Why does all this overexposure of Taoist inner alchemy happen?

[Taoist Texts]

5 minutes ago, Mudfoot said:

People who try to practice Nei Dan without having an orbit are fooling themselves?

what about those who try to practice Nei Dan while having an orbit, are they fooling themselves?

[steve]

On 4/21/2019 at 3:07 AM, Zork said:

I mean seriously? Inner alchemy is just a fragment of taoist doctrines. Why do people care so much?

I cared so much because the inner alchemy is a direct and powerful path toward personal transformation.

The philosophical and religious facets of Daoism simply don't offer the same opportunity.

 

On 4/21/2019 at 3:07 AM, Zork said:

Are they ready?

How is one to tell if they are ready?

We generally don't really know until we try.

Often a teacher can help us with that question but even they don't know for sure.

If one starts at the beginning, with an experienced guide, most are ready. 

 

On 4/21/2019 at 3:07 AM, Zork said:

Most people don't know what they are talking about and very few even practice it.

The way I see it only 1 in a million are ready for that.

I disagree, I think many are ready to engage in true practice if they are willing to make a commitment and start at the appropriate place. If you are referring to practicing based on reading books, watching videos, and playing in internet forums then I fully agree, perhaps 1 in a million are ready for that.

 

On 4/21/2019 at 3:07 AM, Zork said:

So really, why there is so much talk about this practice?

I think there is so much talk because there is so little action for many.

For the dedicated practitioners who connect with a teacher and lineage, there is generally a lot less talk.

There is still value for talk, however, to the extent that it can be mutually supportive on our paths. 

 

Just some random thoughts on the matter this beautiful morning after a brief but intense personal retreat.

 

[Zork]

1 hour ago, Taoist Texts said:

Sorry your answer makes no sense. What high voltage? What wires? Could you answer my question directly without meaningless metaphors?

The answer makes perfect sense but you are trying desperately to refute it because it doesn't fit your delusions.

As i said if you don't already have orbit you are not practicing neidan in the first place.

You have been added to my blocked list. End of story.

1 hour ago, Mudfoot said:

It is always hard to look at ones own writing. That's fine, never mind. 

Your mind sees, not the eyes. You saw what you wanted to see. I do not know the reason. Start from there.

[Aetherous]

21 minutes ago, Zork said:

As i said if you don't already have orbit you are not practicing neidan in the first place.

 

Where did you learn neidan?

With the tiny bit I know, it strikes me as non-traditional and non-textual to say that it requires "having the orbit".

[Mudfoot]

31 minutes ago, Zork said:

 

Your mind sees, not the eyes. You saw what you wanted to see. I do not know the reason. Start from there.

Would you please put me on ignore as well?

 

I would take that as a compliment 😁

[Zork]

9 minutes ago, Aetherous said:

 

Where did you learn neidan?

With the tiny bit I know, it strikes me as non-traditional and non-textual to say that it requires "having the orbit".

Thank you for pinpointing the real problem: no one knows wtf they are talking about but still participate.

[Zork]

1 minute ago, Mudfoot said:

Would you please put me on ignore as well?

 

I would take that as a compliment 😁

You are fine. You provide much needed amusement.

[Taoist Texts]

37 minutes ago, Zork said:

you are trying desperately to refute it because it doesn't fit your delusions.

Neidan makes the neidaneers very very angry. We all saw it on this forum and elsewhere. Remarkably there was not a single one of them who would not be given to super angry outbursts of neidan gibberish laced with insults. Every single one of them like that. Poor fellas are driving themselves mad with those orbits of theirs.

[Taoist Texts]

10 minutes ago, Zork said:

You provide much needed amusement.

there is a name for people who need much amusement on the internet forums

[Aetherous]

25 minutes ago, Zork said:

Thank you for pinpointing the real problem: no one knows wtf they are talking about but still participate.

 

...exactly.

[Mudfoot]

16 hours ago, Mudfoot said:

 

And how do you tell the "real" Nei Dan from that which is not? 

/... ... /

You seems to have the answers. 

I am sure they would be useful for all persons searching through the Nei Dan jungle. 

It is nice to be proven right. 

[Starjumper]

I had some thoughts about the subject in the OP.  It seems that these days there is a great focus in the public mind about superpowers.  What I mean is, consider all the movies and TV shows that have all these indestructible super heroes running around saving the planet.  Star wars was one of the earlier good ones and the Jedi are actually based on real people, although most assumed it was all make believe.  I think a big part of this is the technology that allows all the special effects to look so real.  That kind of thing is very appealing to people.  Then add to that the increase in public awareness of avatars and saints with special abilities.  Then blend that with all the clever magic tricks that people get to see these days.

 

It could be there is a great increase in consciousness about these things in the West, and the West has been starving for it because the church did such an outstanding job of destroying the indigenous spirituality in Europe ... and North America ... and South America ... and Africa ... and and and; but it's the Europeans that have had it the worst for the longest time.

 

So maybe I was wrong when I said earlier that knowing what they are getting in to ahead of time will scare all the good people away because they will think it's fake?

 

Or something.

Edited April 22, 2019 by Starjumper

[Starjumper]

Another thing I was thinking about power which Ilumaren's post pointed to is that there are both good and bad reasons for wanting power, of course.  I guess the simplest way to divide the good from the bad is to ask ourselves: do I want this power for my ego or for my spirit?

 

For example someone who wants to be powerful but they only care about having it as a bright aura then that's fine.  If someone wants power to control innocent bystanders like that kid that posted here, then that is not a good reason.  If someone wants power of awareness (which is actually the highest power) then that is a good reason to cultivate power.

 

If someone want to cultivate power so that they can be healers then they are actually sitting on the middle of the ego/spiritual fence and it can go either way.

 

The best reason for chi power, really, is simply that it makes you feel real good, but people find out about that later and so it's not a motivator to get started but to keep going.

 

It also has to do with what is presented to the public.  Some people read about the amazing psychic abilities of some masters and want that, which is fine.  Others read about some joker who lights a cigarette with a fart and they think that is the coolest thing they ever heard of.  This then implies that it is the maturity of the seeker that determines ...

 

Duhh, I think I'm going off topic ... and it's coffee time. 

 

 

[ilumairen]

5 hours ago, Mudfoot said:

It wasn't only a subtle attack. 

 

In this area, I would be delighted if threads not just revolved around how poor practices everybody else have and how their motives are wrong, but instead focused more on how one thinks that the practice should evolve. 

 

There are enough of threads here where we call each other deluded idiots for not practicing the right way. 

 

Some individuals who arrive at this forum aren't currently doing any practices to be right or wrong about, and do create posts and entire threads in which they request others lay out paths to powers for them. 

 

For me, this is what came to mind in regard to the OP of this thread. 

 

Quote

(I might also add that i do not practice Taoist internal alchemy, so I do not feel that you stepped on my toes. If it came out like that, then I'm sorry that was not my intention.

 

I tripped myself up, and only stepped on your toes in that I didn't see what you presented as an attack - until you directly typed that it was indeed meant in such a manner. 

[Starjumper]

21 minutes ago, Starjumper said:

Some people read about the amazing psychic abilities of some masters and want that

 

OK, I got my coffee, I realized I made a big mistake with that line.

 

What it should say is amazing psychic awareness, not psychic abilities.  Abilities are for the ego, awareness is for the spirit (you know, in general). 

 

Think about it, awareness is really where it's at, isn't it?.  Super awareness is a great reward, and omniscience is possible.  Lao Tzu was referencing this when he wrote that the sage can sit in his room and know what is going on in the world.

[ilumairen]

3 hours ago, Taoist Texts said:

Sorry your answer makes no sense. What high voltage? What wires? Could you answer my question directly without meaningless metaphors? I will try again.

 

Why does a neidan practitioner need an orbit? What is the purpose of the orbit?

 

Please speak to the point. Thank you.

 

Perhaps he's referring to the 'wiring' of the manifest and subtle bodies? 

 

(At least that's the way I understood it.)

[ilumairen]

1 hour ago, Zork said:

Thank you for pinpointing the real problem: no one knows wtf they are talking about but still participate.

 

I would suggest some are just touching different parts of the elephant. 

[ilumairen]

36 minutes ago, Starjumper said:

Another thing I was thinking about power which Ilumaren's post pointed to is that there are both good and bad reasons for wanting power, of course.  I guess the simplest way to divide the good from the bad is to ask ourselves: do I want this power for my ego or for my spirit?

 

For example someone who wants to be powerful but they only care about having it as a bright aura then that's fine.  If someone wants power to control innocent bystanders like that kid that posted here, then that is not a good reason.  If someone wants power of awareness (which is actually the highest power) then that is a good reason to cultivate power.

 

If someone want to cultivate power so that they can be healers then they are actually sitting on the middle of the ego/spiritual fence and it can go either way.

 

The best reason for chi power, really, is simply that it makes you feel real good, but people find out about that later and so it's not a motivator to get started but to keep going.

 

It also has to do with what is presented to the public.  Some people read about the amazing psychic abilities of some masters and want that, which is fine.  Others read about some joker who lights a cigarette with a fart and they think that is the coolest thing they ever heard of.  This then implies that it is the maturity of the seeker that determines ...

 

Duhh, I think I'm going off topic ... and it's coffee time. 

 

 

 

Coffee is good. 

[silent thunder]

Was just thinking about @Taomeow as I was brewing a cup, then sat down and read your comment @ilumairen.

 

Now I'm thinking about her potential responses to this thread and grinning like a chesire cat.

 

Even in her absence, she provides content for me.

pardon my interruption if you will,  carry on...
 

[Mudfoot]

1 hour ago, ilumairen said:

 

I didn't see what you presented as an attack - until you directly typed that it was indeed meant in such a manner. 

But it was very subtle, a small questioning of intention, and although first denied it soon came out.

 

I found the word "attack" slightly out of proportion. 

 

Just another day on the bums. 

[ilumairen]

2 minutes ago, Mudfoot said:

I found the word "attack" slightly out of proportion. 

 

So I was right and wrong at the same time. 

 

2 minutes ago, Mudfoot said:

Just another day on the bums. 

 

It certainly is..

[ilumairen]

9 minutes ago, silent thunder said:

Was just thinking about @Taomeow as I was brewing a cup, then sat down and read your comment @ilumairen.

 

Now I'm thinking about her potential responses to this thread and grinning like a chesire cat.

 

Even in her absence, she provides content for me.

pardon my interruption if you will,  carry on...
 

 

I miss her presence here. And hope she eventually returns in all her feline feistiness.

 

[ilumairen]

8 hours ago, Armando said:

 

Things always tend to get messy as long as our awareness is restricted by the limits of the egotistic (NOT egoistic!) mind.

 

Please clarify your differentiation here.

 

8 hours ago, Armando said:

We must penetrate beyond that in order to stably function from a level of undistorted and trustworthy inner information.

 

There is a learning process involved. At the end of the day, only experience will allow us to sort out the different voices that are constantly talking in and to us from different levels of self.

 

From different levels within themselves? Or are you suggesting that those talking to us are also no more than our own voices speaking to us?

 

8 hours ago, Armando said:

And even though there are no hard and fast rules, it is usually not the loudest voice that offers the best guidance.

 

Regular meditative practice goes a long way developing our sensitivity to deeper levels of self that are tuned into universal knowledge.

 

[ilumairen]

38 minutes ago, Mudfoot said:

But it was very subtle, a small questioning of intention, and although first denied it soon came out.

 

I've been pondering this, coupled with the post Armando made. 

 

And my curiosity is now questioning whether anything "came out", or if it was created through your intent and pressured focus. 

 

Whose intent was revealed?

[mrpasserby]

23 hours ago, Zork said:

I still don't get answers on why there is so much emphasis on this aspect of the internal arts. There is a whole mountain to climb to get there in the first place

In my experience: if you no longer have a temporary physical body for your spirit to go home to, you realize that your life/I Am depends on developing a permanent functional spirit body that can actually move about and do the work to provide for your I Am. bible 'work out your salvation with fear and trembling'.