Connection between tao and christianity

[flowing hands]

On 12/8/2019 at 3:58 PM, Walker said:

 

Wait. Who told you my street name?

 

Ok, so how do you propose to prove to us that you're actually talking to Laozi?

 

You claiming to be possessed doesn't make you any more credible to any of us than the average pair of Mormons on bicycles.

 

If you can offer the world no more proof than "take my word for it," well...

 

I suspect the answer most sensible men, women, and others with clever, astute, and intrepid private parts like my own will give you is:

 

"No."

 

?

Edited June 24, 2020 by flowing hands

[SirPalomides]

I believe this is where one simply says “OK boomer”

[Earl Grey]

6 minutes ago, SirPalomides said:

I believe this is where one simply says “OK boomer”

 

Careful! He's possessed by an immortal spirit! He thinks Boomers are children comparatively! 

 

More appropriate would be something of the Cretaceous period. 

 

"Okay Raptor Jesus!" should suffice. 

[flowing hands]

On 12/8/2019 at 6:17 PM, Earl Grey said:

 

Careful! He's possessed by an immortal spirit! He thinks Boomers are children comparatively! 

 

More appropriate would be something of the Cretaceous period. 

 

"Okay Raptor Jesus!" should suffice. 

 

?

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 24, 2020 by flowing hands

[Zork]

8 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

Ok Oil of Bergamot, test your Chinese out, here is my sects prayer, if you can find any hint of respecting jesus, god or any Christian saint, Allah etc.then I'm a monkey from Mars.

How is the weather on Mars this time of year?

[SirPalomides]

1 hour ago, flowing hands said:

 

Ok Oil of Bergamot, test your Chinese out, here is my sects prayer, if you can find any hint of respecting jesus, god or any Christian saint, Allah etc.then I'm a monkey from Mars.

 

 

 
I see “Taishang Laojun,” obviously a reference to Allah. “Wang Mu Niangniang”- the Theotokos Virgin Mary of course. Reference to the thunder immortals obviously the sons of thunder, James and John.

hey, why are you posting Christian prayers?

Edited December 8, 2019 by SirPalomides

[flowing hands]

On 12/8/2019 at 9:04 PM, SirPalomides said:

I see “Taishang Laojun,” obviously a reference to Allah. “Wang Mu Niangniang”- the Theotokos Virgin Mary of course. Reference to the thunder immortals obviously the sons of thunder, James and John.

hey, why are you posting Christian prayers?

 

0

Edited June 24, 2020 by flowing hands

[SirPalomides]

Some people say Shou-Lao’s head resembles a phallus, so I’ll take that as a complement. I’ve got a surplus of jing, baby.

[flowing hands]

On 12/8/2019 at 8:40 PM, Zork said:

How is the weather on Mars this time of year?

 

=

Edited June 24, 2020 by flowing hands

[flowing hands]

On 12/8/2019 at 9:46 PM, SirPalomides said:

Some people say Shou-Lao’s head resembles a phallus, so I’ll take that as a complement. I’ve got a surplus of jing, baby.

 

0

Edited June 24, 2020 by flowing hands

[SirPalomides]

Rhyming Zork with Dork is such a master stroke of genius that only an immortal wit could have revealed it to you.

 

Incidentally an anagram of “flowing hands” is “fondling haws.” Leave the haws alone, man.

[flowing hands]

On 12/8/2019 at 10:12 PM, SirPalomides said:

Rhyming Zork with Dork is such a master stroke of genius that only an immortal wit could have revealed it to you.

 

Incidentally an anagram of “flowing hands” is “fondling haws.” Leave the haws alone, man.

 

8

Edited June 24, 2020 by flowing hands

[Walker]

5 hours ago, flowing hands said:

 

Wait. 'oil of bergamot', the diplomat's son has joined the trolls all the way from California where the almond groves are taking up all the water resources from the region. He'll soon ride on a "sanctimonious turd" and land on the beach ready to wow the folks with all his writings.

Well, get your clever dick backside off to Malaysia or Taiwan, go to a Daoist temple and find a genuine shaman and ask him to invite the Immortal master to come  and then ask all you like. But whatever you do, don't use your clever dick words with the Immortal master. If you look at the prayer I made available for folks on here, which is used in most temples to respect the gods and goddesses in heaven, you will find funnily enough there's no mention of jesus or a single god. I wonder why?!!! Of course Daoist shamanism has been practiced for more than ten thousand years before jesus was ever thought up. Do you not think that such people know what is in the heavens ?  Did you see the famous Master Chuang from Taiwan when he carried out the rites and prayers to heaven utter anything about jesus being there? quick and short answer, no.

 

I honestly read this very carefully and I cannot tell how it proves that you talk to Laozi.

 

Can you clarify?

[Earl Grey]

12 hours ago, flowing hands said:

 

Wait. 'oil of bergamot', the diplomat's son has joined the trolls all the way from California where the almond groves are taking up all the water resources from the region. He'll soon ride on a "sanctimonious turd" and land on the beach ready to wow the folks with all his writings.

Well, get your clever dick backside off to Malaysia or Taiwan, go to a Daoist temple and find a genuine shaman and ask him to invite the Immortal master to come  and then ask all you like. But whatever you do, don't use your clever dick words with the Immortal master. If you look at the prayer I made available for folks on here, which is used in most temples to respect the gods and goddesses in heaven, you will find funnily enough there's no mention of jesus or a single god. I wonder why?!!! Of course Daoist shamanism has been practiced for more than ten thousand years before jesus was ever thought up. Do you not think that such people know what is in the heavens ?  Did you see the famous Master Chuang from Taiwan when he carried out the rites and prayers to heaven utter anything about jesus being there? quick and short answer, no.

It dawned upon me that you were insulting me here already in a reply to Walker, and it’s before I even posted the first time here, because I liked his comment and laughed at yours. Besides how your insults are hardly original and lacking in wit, you’re pretty childish for an old man and self-declared “holy man” of Taoism—a term I’ve never heard in translation of any Taoists I’ve encountered.

 

But to address your colorful characterization of me, no, I’m not a diplomat’s son (there are other ways to grow up overseas as a young expat), I’m not from California (but i do hold residency from living there longer than other states), and I do enjoy writing, and none of these things sound even remotely like anything someone would be phased by, even after they realize how pathetic you sound attempting to be witty. But your attempt to discredit me because the state you think I’m from is being wasteful for nuts yet ignores their many initiatives on the environment is both ill-informed and hilarious—that’s like me saying your temple and its prestige mean nothing because of almost no Taoists compared to Muslims in Malaysia. There’s no causation between the two, nor is your description of me anything but amusing—cute even.

 

In any case, besides what I read and was said already by both SirPalomides and Walker, your sect prayer doesn’t mean anything to me—even before reading it, I only needed to see the word “sect” and that was clear enough that it’s just you, not all Taoism or Taoists.

 

You seriously need to grow up, man. All you’re doing is embarrassing yourself and for what? Because I just said it’s your sect in another thread and you immediately began the personal insults since I didn’t bow down to your authority that you claim for all Taoism? 
 

Not very Taoist, if you ask me, let alone holy, if that’s the word you insist on using, and most definitely doesn’t seem like any manner of how a grown-ass man would conduct himself.

Edited December 9, 2019 by Earl Grey

[flowing hands]

On 12/9/2019 at 6:11 AM, Earl Grey said:

It dawned upon me that you were insulting me here already in a reply to Walker, and it’s before I even posted the first time here, because I liked his comment and laughed at yours. Besides how your insults are hardly original and lacking in wit, you’re pretty childish for an old man and self-declared “holy man” of Taoism—a term I’ve never heard in translation of any Taoists I’ve encountered.

 

But to address your colorful characterization of me, no, I’m not a diplomat’s son (there are other ways to grow up overseas as a young expat), I’m not from California (but i do hold residency from living there longer than other states), and I do enjoy writing, and none of these things sound even remotely like anything someone would be phased by, even after they realize how pathetic you sound attempting to be witty. But your attempt to discredit me because the state you think I’m from is being wasteful for nuts yet ignores their many initiatives on the environment is both ill-informed and hilarious—that’s like me saying your temple and its prestige mean nothing because of almost no Taoists compared to Muslims in Malaysia. There’s no causation between the two, nor is your description of me anything but amusing—cute even.

 

In any case, besides what I read and was said already by both SirPalomides and Walker, your sect prayer doesn’t mean anything to me—even before reading it, I only needed to see the word “sect” and that was clear enough that it’s just you, not all Taoism or Taoists.

 

You seriously need to grow up, man. All you’re doing is embarrassing yourself and for what? Because I just said it’s your sect in another thread and you immediately began the personal insults since I didn’t bow down to your authority that you claim for all Taoism? 
 

Not very Taoist, if you ask me, let alone holy, if that’s the word you insist on using, and most definitely doesn’t seem like any manner of how a grown-ass man would conduct himself.

 

!

Edited June 24, 2020 by flowing hands

[moment]

4 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

 

You have your own perspectives, where these come from are multiple places. Rarely do perspectives come from a true place. I have tried to tell many on here about the fact that what is commonly held views about religion and how it has spread across the world, like a cancer, or opiate, turning people into unthinking morons to use Zork's favourite word and then altering our view and use of the environment till it cannot stand any more abuse and changing people's minds till they cannot think in any different way. What do I get from you and the others, name calling and you say about me being childish, my god you lot need to look at yourselves, it's like a playground and the dark skinned boy comes to school for the first time, says things from a different world view and you round on him like a bunch of hyenas. This sadly has been the usual way people with a different view or any real knowledge has been treated on TDBs. You have been part of it; a laughing, insulting, dismissive, name calling hyena, along with all the other gang members who see a potential to up their status in the playground. 

Yes I belong to a sect it's called Mao Shan. It literally means the teachings from the lineage from that range of mountains in China. Most Daoism comes from sects. Anything you may have learn't has originally come from a sect/lineage (pai) of Daoism. It's nothing bad as you make it out to be.Thats speaks volumes to me. Remember you started the insults along with your side kick Zork. I reported you and Zork to the mods and got no response, Sean and the mods seem to be preoccupied with any Nazis on here and not people who use belittling words and insults. So all is fair in love and war. If you want to insult me for having a different opinion and world view then I will insult you back. Why do you think you can get away with it and then I retaliate and you then call me childish etc. doesn't add up does it? Who's being childish in the first place? You, Zork etc. I'm telling you the truth and for that you insult me and my pai. It may not be your truth, but am I insulting you for your perspective? No, I am saying that we cannot believe what is written is the truth and I made examples of Daoist books also. What is so wrong with that, that it offends so many peoples perspectives? Jeff here is so beyond any reasoned argument that he almost has an apperplexy if you suggest anything about Jesus not being the true messiah. Now that's what I call childish. So young hyena, get your own house in order before you start rounding on me, because it seems anything I say you disagree with and you and Zork didn't need to come on this thread, but you thought it would be good to keep on taunting didn't you. I will just make fun of you also, yes in a childish way, because you have left me with no other way to deal with you in a reasonable way.

There are always other choices.

Edited December 9, 2019 by moment

[Earl Grey]

41 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

You have your own perspectives, where these come from are multiple places.

 

Exactly what I said when it comes from your sect! 

 

41 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

Rarely do perspectives come from a true place.

 

Don't be so certain you are the gatekeeper and judge for truth--everyone believes themselves to be this.

 

41 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

I have tried to tell many on here about the fact that what is commonly held views about religion and how it has spread across the world, like a cancer, or opiate, turning people into unthinking morons to use Zork's favourite word and then altering our view and use of the environment till it cannot stand any more abuse and changing people's minds till they cannot think in any different way.

 

An absolute view that talks about the dark side of religions, yes, which I am also in agreement with--but you discount the good that they have brought too. 

 

41 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

What do I get from you and the others, name calling and you say about me being childish, my god you lot need to look at yourselves, it's like a playground and the dark skinned boy comes to school for the first time, says things from a different world view and you round on him like a bunch of hyenas.

 

As a "dark skinned boy [who] comes to school for the first time" because I went to many schools growing up from moving around a lot and was the new kid, be very careful about your choice of words and generalizations, for I have more personal experiences as a dark-skinned boy in a new school than your hypothetical example here can come up with and I won't sound as racist as you do.

 

41 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

You have been part of it; a laughing, insulting, dismissive, name calling hyena, along with all the other gang members who see a potential to up their status in the playground. 

 

I remind you, you began with the name-calling, and after I tried to explain that I wasn't even insulting you, you continued to call me names and belittle me. So after a while, I responded in kind. Right here, I merely said 

 

Quote

While I respect your personal level of accomplishment, I can't agree with your assessment or simplification of Christian and Buddhist doctrines, which, even if I do not practice them, respect on some level, on top of the teachings of the Buddha and the Christ, or specifically, Siddartha and Jesus. 

 

I can't comment any further because unfortunately, I do not see analysis or depth of understanding in your arguments, but mostly judgments, and while your specific transmission of the Tao I respect, I do not see it as the authoritative view. 

 

which you took as an insult, as you said here:

 

Quote

Well look at what you have written. You are insulting my Master Li Erh Xian Shi calling his words "not the authoritative view". You are then calling me crap and reinforcing this opinion by saying "so called Holy man". Are you challenging my status?  This is from someone who has made thousands of posts on all sorts of subjects on this site giving his opinion and judgements on many, many subjects. I have told you the truth, I cannot help how the world has turned out, how people have used religion for political manipulation and the manipulation of others. None of you know whether Jesus was alive or not, but like sheep you bleat the same stupid song that the establishment want you to know. The truth is very different and that's all I'm going to say about it.

 

You accused me of insulting your teacher for what? Not agreeing he has the authoritative view? Then you said I am "calling you crap", in your own words, because those are your words, not mine, as nothing in my message said it was crap--all I said was it was just a sect with its own view, not absolute. Then you assumed I was challenging your status, then you criticize me for my participation in the forum. 

 

Grow up.

 

I never was a hyena--I defended myself from your insecurities and what is now abundantly clear that it is also your need to engage in combat with people to reinforce your holy martyr status.

 

41 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

es I belong to a sect it's called Mao Shan. It literally means the teachings from the lineage from that range of mountains in China. Most Daoism comes from sects. Anything you may have learn't has originally come from a sect/lineage (pai) of Daoism. It's nothing bad as you make it out to be

 

Show me where I said it was bad. All I said in our original discussion was that it was your sect, not absolute.

 

41 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

Thats speaks volumes to me. Remember you started the insults along with your side kick Zork.

 

The above citations show otherwise.

 

41 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

I reported you and Zork to the mods and got no response, Sean and the mods seem to be preoccupied with any Nazis on here and not people who use belittling words and insults

 

You would have been gone before us because you started the personal insults, and everyone else saw it too.

 

41 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

So all is fair in love and war.

 

Declaring jihad because you're too proud to admit your comprehension and overreaction were not becoming of either a sage or holy man. There never was a conflict--you started it and I merely defended myself.

 

Don't expect me to speak for Zork just because we happened to be in agreement, but his attitude towards you now shows that I'm not the only one turned off by your childishness.

 

41 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

Why do you think you can get away with it and then I retaliate and you then call me childish etc. doesn't add up does it? Who's being childish in the first place? You, Zork etc. I'm telling you the truth and for that you insult me and my pai. It may not be your truth, but am I insulting you for your perspective?

 

Do you even read what was written by others or do you just react when you see a certain order of words like a stupid algorithm?

 

And yes: you were insulting my perspective, because my perspective does not view your sect as absolute, it is just one of many. You--as I quoted above--did not take it that way and refuse to even step back for one minute and try understand. 

 

41 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

No, I am saying that we cannot believe what is written is the truth and I made examples of Daoist books also.

 

This is true, and I agree with you to an extent. 

 

41 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

What is so wrong with that, that it offends so many peoples perspectives?

 

If it were just that, then it doesn't offend me, or others too, as far as I can see.

 

But it's not just that--it was your reaction and assumption, defensiveness, hostility, and sanctimony, then your refusal to even try to understand.

 

A mature man seeks to understand. An immature man seeks to make others understand him. 

 

You have not sought to understand, and we have--we even said that we weren't saying what you were accusing us of saying, but you keep insisting and insinuating it, then forgetting you began the insults.

 

41 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

Jeff here is so beyond any reasoned argument that he almost has an apperplexy if you suggest anything about Jesus not being the true messiah. Now that's what I call childish.

 

Jeff can speak for himself, and in spite of my own views on him and his practice, I have respect for him by staying in my own lane as he stays in his own lane. 

 

I reply to this point because it is again quite immature to speak ill of other people to prove your point in speaking against me. If you are able to cite other people and their support for you, citing them is still questionable because you're speaking for them rather than letting them speak for themselves. 

 

You seem to think you are the shepherd who is angry not everyone is one of his flock. Humility is a virtue shared between the Buddha, The Prophet, The Christ, Laozi, Kuanyin, Tara, many individuals of high spiritual attainment. You do not appear to have this with your behavior.

 

Before you say that I don't, I will state clearly that I make no pretense of being a sage or holy; I'm spiritual, but I'm also human, and have no problems being angry or flipping you the bird, let alone what you or others think of me. 

 

41 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

So young hyena, get your own house in order before you start rounding on me, because it seems anything I say you disagree with and you and Zork didn't need to come on this thread, but you thought it would be good to keep on taunting didn't you.

 

Are you forgetting that I never said anything before you called me out right here? 

 

Quote

Wait. 'oil of bergamot', the diplomat's son has joined the trolls all the way from California where the almond groves are taking up all the water resources from the region. He'll soon ride on a "sanctimonious turd" and land on the beach ready to wow the folks with all his writings.

 

I never said anything before that, I only laughed at your comment and liked Walker's, but had to come in when you were calling me out and attempting to characterize me. 

 

41 minutes ago, flowing hands said:

I will just make fun of you also, yes in a childish way, because you have left me with no other way to deal with you in a reasonable way.

 

So speaks the holy man of Mao Shan.

 

I respect your sect, but I have lost all respect for you, and somehow, you manage to diminish that opinion of you the more you talk.

 

I like what moment said: "There's always another choice." 

 

Find that other choice, holy man.

 

I'll be waiting for when your better self comes out and you can act appropriately for your age and your title.

 

Until then, you're the one losing sleep over this self-created conflict, not me. 

Edited December 9, 2019 by Earl Grey

[Walker]

2 hours ago, flowing hands said:

No, I am saying that we cannot believe what is written is the truth and I made examples of Daoist books also. 

 

Hey, when you have a bit of time can you explain what solid evidence you can give that your words are more believable than those of Christians and some other Daoists?

 

Thus far I just can't see any.

 

Thanks.

[Walker]

On 12/4/2019 at 7:44 AM, chaugnar said:

My friend is married to a christian.he is struggling to integrate belief systems.he asked if there was a link of tao to christ.i said yes there is.im seeking more info.

 

Hi Chaugnar,

 

Sorry that this post has become a bit of a madhouse. My first suggestion is maybe don't show it to your Christian friend unless you want him/her to immediately (and probably justifiedly) conclude that Daoists Dao Bums are a bunch of insane, bickering weirdos. 

 

Honestly, I think @Everything's short answer above was quite on-point. From a zoomed-out perspective, I think he provided an excellent answer.

 

That said, it might not really appeal to your friend/friend's spouse, because it's a very general answer and probably difficult for a person who has possibly neither had a direct spiritual experience that lends itself to understanding Everything's answer, nor arrived at a similar conclusion philosophically. 

 

There are overlaps between many facets of Christianity and Daoism but it's difficult to know what might appeal to your friends. Can you describe the conflict and the people in question in more detail so we can try and provide answers that have a bit of relevance?

Edited December 9, 2019 by Walker

[rideforever]

The Tao that can be told is not the eternal Tao.
The name that can be named is not the eternal name.
The nameless is the beginning of heaven and Earth.
The named is the mother of the ten thousand things.
Ever desireless, one can see the mystery.
Ever desiring, one sees the manifestations.
These two spring from the same source but differ in name; this appears as darkness.
Darkness within darkness.
The gate to all mystery.

 

The Tao, the mystery, the same source, the gate. 

This text is pointing to one thing ... call it what you will.

Jesus is also pointing to one thing, the Father, the Creator ... call it what you will.

The Son of God is analogous to the microcosm ... once transformed we become a small reflection of the whole.

Therefore the path has two poles of development, the development of contact with the Whole, and the development of contact with the reflection within us of that Whole (the microcosm).

There are also different aspects, or slopes on the mountain : the emotional aspect, the energetic aspect, the aspect of intelligence ... the One is very large and full ... each tradition has chosen a particular aspect to develop.  The Sacred Heart, or Pure Consciousness, or this or that.  It chooses to work on the Universal Aspect (macrocosm) or the Personal Aspect (microcosm).

But all chose to exit the human confusion and unhappiness, and return to the path of real evolution.

 

At the level of development where humans lives there is a huge amount of corruption everywhere.

[rideforever]

In my opinion, Christianity and Daoism are working on very different aspects of the One, and so there is not a great deal of relation until you get higher up the mountain where adepts open up other areas of development.

In Eastern Christianity there are a couple of interesting things.  The first is the Russian Cross, take a look at the third bar, it's special quality ... this could indicate the Tantien.  The second thing is the Black Madonna, the black feminine.  

[Jeff]

3 hours ago, Earl Grey said:

 

 

A mature man seeks to understand. An immature man seeks to make others understand him. 

 

 

 

Well said. Here would be my version of it...

 

A mature man/woman seeks to understand and know all beings,  and in knowing, radiates, but is not attached to what is radiated, and lets it simply flow freely with the Dao.

 

Or...

 

The energy/light that flow with the words, mean (and show) far more than the words themself. 

[EmeraldHead]

1 hour ago, Jeff said:

 

Well said. Here would be my version of it...

 

A mature man/woman seeks to understand and know all beings,  and in knowing, radiates, but is not attached to what is radiated, and lets it simply flow freely with the Dao.

 

Or...

 

The energy/light that flow with the words, mean (and show) far more than the words themself. 

Nice :1

Here's Jesus's words on it. A mater man has made the inner as the outer AND the outer as the inner.

[Zork]

@chaugnar

Yes it is possible to combine both. Look up gnostic christianity and Valis by Phillip K.Dick.

There are differences of course but completely incompatible like the moron a few posts above claims? Nope!

[Zork]

5 hours ago, Earl Grey said:

 

So speaks the holy man of Mao Shan.

Holiness is only declared Post-mortem. Anyone claiming this while alive is anything but. I know of no spiritual teacher of any significant worth saying that.