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9 minutes ago, ralis said:


AGW is causing serious problems which are compounding! I take it very seriously!

as well you should. 

 

Course, both sides should look at the science and should in my humbled unstudied opinion see that both sides have decent points that don't conflict.  In that there are sun (ie natural) cycles that highly influential our weather, and that human pollutions are clearly changing the composition of our atmosphere and that has consequences.  Put a dome around some unfortunate city and it'd be clear real fast.  Without the dome, our pollution gets (mostly) blown away but it's still having a dire affect, just slower. 

 

<addon>  this summer my sons Lake Michigan Triathlon was turned duathlon at the last minute because the Lake was too high!? 

 

 

Edited by thelerner

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17 minutes ago, thelerner said:

as well you should. 

 

Course, both sides should look at the science and should in my humbled unstudied opinion see that both sides have decent points that don't conflict.  In that there are sun (ie natural) cycles that highly influential our weather, and that human pollutions are clearly changing the composition of our atmosphere and that has consequences.  Put a dome around some unfortunate city and it'd be clear real fast.  Without the dome, our pollution gets (mostly) blown away but it's still having a dire affect, just slower. 

 

<addon>  this summer my sons Lake Michigan Triathlon was turned duathlon at the last minute because the Lake was too high!? 

 

 


The sun is not a factor in human caused AGW. That is a fact! Solar heating is a favorite argument put forth by deniers and their arguments have been thoroughly debunked. 
 

CO2 as well as CH4 traps heat i.e, greenhouse effect, which is where the fallacious argument by deniers originates. 

Edited by ralis
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On 11/28/2019 at 10:43 AM, ralis said:

 

I read about tipping points yesterday. This is exactly the way in which non-linear dynamic systems behave! All life in this biosphere is in serious trouble and it can only become worse!

 

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 I think it's too late, we're past the tipping point. The only thing that's going to save the planet is human extinction.

Oceanographer Jim Massa in livestream chat tonight

starts 45:10-1:08:15 Super Scientific Researcher, Oceanographer Jim Massa

 

So I just "live streamed" chatted with Jim Massa - he's a very excellent researcher. He says it's too late for life on earth to escape mass extinction from abrupt global warming...

 

So of course hardly anyone sees his youtube channel! Feedback Loops already here.

 

https://twitter.com/jim27182

 

at 1 hour to 1:15 Livestream chat with Jim Massa

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They're not accounting for fluid dynamics, is not what they're accounting for....that can lead to a collapse of the food chain.... I think it's too late, we're past the tipping point. The only thing that's going to save the planet is human extinction.

https://www.edge-show.com/we-talk-to-a-super-scientist-oceanographer-and-climate-expert-first-politics-from-the-road-with-michael-shure-and-journalist-brooke-thomas/

 

starts 45:10-1:08:15 Super Scientific Researcher, Oceanographer Jim Massa

 

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Study finds marine mammal viruses are traveling between oceans as sea ice recedes

http://kotz.org/2019/11/13/study-links-emergence-of-foreign-virus-in-arctic-marine-mammals-to-loss-of-sea-ice/

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Does it matter why you want to plant a tree and save a whale? If it feels good to do so?

 

Does it matter why you want to drive a vehicle? And build a factory? If it feels good to do so? 

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7 hours ago, Everything said:

Does it matter why you want to plant a tree and save a whale? If it feels good to do so?

 

Does it matter why you want to drive a vehicle? And build a factory? If it feels good to do so? 

 

You are off topic here! If you have something to contribute then do so. If not don't post in this thread!

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9 minutes ago, ralis said:

 

You are off topic here! If you have something to contribute then do so. If not don't post in this thread!

The climate is being off topic with itself evermore ongoingly being and becoming evermore here and now, as well, is it not? ^_^

Edited by Everything

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8 minutes ago, Everything said:

The climate is being off topic with itself evermore ongoingly being and becoming evermore here and now, as well, is it not? ^_^

 

Would you translate that to English and as opposed to gibberish?

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11 minutes ago, ralis said:

 

Would you translate that to English and as opposed to gibberish?

The answer you seek will always be coming to you, in all the ways that you can possibly be. 

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7 hours ago, Everything said:

The climate is being off topic with itself evermore ongoingly being and becoming evermore here and now, as well, is it not? ^_^

 

7 hours ago, ralis said:

 

Would you translate that to English and as opposed to gibberish?

 

I'll give it a shot... as it sounds very Sartre like.

 

Climate is every changing, day by day (even second by second)... just as you cannot jump into the same river twice idea (Heraclitus). 

 

So, in every second, if the climate is changing, it is 'off topic' to itself (as that is its nature).

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1 minute ago, dawei said:

 

 

I'll give it a shot... as it sounds very Sartre like.

 

Climate is every changing, day by day (even second by second)... just as you cannot jump into the same river twice idea (Heraclitus). 

 

So, in every second, if the climate is changing, it is 'off topic' to itself (as that is its nature).


Are you denying human caused Anthropogenic Global Warming (AGW)?  It was Frank Luntz that manufactured the current meme called “climate change”, which is dishonest and leads to doing nothing!

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3 minutes ago, ralis said:


Are you denying human caused Anthropogenic Global Warming (AGW)?  It was Frank Luntz that manufactured the current meme called “climate change”, which is dishonest and leads to doing nothing!

 

I only attempted to interpret/translate his [loosely nonsensical] comment/meaning.    I didn't see AGW mentioned in his comments.  I would not necessarily take his meaning as denyhing AGW but he would have to say that.    I would suggest that he likes to talk 'above' the topic at hand... and why he comes across as always 'off-topic'.     JMO.  

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Oceanic oxygen volume is being reduced by AGW.

 

https://www.oceanscientists.org/index.php/topics/ocean-deoxygenation

 

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Ocean deoxygenation refers to the loss of oxygen from the oceans due to climate change (Keeling et al. 2010). Long-term ocean monitoring shows that oxygen concentrations in the ocean have declined during the 20th century, and the new IPCC 5th Assessment Report (AR5 WG1) predicts that they will decrease by 3-6% during the 21st century in response to surface warming. While 3-6% doesn’t seem like much, this decrease will be felt acutely in hypoxic and suboxic areas, where oxygen is already limiting. “Hypoxic” areas are defined as regions where oxygen limitation is detrimental to most organisms. This threshold differs across the world, but is usually defined as anything below 60 umol/kg. Hypoxic zones have oxygen concentrations 70-90% lower than the mean surface concentrations. “Suboxic” areas are areas where oxygen is so low (less than 5 umol/kg) that most life cannot be sustained and significant biogeochemical changes occur due to altered water chemistry. Suboxic zones have oxygen concentrations 98% lower than the mean surface concentrations. A recent study found that a 1°C warming throughout the upper ocean will result in the increase of hypoxic areas by 10% and a tripling of the volume of suboxic waters (Deutsch et al. 2011). To put this in context, a highly optimistic emissions scenario of atmospheric CO2 levels of 550 ppm by 2100 would lead to a 1.2°C warming of the upper ocean (Mora et al. 2013). Therefore, these declines in oxygen are changes we should be prepared to see. An education video on ocean deoxygenation can be viewed here

 

 

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Oxygen content in the water is dependent on photosynthesis (produces oxygen), animal respiration (uses oxygen), and physical mixing. Ocean warming is reducing global ocean oxygen content through several key mechanisms (Keeling et al. 2010) including:

Stratification impacts: Anthropogenic warming causes surface waters to become warmer and thereby less dense, leading to a more stratified (layered) water column, which reduces mixing. Other impacts of climate change to the water cycle can also lead to a more stratified water column. These include inputs of freshwater to the ocean from rain, river runoff, or melting ice.

Warming effects: As a physical rule, warmer water holds less oxygen. As the surface waters warm due to climate change, the ocean loses its ability to hold oxygen, leading to an oxygen decline.

Biological effects: Changes to the biological use and production of oxygen can lead to changes in oxygen content in the water. Warmer ocean temperatures increase oxygen demand from organisms. Increased nutrient inputs (either through coastal runoff or through upwelling) also lead to more oxygen depletion at mid-depths (100-1000m).

Circulation changes: Changes in ocean circulation are also implicated with some of the observed declines in dissolved oxygen (Grantham et al. 2004). Slowing circulation and increased upwelling of oxygen-poor deep-water can lead to reductions in oxygen.

 

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we shall reap what we sow, no getting around that law...so lets do whatever we can in very small, medium and even big ways that all add up to help the myriad lives upon the earth and reduce the many forms of suffering here,   the Earth soul, her helpers and keepers and karma will not be denied along the way and in the end - when the black soul of hungry malice and his minions can no longer step foot here. (so to speak)

 

I've just barely touched on the importance of the related causal spiritual/astral war that is affecting life on earth....  and I'd say it is coming to a head, regardless of  human opinions, beliefs or non-beliefs about same.  

Edited by old3bob
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Starting to feel like we're all playing in the orchestra on the Titanic...

 

2019 wasn't just protests and Fleabag: it was the year a climate truth bomb dropped

Many of us suddenly woke up, stopped disassociating and realised the party was over

Brigid Delaney

 

When I think about 2019, there is one scene that springs to mind, something that sums up the milieu so perfectly that it almost seems art-directed.

 

There we were two weeks ago at Rose Bay on the water’s edge, waiting for a private boat to take us to a harbourside mansion for a wine tasting. It was one of those days when Sydney’s air quality was among the worst in the world. The boat emerged from the pea soup gloom with the words “VIP” on the side.

 

We were all in our party dresses and chunky trainers, phones fully charged to maximise the Instagrammable location, only coughing a little bit although peoples’ eyes were red and I noticed some fellow guests pulling on Ventolin inhalers.

 

At the mansion there was a DJ, sommeliers and a chef, who explained in great detail the origin of the scallops on the canapes and a recent, inspirational trip to Oaxaca. Later there was a wine tasting where we gathered around to swirl and spit. Every varietal had notes of bushfire.

 

Various people wandered up to us and said “great day for it!” and “beautiful weather” without irony.

 

How could they say that? The sun was (there was only one word for it) demonic, a burning red eye in a thick smoky sky. The Sydney Harbour Bridge and the Opera House were out there … somewhere, obscured in a brown haze.

 

We stood near the pool, eating tiny food, drinking wine from large balloon glasses while ash flew from the sky, some of it landing in my drink.

 

The DJ played on but the tunes – Tones and I, Mark Ronson – were nervy, jangly and strangely discordant. The smell of the smoke had an almost chemical taint, and in between trying the pinot and moving on to the tempranillo, I wondered about the alchemy at work in this commingling of the elements: the ancient forests and its animals turned to columns of ash, collapsed and drifting through the air, settling on the water and soil; and later in and on my body after swimming in the dirty sea that morning and now swallowing particles of ash floating in my wine at the party on the harbour’s edge. (“At the end of the world,” my friend and I nervously joked.)

 

More wine was poured and more people commented on the great weather (except for a sommelier who confessed sotto voce that he felt afraid), and influencers posed in the gloom on the jetty and by the swimming pool, seeing but refusing to see what was all around them: this red-raw sun, that dirty brown sky.

 

The cognitive dissonance would have been funny had I not been so scared. It brought to mind F Scott Fitzgerald, a writer who understood more than most that decadent parties prefigure societal collapse. Had his novel The Great Gatsby been written now, the scene that day in Point Piper would not be out of place.

 

Returning to shore in the haze, we could have been excused for thinking we were crossing the Styx – the mystical Greek crossing into the Underworld – and in this heightened state the day seemed more than the sum of its parts. Instead it served as both an elegy for the lost world that had disappeared beyond the haze and a portent of the world to come.

 

That is what 2019 has come to mean to me: not the landslide elections and the global protests and Fleabag season 2. But the year some undeniable bomb dropped and dispersed its truth all around us in the form of dark particles in the air that didn’t just sit around us – but entered our bodies in unholy communion, its fine matter an anti-sustenance that made us sick and afraid.

 

The truth bomb came in various forms: in the form of a girl (Greta Thunberg) whose eloquent rage finally caught the world’s attention and inspired millions around the globe to strike for climate action. The truth also came in the form of heat, smoke and fire.

Even then, some people tried to ignore it.

 

Ernest Hemingway had this famous line from his 1929 book The Sun Also Rises, which speaks to me of where things washed up in 2019: “How did you go bankrupt?” Bill asked. “Two ways,” Mike said. “Gradually, then suddenly.”

 

2019 is the year of suddenly. Many of us were shaken awake from our cognitive dissonance this year as our weather patterns and climate conditions become ever more extreme. When wine turns to ash in your mouth, you can’t deny the new reality anymore.

 

Yet some still live in a land of cognitive dissonance: the lump of coal brought to parliament; the haze over the city obscuring the flashing Christmas lights; dead bats falling from the sky because their sophisticated and highly evolved sonar systems are overheating and confused; beekeepers being traumatised and needing counselling after hearing the sounds of animals screaming as they burn to death; new types of megafires devouring entire ecosystems; the NSW premier opening a new zoo during these megafires with a commitment to “protecting wildlife”; and the prime minister disappearing without a word about the climate catastrophe – last seen boarding a business-class Jetstar flight bound for Hawaii; the Instagrammers posing on the jetty under the eye of Sauron, hoping that with the right filters, we can pretend the sky is blue.

 

Cognitive dissonance is natural – it can make you feel safer, like the world is a more orderly, stable place than the reality, which is chaos.

 

The end of this year makes me wonder how much during the years prior we have been engaged in unintentional acts of disassociation and dissonance. Maybe we had to, to survive the barrage of nonstop news – the dozen major scandals that emerge each week from Trump’s White House, the way that Brexit is important, boring and confusing all at once. It’s all too much so we just disassociate.

 

It’s no wonder the hot illegal drug of 2019 – ketamine – is an anaesthetic, numbing your body and making you feel separate from your environment.

 

People disappear, aptly, into the k-hole, the chemical equivalent of our political situation. “Like you’re watching your own life happen instead of living it,” said New York magazine, calling it “the party drug for the end of the world”.

 

But 2019 was in many ways, for many of us, Year Zero. It was the year many of us stopped disassociating, woke up and realised the party is over.

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1 hour ago, Apech said:

This will explain everything:

 

 

 

Ah, becauase he's full of hot air and loves breaking wind too!

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3 hours ago, Earl Grey said:

 

Ah, becauase he's full of hot air and loves breaking wind too!

 

Trump fighting windmills and other figments of his deranged mind!

 

don-quixote-windmill.jpg

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On 2/21/2019 at 10:21 PM, voidisyinyang said:

As I said - the original human culture is the one to emulate. The best book on the San Bushmen culture is the book "The Harmless People" by Elizabeth Marshall Thomas - I corresponded with her.

For example the original human culture did not even know that homosexuality existed! Also none of the males masturbated. You just don't hear about this at all - but that is the truth. The male anthropologists lied about her book, trying to discount it but she lived with a previously un-contacted tribe.

So Daoist qigong is actually from the San Bushmen culture - just as yoga also is.

All modern homo sapiens are from just a few thousand humans that created a genetic bottleneck after the Mt. Toba supervolcano around 70,000 years ago.

So the original human culture did not have war - all the males were required to train in spiritual healing.

So they didn't get enslaved until a few thousand years ago - by the Bantus and then the WEsterners. The Bantus though had been Westernized also to a certain extent.

Well, a lot of modern homosexuality and gender-bending may have actually been caused epigenetically by the feminist Pill.  Like a lot of Western cevilization technology - some side effects are delayed until the 2nd generation...

Quote

In the 1980s, I had a boss who had gotten a masters degree in psychology from New York University. He was a brilliant man; could have been a doctor. He told me a story that explains much of what we see in society today.

It seems that while doing his graduate work in the early 1960s, he had to do research on lab rats, which were given the synthetic hormones used in the then new birth control pills. The results, he told me, showed that the grandchildren of these lab rats would have high rates of homosexual behaviors. From what he told me, the findings were suppressed. Apparently, the powers that be wanted “the pill” to pass muster. What happened to the second generation of rats that followed was of no consequence to them.

Then my boss told me: The first generation of kids born to mothers using the pill have already arrived. But we should expect in another generation a noticeable increase in homosexual behavior, as they would be the second generation. As that was then still in the future, I was shocked.

This was told me in the mid '80s. By his reckoning, we should have seen a societal explosion of homosexuality starting around 2000, and subsequently. And, of course, we have seen such an explosion. His prediction came true.

Geez...is there anything Christian colonialism hasn't f*d up by tampering with Mother Nature???

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11 minutes ago, gendao said:

Well, a lot of modern homosexuality and gender-bending may have actually been caused epigenetically by the feminist Pill.  Like a lot of Western cevilization technology - some side effects are delayed until the 2nd generation...

Geez...is there anything Christian colonialism hasn't f*d up by tampering with Mother Nature???

 

This sounds extremely homophobic, even for you. 

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14 hours ago, Earl Grey said:

This sounds extremely homophobic, even for you. 

Let's take the humancentric sociological element out of this.  Let's just talk straight biology/ecology, here.

 

Look, what if another animal's gender/sexuality is artificially altered by colonialist chemicals?  Which clearly is rampant amongst frogs for instance, now?

Quote

Compared with forest ponds, he found large quantities of phytoestrogens in suburban water bodies. These chemicals, which can mimic estrogen and affect the sexual development of frogs and other animals (including humans), are produced by plants such as clover and other legumes (soybeans and peanuts, for example). It could be that just by maintaining a lawn and removing native plants from their yards, humans could be impairing the hormonal development of animals. Chemicals that have this effect, like bisphenol A, are called endocrine disruptors.

"This shows that endocrine disruption is a much more diverse phenomenon than we previously realized," Lambert says.

In the most sexually-skewed suburban pond, the number of female frogs born during the study period was almost double that of males. The scientists also found that in the forests, the number of males actually outnumbered the females, with more than 60 percent of animals born ending up male. That came as a surprise, and raises a number of questions about what a "natural" gender ratio is in these animals, Skelly says.

The observation that the amount of landscaping is having a quantitative effect on the sex determination and population biology of frogs in a nearby pond is amazing.

How is abnormal development caused by unnatural chemical exposure not a problem for those frogs???  And the whole ecosystem that they play vital roles in? 

 

Or are you dismissing any concern over such chemical side effects as "homophobia"...simply because they affect gender?

 

Or what if these chemicals were causing cancer, not gender disruption?  THEN it would be a real problem...or just "cancerphobic?"

 

 

Edited by gendao

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1 hour ago, gendao said:

Let's take the humancentric sociological element out of this.  Let's just talk straight biology/ecology, here.

 

 

The problem is that your criteria for "science" rests on both faulty premises, misinformation, poor understanding, and however one would characterize your bizarre ideology. 

 

1 hour ago, gendao said:

Look, what if another animal's gender/sexuality is artificially altered by colonialist chemicals?  Which clearly is rampant amongst frogs for instance, now?

 

Are you aware that animals long before human interaction or "colonialist chemicals" relieve sexual urges with each other, whether it is male dogs humping both for dominance and sexual release or females for playfulness? 

 

1 hour ago, gendao said:

How is abnormal development caused by unnatural chemical exposure not a problem for those frogs???  And the whole ecosystem that they play vital roles in? 

 

You're creating a division and diversion here. By this question, you are creating a straw man argument (one of your favorite tactics), which posits that frogs are unable to fulfill their ecological role because of "homosexuality" and that frogs can even be "homosexual". Animals will hump one another, but preference for the same sex is hardly the case, since that itself is a projection of the ridiculous ideologies of human sexuality onto animals. 

 

However, the bigger problem is that your earlier allegation

 

5 hours ago, gendao said:

Well, a lot of modern homosexuality and gender-bending may have actually been caused epigenetically by the feminist Pill.  Like a lot of Western cevilization technology - some side effects are delayed until the 2nd generation...

 

The so-called "feminist Pill" you say, which is in itself a convenient scapegoat for whatever distorted idea of both science and feminism exists in the hollow void of mediocrity and delusions of grandeur that exists inside your skull where a brain should be. It sounds like you're saying the ideology of Feminism is caused by chemicals and causing sexual dysfunction--which is not how it works. 

 

Thus, your argument focused on the already ridiculous idea of "colonialist chemicals" affecting frogs in an ecosystem is a diversion from your supposed human argument--or you are simply a terrible writer whose ability to communicate equally terrible ideas is severely limited. 

 

Your so-called "scientific source" that you cite as well is highlighted on a right-wing watch list, where some post titles that I will not link here include such literary and scientific genius such as Rainbow Dorritos a Gay Gateway Drug or the extremely ridiculous idea that "women ruin public discourse by talking about rape". 

 

2 hours ago, gendao said:

Or what if these chemicals were causing cancer, not gender disruption?  THEN it would be a problem?

 

I presume you understand what the cause of cancer is, which many medicinal systems still struggle to identify, because of your illuminated state of understanding gives you insight?

 

Enough with the faulty premises and forcing your idiotic views that are unrelated to any topic you invade, Gendao.

 

You still have up to this day not demonstrated your understanding of history as a concept or the individual histories of the people you claim to speak for by creating this false dialogue that assumes everything is a byproduct of alien colonialism cum Christian colonialism, ignoring the subtleties and actual history of people, whether it is the pre-colonial times of Southeast Asia or even the history of western civilization. It is more bemusing to see how you think you have a more enlightened view because of your conspiracy theories and the so-called people you speak for (like me and my ethnic heritage) are too "brainwashed" to be able to think clearly--which is about as condescending as an actual colonialist mentality of "I know better than you and you are too stupid to think due to your heritage". 

 

You have not demonstrated any linguistic competence even in the English language, and as such have yet to dialogue with people instead of talking over them, let alone understand anything from primary sources without relying on your usual memes and conspiracy groups. 

 

You have been unable to demonstrate anything that remotely resembles science free of ideology and something that actually resembles existing paradigms, and sound more like a petulant child who insists that his views are correct because he says so, who, when caught in a lie, calls others liars and ignorant.

 

You do not exhibit any credentials and refuse to identify how you are able to come to the bizarre conclusions you make, even when directly asked what your academic background, employment history, or travel experience has been, and sound more like a town drunk and busybody--a term used to describe people who meddled with others' business because they have nothing better to do--who sits around cafes reading tabloids and sneering at people who are in his vicinity before inviting himself to their tables and ignores their requests to go away. 

 

You lack any sort of understanding in the internal arts or experience in practicing them, yet seem to come here and tell other cultivators and those with an interest in the study of such philosophies that you possess an understanding of things that are far more significant and worth talking about--regardless of whether anyone is interested in hearing about and if it even has to do with the subject at hand. 

 

Now you are alleging that chemicals cause homosexuality among humans and animals--the topic here is climate change. How you manage to misconstrue these things is no longer false equivalence, but the signs of a severely unstable and uneducated individual. 

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