution here with us.  You're a real quick study, aren't you?  :)

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2 minutes ago, manitou said:

Dementia is doing it for me on the natch, but I also wonder if worldly thoughts haven't taken a back seat to metaphysical thinking.

 

Damn, sorry to hear that. But glad you obviously have developed the skills to cope with it (or so it seems from here). 

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6 minutes ago, manitou said:

 

I keep this in mind all the time.  Because my brain is getting confused about worldly things (like what day it is.  seriously) I take a little comfort knowing that the sage too considered himself a fool.  A fool would be the same as the beginner's mind, no?  The beginner's mind is what is strived for.  A mind which has no pre--conclusions or as void of conditioning as possible.  Dementia is doing it for me on the natch, but I also wonder if worldly thoughts haven't taken a back seat to metaphysical thinking.

 

The fact that someone comes to the conclusion that they have been a fool is a momentous event.  It means, for that moment at least, that arrogance has been conquered, true humility is within reach.  I applaud you, @Indiken, for your courage and your willingness to share your evolution here with us.  You're a real quick study, aren't you?  :)

 

thank you,

 

the community is very helpful,

 

i am really sorry,

 

should i write this?

 

there is a possibility, that i work not from a daoist viewpoint,

 

the thread was,

 

to attract people who want to humiliate me,

 

and exercise my abilities to lie,

 

in other words,

 

i did want to manipulate people here,

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24 minutes ago, manitou said:

The fact that someone comes to the conclusion that they have been a fool is a momentous event.  It means, for that moment at least, that arrogance has been conquered, true humility is within reach.  I applaud you, @Indiken, for your courage and your willingness to share your evolution here with us.  You're a real quick study, aren't you?

In our system (Temple style), we are repeatedly reminded to let go of artificial knowledge, acquired mental conditioning, so we can become like a child - not judging, not categorizing as “me and other” or “friend and foe”, etc. The adage “no enemy, no self” is a simple statement but its significance reverberates in all aspects of life (especially as we go deeper into that practice/way of life). 

 

But I have to admit that it is very hard to live by in the transactional  world — at least in many aspects thereof. One of the most humbling experiences of my life so far, has been in the process of reconciling of my professional objectives with the dropping of ambition (attachment).
 

As it unfolds, often in profoundly confounding ways, the dropping of personality identification causes turmoil...in family life and therefore in professional life. 

 

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52 minutes ago, Indiken said:

 

the thread was,

 

to attract people who want to humiliate me,

 

 

Indiken,

 

I suspect you won´t find many people here who want to humiliate you.  That may or may not be what you´re used to, but it´s probably for the best.

 

Luke

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15 minutes ago, liminal_luke said:

 

Indiken,

 

I suspect you won´t find many people here who want to humiliate you.  That may or may not be what you´re used to, but it´s probably for the best.

 

Luke

Well said Luke! 

The most progress happens when we let our defenses down and open ourselves up. After that, if someone tries to "hurt" us, it is their problem, not ours. 

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1 hour ago, manitou said:

my brain is getting confused about worldly things

 

Hi Barbara,

 

To hell with worldly things ~ they are there to confuse us.

 

For those who like to control/manipulate/divide... the world ~ confusion is their ally.

 

You have come a long long from the time you lost J.

 

There is now a lot of clarity in your thoughts.

 

53 minutes ago, Indiken said:

(like what day it is.  seriously)

 

Seriously ~ if you dare to forget what day it is  (everyday)... I will descend upon you with a virtual cane.

 

I whack hard ~ be it virtual or otherwise.

 

th?id=OIP.ePmmIODjwNSCp_a1JqlXZAHaLH&pid=Api&P=0&w=300&h=300 th?id=OIP.Q9y0xz8fCmgkX9DSeyjdLQHaFj&pid=Api&P=0&w=236&h=178 th?id=OIP.1s2Dqkss6h8oblR0rOpX_AAAAA&pid=Api&P=0&w=300&h=300

 

 

1 hour ago, manitou said:

The fact that someone comes to the conclusion that they have been a fool is a momentous event.

 

Can I have a dance with you...

 

 

 

Thank you.

 

- Anand

 

 

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