Eddie Oshins proved me correct: Noncommutative phase secret of Qi Taoist Neigong training

[Starjumper]

Quote

 

1) For example - as I realized - the secret of the SFQ "Moving of yin and yang" exercise is that (for males) - the left hand is yang and the lower body yin, while the right hand is yin and the upper body yang.

 

So you hold your hands like that - to jump start the battery of the body as complementary opposites.

 

 

Absolute bullshit, promoted by people who want to make it seem like they know something special.

 

I'm putting this fruitcake on ignore and I suggest that anyone else who values their sanity do the same.

[Starjumper]

For those new to the forum who aren't aware of this guy, here is some background you should check out before getting involved:

https://www.thedaobums.com/topic/44930-voidisyinyangdrew-hempel/

 

Here's some poop on his favorite subject, Orgasm at a Distance:

https://www.thedaobums.com/topic/13293-orgasm-at-a-distance-101/

 

You can search for orgasm at a distance, or O at a D and find it mentioned in other places.

 

He has also vehemently asserted that anyone who makes love is a terrible pervert, as if what he does isn't perverted.

 

Edited March 20, 2018 by Starjumper

[Aletheia]

Starjumper are you willing to put your money where your mouth is? You own some property, as do I. How about we make a bet where I demonstrate drew is right by providing evidence of being able to project qi so that ordinary people can feel the energy and that the energy can also heal to the standards of these videos -

 

 

 

Plato's divided line is a work of pure science fiction as are the "3 classical laws of thought" i.e. total bullshit.

 

Right now I have massive magnetic beams shooting out of my palms so that EVERYONE I was with the other night, 5 people, could feel the energy. And that's for starters, I've also developed a sense of smell like a dog lol. Anyway, as everyone knows the energy can also heal sickness and disease AND I LEARNED ALL MY QIGONG FROM DREW'S POSTS AROUND THE INTERNET.

 

SO PUT UP OR SHUT UP and stop pretending you're qualified to comment on either my or drew's knowledge of qigong because you most certainly are not. As I've told you before you're not anywhere near even my level.

 

Last I checked you were making videos with you hitting your back garden shed and spending all your time talking about other people's abilities. Really you're the David Verdesi of taobums, someone telling stories about other people because that's all you really have when all's said and done HAHAHA

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmsLTXgF9tQ

 

 

Edited March 18, 2018 by Aletheia

[Aletheia]

This ought to be one place on the internet where people can freely exchange ideas about what really works without having to traverse foolish people. Instead the forum admin seem more than happy to let everyone have their say on every subject. No matter that good ideas get drowned out by the bad, as will necessarily always be the case with something as nuanced as Taoist alchemy.

 

A dystopian free-for-all may well contain elements of Taoism, but it doesn't then necessarily follow that everyone's way is true.

 

NO ONE ON THE INTERNET AND CERTAINLY NO ONE ON THIS FORUM IS ANYWHERE CLOSE TO DREW WHEN IT COMES TO GIVING AWAY AUTHENTIC TEACHINGS OF TAOISM.

 

This forum is a complete disgrace letting people like starjumper freely leave comments in bad faith in this thread without reprimand.

Edited March 18, 2018 by Aletheia

[Starjumper]

2 hours ago, Aletheia said:

How about we make a bet where I demonstrate drew is right by providing evidence of being able to project qi so that ordinary people can feel the energy and that the energy can also heal to the standards of these videos -

 

I could project chi that ordinary people could feel after doing my chi kung for a couple of months.  Now I've been doing it for thirty years and can do stuff you don't need to know about and never will know about or be able to do.  Also, my practice had NONE of that insane BS that Drew promotes, and I do mean insane.   My teacher has passed beyond immortal, his vibration is so high that he can no longer communicate with this level, and he probably can't even be seen by gods,  Your teacher is a young inexperienced 'interesting' person who sits in McDonalds all day, clenching his anus and playing imaginary sex games with unsuspecting underage girls.   My teacher was a saint and a wizard who I was with in person for eight years.  You, who learned some crazy egomaniac type stuff on the internet for a few months on the other hand from a   ...

 

 

Go play with your dolls somewhere else.  I'm putting you on ignore now so your spit and spray won't get to me.

Edited March 18, 2018 by Starjumper

[Aletheia]

Okay, well put your money where you mouth is. Are you willing to bet your property on your abilities being more advanced than mine? Should be a no brainer for you...

 

Maybe we can contact Lomax and he can keep the winning property if he's willing to fly to our locations. I certainly am more than happy to give him my winnings. How about you?

 

2 hours ago, Starjumper said:

I could project chi that ordinary people could feel after doing my chi kung for a couple of months.

 

I could visibly heal sickness as witnessed by several people after one month of my kundalini awakening. Which I now know opened up the first 6th charka. A few months later my 7th charka opened up at the top of my head and it filled my body with magnetic energy. So I now have huge warm magnetic fields outside my body, and can feel the energy flowing through the channels, which I feel when I move around. Like I move my arm and can feel the energy digging into my leg while I just sit at the computer never mind during meditation.

 

When I breath the energy circulates outside my body and causes my clothes to ripple and cling to my body from the process. Most likely in a few months I'll be able to move objects just by intent of mind.

 

2 hours ago, Starjumper said:

My teacher has passed beyond immortal, his vibration is so high that he can no longer communicate with this level, and he probably can't even be seen by gods,  Your teacher is an 'interesting' person who sits in McDonalds all day, clenching his anus and playing imaginary sex games with unsuspecting women.   My teacher was a saint and a wizard who I was with in person for eight years; you, who learned some crazy egomaniac type stuff on the internet on the other hand from a

 

There you go again talking about other people. In fact I had a divine awakening from the goddess and it's something I wrote about in an old thread which I can dig up if need be. So I had tīvra-tīvra-śaktipāta -

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shaktipat

 

Quote

tīvra-tīvra-śaktipāta - the so-called "Super Supreme Grace" - produces immediate identity with Śiva and liberation; such a being goes on to become a siddha master

 

Your thinking is still caught in duality. That is why you have no idea how great drew's critique of Plato's metaphysics really is.

 

This thread is about the ontological status of arithmetic, the architectonics of geometry, the essence of truth and the nature of reality ALL OF WHICH ARE STRUCTURALLY INCORRECT AS FRAMED BY WESTERN METAPHYSICS SINCE PLATO!

Edited March 19, 2018 by Aletheia

[Aletheia]

So in fact I only did 5 minutes of reverse breathing and got the first 6 chakra open which during the process blew out my wifi and left a dull pain across my navel the next day. At the time I was seeing vivid colours in the room and wasn't sure if I was asleep or awake!

 

Then when I opened the 7th chakra it was to try out meditation because previously I'd only been doing the breathing while browsing the internet. Again after a few minutes I felt massive magnetic forces in my head so that my whole face disappeared with light energy coming down into the top of my head!

 

It's all recorded on this forum too so you can check for yourself. I can go into way more detail too.

 

Anyway my central point is this -- YOU ARE NOT FIT TO BE COMMENTING IN THIS THREAD CONCERNING THE FRAMEWORK OF WESTERN METAPHYSICS. YOU HAVE NOT STUDIED THE MATTER SO KNOW NOTHING OF WHAT DREW IS SAYING. IF I'M HONEST I WANT NOTHING TO DO WITH YOU BECAUSE YOU'RE A COMPLETE FOOL WHETHER YOU KNOW IT (WHICH YOU CLEARLY DO NOT) OR NOT. IT WOULD BE BEST IF YOU JUST SHUT YOUR MOUTH AND DISAPPEARED FROM THESE TYPE OF THREADS FROM NOW ON.

 

Still if the only way to shut you up is to take your home away from you then so be it!

 

https://postimg.org/image/p7f7cyr0t/

 

 

Edited March 19, 2018 by Aletheia

[七星門]

"Great understanding is broad and unhurried; little understanding is cramped and busy. Great words are clear and limpid; little words are shrill and quarrelsome. In sleep, men's spirits go visiting; in waking hours, their bodies hustle. With everything they meet they become entangled. Day after day they use their minds in strife, sometimes grandiose, sometimes sly, sometimes petty. Their little fears are mean and trembly; their great fear are stunned and overwhelming. They bound off like an arrow or a crossbow pellet, certain that they are the arbiters of right and wrong. They cling to their position as if they had sworn before the gods, sure that they are holding onto victory. They fade like fall and winter--such is the way that they dwindle day by day. They drown in what they do--you cannot make them turn back. They grow dark, as though sealed with seals--such are excesses of their age." Zhaungzi, 2.

[voidisyinyang]

Quote

1) For example - as I realized - the secret of the SFQ "Moving of yin and yang" exercise is that (for males) - the left hand is yang and the lower body yin, while the right hand is yin and the upper body yang.

 

So you hold your hands like that - to jump start the battery of the body as complementary opposites.

 

 

Quote

Absolute bullshit, promoted by people who want to make it seem like they know something special.

 

So Starjumper is refuting my above claim. I have a new blog post that completely corroborates my claim - and the source is Awakening to Reality, the alchemy text that is considered the key text of the Dragon Gate school.

 

http://www.leefamilyinternalarts.com/Keith Ewers.html

 

 

So in reviewing the source googlebook -

 “the right hand grabs the white tiger, left hand grabs the green dragon,”

Taichi: A Personal Learning Experience, Part 1

By Arthur T. Orawski

 

I didn't realize he is actually a student of Waysun Liao out of Chicago....

 

And he mentions how anyone part of the Green Dragon Society - going back thousands of years - would be taught this secret of Tai Chi - the white tiger is the lung (yin qi of the po soul, the origin of the generative force of the body) and the green dragon is the yin qi of the hun soul, the origin of the generative force of heart spirit)....

 

O.K. so why are there no other sources for it on the interwebs? The only other source is from Feng Shui stating the right side is female, west and the white tiger, the left side is male, east and the green dragon. He cites this book Wu Dzing Pian as the source.

 

O.K. I found a second source!!

3.  The White Dragon Plays in the Clouds 
This movement will be familiar to all persons who practice T'ai Chi Ch'uan (Taijiquan).  In Taijiquan, various names for this movement include: Moving Hands Like Clouds, Waving Hands Like Clouds, Playing with Clouds, Wave Hands in Clouds, Cloud Hands 云手 : Yun Shou.  The Taijiquan the feet and hands move gracefully in a coordinated manner, while in Dragon Qigong the hands and waist move but both feet do not move.  
Stand with your feet separated apart at a comfortable distance.  Bring your right hand up to about the level of your mouth, palm facing towards the body.  Bring you left hand up to about the level of your belly button, with your left palm facing towards the body.  Your feet will remain flat on the ground during the entire exercise.  Pause in this Wuji position.  Inhale and exhale deeply a few times in the Wuji position: relax the abdomen as you inhale, draw the abdomen in as you exhale (natural abdominal breathing method).  Figure 3.1
Slowly and gently turn at the waist towards the right side.  Inhale as you turn to the right side.  Turn as far as you can to the right side.  When you reach your limit then exchange your hands by bringing the left hand up to the level of your mouth and by bringing your right hand down to the level of your belly button.  Figures 3.2 and 3.3
Start to slowly and gently turn at the waist towards the left side.  Exhale as you turn to the left side.  Turn as far as you can to the left side.  When you reach your limit then exchange your hands by bringing the right hand up to the level of your mouth and by bringing your left hand down to the level of your belly button.  Figure 3.4 and 3.5 
Then begin again to turn back to the right side as you inhale.  Figure 3.5, and 3.2
At first the movement sequence will seem a bit stiff and mechanical.  After numerous practice sessions, this "Cloud Hands" movement will become more fluid, flexible, playful, and flowing.  You will begin to become the White Dragon Playing in the Clouds. 
Repeat this movement sequence to the right side and left side for four to eight repetitions depending upon the time available and/or your level of physical conditioning.  Don't hold the breath; breathe freely and easily in coordination with the movements.  Take your time; move slowly and deliberately.  I like to bend my knees and sink down a bit during parts of this movement - don't keep the knees stiff.  Flow like a Dragon in the moving clouds.  Be sure to turn at the waist. 

Interesting - no mention of the Tiger!! But yet it is the SAME secret. But on deeper digging Michael P. Garofalo has lots on Dragon and Tiger:
 

 "In ancient Chinese culture, the dragon usually represents the yang or male forces of nature and the tiger the yin or female forces.  Balancing those energies inside yourself is an essential part of this ancient self-healing system.  In China, the words "dragon" and "tiger" appear in many branches of qigong and in various martial arts. 
    Taoists brought Dragon and Tiger Qigong to China's Shaolin temple, where it was preserved intact by Chan Buddhists.  This was the original form of qigong from which the usage of the words "dragon" and "tiger" entered into the world of martial arts and qigong.  Dragon and Tiger Qigong was commonly taught only to the Shaolin high clergy and not to the general public or ordinary monks.  For this reason, many people in China still refer to it as a form of Buddhist qigong.  However, because Dragon and Tiger develops and integrates the internal energetic principles of neigong, it is deeply rooted in Taoist qigong."
-  Bruce Frantzis, Dragon and Tiger Qigong, p.4

 And this is really the key quote:
 

"The dragon and tiger are respectively the yang and yin components of generative energy.  Other names for the dragon are: the yang dragon that hides with the fluid, the yin within the yang (symbolized by the broken line flanked by two solid lines in the trigram Li), the vapor within the fluid, the vapor of pure yang, and the true fire.  Other names for the tiger are: the yin tiger that hides within the vapor, the yang within the yin (symbolized by the solid line flanked by two broken lines in the trigram Kan), the fluid within the vapor, the fluid of pure yin (or the vapor of pure yin), and the true water.  The dragon and tiger are therefore the components or ingredients of mundane generative energy.  Do not confuse them with their carriers, fluid and vapor.  Central to the preservation and cultivation of generative energy is the process known as the copulation of the dragon and tiger. 

The yin and yang components of generative energy meet and merge to become purified generative energy, which is also called the primordial vapor.  The process begins with the vapors of pure yang (dragon) and pure yin (tiger) rising from the base of the spine and traveling separately up the spine and through the shoulder blades.  When the vapors reach the head, they interact (copulate) and merge to become one unified vapor.  This unified vapor descents to the palate of the mouth and is manifested as nectar, a sweet, sticky fluid.  Swallowed down the throat, the nectar enters the middle tan-t'ian (in the area of the solar plexus) and eventually completes its circuit when it reaches the base of the spine again."

-  Nourishing the Essence of Life: The Outer, Inner and Secret Teachings of Taoism.  Translated with and Introduction by Eva Wong.   Boston, Shambhala, 2004.   Pages 9-10, 8-23,94.   

Translation of three texts from the Daoist Canon, circa 1400 CE, called The Mysteries of the Tao (Tao-hsuan p'ien), Understanding the Mysteries (Wu-shuan p'ien), and the Sacred Treatise on the Great Mystery (T'ai-hsuan pao-tien) of the Complete Reality School of Daoism.   

We can see the confusion: Tiger and Dragon are contained within each other - and hide as vapor in fluid and vice versa but BOTH tiger and dragon are yin qi energy..... manifested through the resonance of complementary opposites.....

Bruce Frantzis style of Tiger and Dragon qigong youtube 

So it gives the movements but nothing about white tiger as lungs and green dragon as liver....

 And so when we return back to the actual alchemy text it gives a slightly different meaning of the tiger

, p. 41 ( “The sun stands for the heart and the moon for the lower tan t'ien cavity (under the navel), respectively symbolized by the dragon (female or negative vitality) [yin qi] and the tiger (the male or positive vitality) [Yuan Qi].”
Taoist Yoga

Which is to say now the tiger is what above was called the  purified generative energy, which is also called the primordial vapor and it is created AFTER the energy is cycled through the pineal gland and then swallowed back into the lower tan t'ien.....
 

“However if he can unite the element of metal (male) with that of wood (female) and the sun and the moon in one place….he will see the light of true vitality in front of his original cavity of spirit which will then hold it to prevent it from running away; the longer it is held the brighter it will be. When it becomes stable it reveals the successful union of the dragon and tiger (i.e. the female and male vital breaths).” p. 72

AND SO NOW - we get clarification. The male or positive vitality is the metal as the lung energy. And so the right hand is yin as lower body - that goes against the yang of the lung as yuan qi energy.... interesting!!
 

“The left eye stands for the East whose element is wood….” p. 65

“…the female element of moon is the wood….” p. 85

 O.K. this is what I forgot!! the left eye is Moon as yin qi energy and then turns into Sun as the yuan shen.... If I remember correctly....

So the liver qi is moon as yin qi.....the moon within the Sun of the fire heart spirit. While the lung as metal is yuan qi yang.....

thereby finalizing the connection of the negative vitality as the source of the positive spirit of the sun of the left eye. From the glossary:

“negative fire in the stove” [lower tan tien]

fire derived from prenatal vitality is “negative fire” in the house of water….

“spirit in li” the house of fire (the heart) is essential nature.

Nature-vitality is negative

golden light reveals the fullness of the “negative vitality within the generative force.”

O.K. so that digs deeper in the mystery....
 

  that the Dragon is the yin within the yang of the Sun fire

So when Dragon is in the Sun-Fire it is the Moon-wood-female-yin or negative fire....
 

 the Tiger is the yang within the yin of the water Moon

And so the Tiger is the Lung Metal Yuan Qi source of the generative fluid - so the fire within the water or yang sun within the moon.

You can see HOW Complicated this is!! haha.

When I search Bruce Frantzis book on Dragon and Tiger qigong for Lung - I get one hit that mentions dragon!

Dang!!

So far I have the book Taoist Yoga: Alchemy and Immortality corroborating Waysun Liao - so I will stick with that for now....

O.K. so Bruce Frantzis has an image saying "moving 1 energizes the lungs and liver" - and the movement 1 on the youtube vid is the same more or less as the "moving of yin and yang" exercise".....

O.K. so maybe he just doesn't get into all the complicated Taoist Alchemy secrets. haha.
 

 The supreme Yin of the south gives birth the the fire of the heart,
    within this fire is the Yin Water. 

So what this means is that the yin qi of the liver is Moon - it will turn into generative fluid if left to its devices as water... but at the same time it powers the spirit as the fire of the heart....And my claim to this effect is corroborated by Taoist Yoga: Alchemy and Immortality stating:

Spirit can only hold vitality temporarily but lacks the driving power of breathing, and without breathing, vitality cannot be driven into the channels of control and function and will drain away by the genital gate; this is caused by lack of pressure from in and out breathing. p. 87

And this alchemy line?

 The supreme Yang of the north gives birth to the water of the kidneys,
    within this water is Yang Fire.

What this means then is the Lungs are Yuan qi as yang that is the source of the generative fluid of the Moon ....

O.K. so it makes sense but again it gets very complicated quickly....

 The Yin within the Yang is the supreme spirit of Yin, 
    the essence of the sun.

Again the liver qi.

 The Yang within the Yin is the the supreme essence of Yang,
    the splendor of the moon. 

The yuan qi source of the water tiger.....

    The Sacred Treatise on the Great Mystery, T'ai-hsuan Pao-tien, circa 1200 CE
     Translated by Eva Wong, Nourishing the Essence of Life, p. 94


 

So here is the secret - the "yin" of the fire is the liver of the heart while the yang of the water is the lungs.

 

So what the common saying of alchemy says to take from the water to feed the dragon as fire - that means a FULL cycle of the energy since it has to go through the pineal gland to get purified and returned back to the lower tan t'ien, now the dragon, instead of tiger.

 

 I just word searched where I got that image and NO HITS for liver nor lung!! Hilarious - they don't know the SECRET

 

That is the secret of Dragon and tiger interchanging....as real alchemy.

 

 Hence when yang (fire) contains a yin essence, it is known as wood (lesser yang) and when yin (water) contains a yang essence, it is known as metal (lesser yin)….just as greater yang (fire) grows from lesser yang (wood), so must fire be retracted back into wood. Just as greater yin (water) grows from lesser yin (metal), so must water be retracted back into metal. The two retracted halves - wood and metal, lesser yang and lesser yin, are then able to form the perfect earthly balance. This retraction and unification of yin and yang provides the matrix in which the golden embryo grows or is cultivated. 'Taking from water (☵) to fill in fire (☲)’: The History and Dynamics of Daoist Alchemy by Aaron Cheak, Ph.D.

 So Aaron Cheak does know the real secret - but does he know that is also the secret of the Dragon and Tiger Tai Chi "moving hands like clouds" movement?

 

So this is why my "Idiot's Guide" article is confused on this - it is not clear. But now I have clarified things....

 

There was another great explanation of this process in a Tai Chi book from the UK - let's see if I can find it again.... NOW that I Have a handle on this stuff a bit better....

 

But you see where the noncommutative phase aspect comes in - it take the Quick Fire breathing to drive the yin qi of the liver back up above to keep it from turning into generative fluid - and so to turn it back into the air of water....

 

Tai Chi Chüan: Harmonizing Taoist Belief and Practice - Jeaneane D. Fowler, Shifu Keith Ewers

 

 

 

This is it!! O.K. now to get the quote...

The triagram Li is fire and predominantly yang, but the important middle line is yin, and so the Dragon is female. It is the yin essence in the yang, water in fire, the female in the male, the moon in the sun. It is referred to as Green Dragon....It is water that rises, being heated, and is therefore fiery but yielding, rising to Heaven.

 

The triagram K'an/Kan is Water and predominantly yin and female. But the middle line is yang and alchemically it is the yang in the yin, the White Tiger, ....its function is to descend to Earth when fire reacts with it. It is the fire in the water.

So THIS is Damo Mitchell....

 In the alchemical process, the yang in the water is used to settle the yin in the fire: the water rises and the fire descends. Thus the solid yang line is taken out of the Water to replace the middle yin line in the Fire, thus producing Heaven.

  That's Triplex Unity:

 “the male of kan [water] is the sun and the female of li [fire] is the moon."

So the deep breathing brings the lung qi DOWN to then pull the FIRE (the liver qi) DOWN with it... NOW I GET IT.... I was wondering why the LUng qi DESCENDS. Since it is Water as Tiger with yang in it... so it descends - that's what the water refers to....

 

 

The Lungs also direct Qi downward. A full inhalation can only occur when the Lungs send Qi down to the Kidneys, which in turn “Grasp The Qi.” This is essentially “Dantian Breathing,” or “Kidney Breathing,” the deep abdominal breathing advocated in meditation, Nei Gong and the martial arts. For this reason, natural deep breathing is of paramount importance in the internal arts.

Tom Bisio, author of Nei Gong: The Authentic Classic (Nei Gong Zhen Chuan)

Again the secret is the LUNG qi pulls down the FIRE of the heart (the liver qi) - since the lung qi is WATER.... Gotcha!!

 

But Fowler and Ewers took down their book? it's not on google anymore.

Since alchemy is concerned in the first place with the inner lines of the trigrams Li [fire] and Kan [water], the paradox of reversal consists in considering Li as female, while logically it should be male because its Yang-masculine lines are predominant. Analogously, Kan should be female, but is considered to be male. "The Sun is Li and belongs to Yang, and instead it is a girl. The Moon is Kan and belongs to Yin, and instead it is a boy. This is the reversal" (Xiuzhen shishu , 26.27a.)

Isabelle Robinet confirms my alchemical discovery

 

So this paradox is completely explained as the lung/kidney and heart/liver and how they are reversals within each other, etc. Somebody on a forum gives a plug for this book:

 "Tai Chi Chuan, Harmonizing Taoist Beliefs and Practice, Jeaneane D. Fowler, and "Shifu" Keith Ewers (probably the one exception I made to my non martial sources position, mainly due to Fowler. Her work is some of the best and clearest on the subject of Taoist history.)

 

 

The Lungs also direct Qi downward. A full inhalation can only occur when the Lungs send Qi down to the Kidneys, which in turn “Grasp The Qi.” This is essentially “Dantian Breathing,” or “Kidney Breathing,” the deep abdominal breathing advocated in meditation, Nei Gong and the martial arts. For this reason, natural deep breathing is of paramount importance in the internal arts.

Tom Bisio, author of Nei Gong: The Authentic Classic (Nei Gong Zhen Chuan)

Again the secret is the LUNG qi pulls down the FIRE of the heart (the liver qi) - since the lung qi is WATER.... Gotcha!!

 

But Fowler and Ewers took down their book? it's not on google anymore.

Since alchemy is concerned in the first place with the inner lines of the trigrams Li [fire] and Kan [water], the paradox of reversal consists in considering Li as female, while logically it should be male because its Yang-masculine lines are predominant. Analogously, Kan should be female, but is considered to be male. "The Sun is Li and belongs to Yang, and instead it is a girl. The Moon is Kan and belongs to Yin, and instead it is a boy. This is the reversal" (Xiuzhen shishu , 26.27a.)

Isabelle Robinet confirms my alchemical discovery

 

So this paradox is completely explained as the lung/kidney and heart/liver and how they are reversals within each other, etc. Somebody on a forum gives a plug for this book:

 "Tai Chi Chuan, Harmonizing Taoist Beliefs and Practice, Jeaneane D. Fowler, and "Shifu" Keith Ewers (probably the one exception I made to my non martial sources position, mainly due to Fowler. Her work is some of the best and clearest on the subject of Taoist history.)

 

 

http://www.leefamilyinternalarts.com/Keith Ewers.html

 

http://www.goldenelixir.com/jindan/texts_wuzhen_pian_3.html

 

So I word search for Liver and Lung - NOTHING!! Hilarious

 

We get more secrets in the commentaries.

therefore the full moon illustrates the symbolic "time" by which the collection of True Yang should happen.

So the metal energy is strongest at full moon - which is why Gabriel Cousens advocates fasting during full moons.....

The symbolic "pound" of Elixir, therefore, is made of eight ounces of Lead and eight ounces of Mercury.

So we now know the "lead' is from the liver qi that has descended. The mercury is from the lung qi....

Wow this is amazing that the Daoist alchemy texts now make sense to me!!

https://www.scribd.com/document/155949681/Komjathy-Louis-Cultivating-Perfection-Mysticism-and-Self-Transformation-in-Early-Quanzhen-Daoism

So I used the scribd conversion tool over on the ecoecho blog - and then get corroboration:

There we go - a real INternal Arts ALCHEMY lineage!!

  the Heart is considered to be the son of the Liver and the mother of the Spleen within traditional Chinese medicine the Heart is known as the emperor of all the internal organs (Zangfu).

 https://lfiaa.wordpress.com/
 

Firstly let me explain what is meant by “Taming the Dragon & Tiger”. Within Traditional Chinese Medicine (TCM) they consider the Qi (energy) inside of us as (Yin) and corresponds to the Dragon (Long), whereas the Blood or Fire (Huo) that circulates inside us is considered to be (Yang) and corresponds to the Tiger (Hu). So the heading “Taming the Dragon & Tiger”

Fascinating....
 

The Taiji Pole is a central line that runs from the crown of the head at the (Bai Hui) “Hundred Meetings Du 20” directly through the centre of the body to the (Hui Yin) “Meeting of Yin Ren 1” located between the legs.

The Taiji Pole is made up of three major  energy vessels the Governing Vessel (Du Mai) which travels up the length of the back through the spinal column where it connects to the Conception Vessel (Ren Mai) that travels down the front of the body. The third major vessels is the Thrusting Vessel ( Chong Mai) which does travel through the Taiji Pole. Each of these three major energy vessels store the vital energy (Qi) and circulate it throughout the entire body through the Yin & Yang meridians which are connected to the internal organs (Zangfu).

 Taiji is Neigong
 

 One such aspect is to allow the breath to expand into the back muscles like the Lattissimus Dorsi muscle on either side of the back, when the student performs any of the Taiji Qigong exercise where the both arms are lifted together or in a singular method above the head the back muscles will come into play and with the intention of breathing deeply into the lungs like filling a balloon.

O.K. Finally - after speeding reading his blog....
 

As the Original Feng Shou Quan-Gongfu has its origins within Daoism, then it is obvious that this internal martial art (Neijiaquan) involves all of the Daoist symbolises to help give the practitioner a better understanding and knowledge on how best to skilfully use this internal martial art for both health, energy cultivation and self defence. The symbolism of the “Cloud Dragon and Wind Tiger” is just another repensentation of Yin & Yang, as the Cloud Dragon (Yun Long) represents the receptive or (Yin) energy and the Wind Tiger ( Feng Hu) represent the creative or (Yang) energy.

[voidisyinyang]

The Five Element Creation Fist routine begins as with most Xingyiquan routines in the Three Body Posture (San Ti Shi). The San Ti Shi is the most important and most basic training method in Xingyiquan.  All movements in the style do not stray away from the principles of the San Ti Shi.

Sure enough - right hand is up, while left hand is down - based on the SECRET of LUNG as yang qi of water, right hand is yin and LIVER is yin qi of fire, left hand is yang
 

The Santi posture is based on the metal element in the Xingyi five element fists.  The metal element corresponds to the Lungs.  Therefore by cultivating in this posture the Lungs and the Kong Chi are greatly enhanced.

AMAZINGLY - there is no understanding that the right hand is yin while the lungs are yang - and this is the real secret of the San Ti Shi posture as the CORE training of Xingyiquan martial arts internal alchemy!!!!

[voidisyinyang]

http://rumsoakedfist.org/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=26928&start=0&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&sid=73b724595c0cabce60454d14ec71c816

 

I posted this over at the forum covering Xingyiquan and Tai Chi - with images so it will be easier to follow.

 

thanks

 

 

[Mudfoot]

Although poking @voidisyinyang is great fun, you should notice that the first post dated 23 march contains a lot of good and valid information.

 

It could need some organizing, and as usual there are parts I dont get and some minor details where i (perhaps) disagree. 

I'm going to copy it and print it out, just to make sure. 

 

Too bad you wrote it in this thread, it deserves a thread on its own. 

Perhaps in your PPD, where you can prevent comments? 

[Daemon]

On the other hand, preventing comments also prevents the trolls from painting a nice target on themselves, which highlights who's worth the time and who is not.

 

☮️

[Mudfoot]

31 minutes ago, Daemon said:

On the other hand, preventing comments also prevents the trolls from painting a nice target on themselves, which highlights who's worth the time and who is not.

 

☮️

It would stop my posts :-) 

 

 

[Daemon]

That would be a shame, because then I wouldn't have spotted that you might not be somebody I'd class as a troll. :-)

 

☮️

[Mudfoot]

within 1-2 weeks I plan to post a comment to this in my PPD:

 

LuoHan Gong and Voidisyinyang's work about Dragon and Tiger: A critical analysis.

 

Or something like that.

 

One part of the theory that I did,t see as fully explained for (when I quickly eyed through it) is that many movements and stances are done on both sides.

 

Isn't san ti done on both sides?  My Xing-Yi experiences are quite minimal, an intensive week in the nineties and Frantzis DVD's, but I have the impression you changed sides.

[voidisyinyang]

6 hours ago, Mudfoot said:

within 1-2 weeks I plan to post a comment to this in my PPD:

 

LuoHan Gong and Voidisyinyang's work about Dragon and Tiger: A critical analysis.

 

Or something like that.

 

One part of the theory that I did,t see as fully explained for (when I quickly eyed through it) is that many movements and stances are done on both sides.

 

Isn't san ti done on both sides?  My Xing-Yi experiences are quite minimal, an intensive week in the nineties and Frantzis DVD's, but I have the impression you changed sides.

 

Yes if you read that rumsoakedfist thread - somebody asked me for clarification and so I did more digging and finally I discovered the Noncommutative phase Daoist alchemy secret of Santi Shi.

 

So just to then corroborate that this is indeed a secret - I watched EVERY vid on Santi Shi training on youtube and none of them explained this core principle of the stance. It is quite stunning actually.

 

So then I began to question myself - maybe I had just discovered some kind of fluke? So I kept digging more and finally I found further corroboration.

 

I posted all this research on my blog.

 

http://elixirfield.blogspot.com/2018/05/shifu-zhang-yun-really-understands.html

 

So here is my first discovery of the secret - I realized oh - Santi Shi is about the right hand with the left foot and the left hand with the right foot. So your Yi is to visualize the energy going between - the left hand pulls the right foot forward - and then yes the Daoist alchemy says to hold the position for an hour in order for the Daoist alchemy energy to kick in - it takes time. Then you switch sides.

 

http://elixirfield.blogspot.com/2018/05/the-lower-tan-tien-is-definitely.html

 

So here is my 2nd post on Santi Shi - wherein I confirm this is about Daoist alchemy as the small universe aka microcosmic orbit aka small heavenly circuit. So when I practiced the stance - to stay for the hour - I just did the small universe visualization as I held the stance and sure enough - that is exactly what the training manual describes as the key secret of the energy flowing.

 

http://elixirfield.blogspot.com/2018/05/jin-yun-ting-3rd-corroboration-of-key.html

 

So here is my third post where I corroborate my key insight again as the core principle of Santi Shi - and so this corroborates also Eddie Oshins research - and also my math-music research. And so I give the lineage of this secret - and it does include Bruce Frantzis, of course.

 

So there are probably people out there explaining this - but I have yet to find any WEstern teacher who actually explains this core principle of Santi Shi training - which is again quite stunning.

 

I mean I had never even trained in the posture - and so I go onto that martial arts forum and people are making fun of me. But no one on the forum actually explained the secret - so finally I discovered it on my own. So this is Jin Yun Ting:

 

Quote

The left hand harmonizes with the right foot;
the left elbow harmonizes with the right knee;
the left shoulder harmonizes with the right hip,
and conversely so on the right side.

 

and this is Zhang Yun:

 

Quote

The first step in integration force training is to mentally connect one arm with the leg on the opposite side of your body. Focus first on the Laogong point of your left hand and then expand this thought to the Yongquan point on your right foot....Complete this part of your practice by focusing on the Lao Gong point on your right hand and connecting it to the Yongquan point on your left
foot.

 

[Mudfoot]

2 hours ago, voidisyinyang said:

 

Yes if you read that rumsoakedfist thread - 

 

2 hours ago, voidisyinyang said:

I mean I had never even trained in the posture - and so I go onto that martial arts forum and people are making fun of me. 

 

The rum soaked fist. 

For you to post there is like having a theoretical physicist at an engineering convention. 

 

Or bathing in sheeps blood and dive in to a Wolf pit. 

 

Mismatch..... 😁 

[KuroShiro]

4 hours ago, voidisyinyang said:

So here is my 2nd post on Santi Shi - wherein I confirm this is about Daoist alchemy as the small universe aka microcosmic orbit aka small heavenly circuit. So when I practiced the stance - to stay for the hour - I just did the small universe visualization as I held the stance and sure enough - that is exactly what the training manual describes as the key secret of the energy flowing.

 

4 hours ago, voidisyinyang said:

So here is my first discovery of the secret - I realized oh - Santi Shi is about the right hand with the left foot and the left hand with the right foot. So your Yi is to visualize the energy going between - the left hand pulls the right foot forward - and then yes the Daoist alchemy says to hold the position for an hour in order for the Daoist alchemy energy to kick in - it takes time. Then you switch sides.

 

In the context of Daoist alchemy do you have to use visualization or can you just practice it without it?

 

[voidisyinyang]

3 hours ago, KuroShiro said:

 

 

In the context of Daoist alchemy do you have to use visualization or can you just practice it without it?

 

 

Rumsoakedfist had a thread on what is "yi" - and the research I discovered - that I posted before here - is that when we see with eyes open then the subconscious is in control but with eyes closed - the attention is primary - as the parietal lobe that then controls the occipital lobe as internal visualization. And so the "yi" is actually this top down attention that is tied to the "internal listening" as right-brain dominant listening. So it is tied to feeling the energy as proprioception, the "sixth sense" from the piezoelectric collagen.

 

I looked up Santi Shi with eyes closed and only found one mention of it but some say to look into the distance, do not move the pupils. One says to look at the fold of the elbow of the arm raised - one says to partially close the eyes and to look upwards at 45 degrees and focus on the third eye.

 

The Yi Quan training manual says to focus on the Ni Wan - which is the pineal gland. So for me - I do the small universe with the eyes closed because that stores up the energy. But maybe this is not the proper way in terms of maintaining proper awareness and balance.

 

This thread - again NO mention of the core principle of the stance which is the right hand to left foot and left hand to right foot, etc.

So the training is to feel the energy connected and building up between these complementary opposites - using your Yi - which is the qi of the brain as the awareness. Visualization is the spirit as biophotons. But as I quote - the core secret is to concentrate the spirit into the bones. That is the original meaning of Qi - the oldest meaning of Qi is "fire under water" - to spirit as fire goes into the Earth (bones) to turn water into air as steam - that is alchemy.

 

http://www.ycgf.org/Articles/XY_SanTiShi/XY_SanTiShi.html

That previous thread did give this link as the best overview. I agree.

Quote

. The Eyes are level, looking straight ahead and into the distance. Sometimes the eyes will be closed. The ears "listen" behind you and to the sounds of the body.

http://ef.sifuondemand.com/xingyiquan/splitting/santi.html

So here they call "intention" as subconscious muscle control - that should flow smoothly to build up the qi.

 

http://ef.sifuondemand.com/xingyiquan/splitting/neijia.html

So notice in this thread - it is stated "there are six harmonies" - and then it states......

http://www.martialtalk.com/threads/santi-shi-and-more-rambling-from-a-xingyi-addict.83638/

 

Quote

1) the hands harmonize the feet
2) the shoulders harmonize the hips
3) the elbows harmonize the knees

These (4–6) are pretty much “three intents must follow one another” from the Eight Vital Points
4) the heart harmonizes the intent
5) the intent harmonizes with the qi
6) the qi harmonizes with the power

 

So later in the thread - the firs three are described as "self-explanatory."

But again notice that the crucial key principle of what makes it Daoist alchemy is left out!!

 

The right hand harmonizes with the left foot and left hand with the right foot.

Etc. THIS GETS excluded and yet it's the foundation of the training!

The next says Heart

Heart means spirit as visualization.

Intention - intent means the subconscious muscle control or proprioception but as top-down "attention" of the parietal lobe - so it turns vision from being a subconscious external emotional perception to being an internal attention objective perception that is not emotional.

 

[Mudfoot]

So you feel that the progression through ming jing, an jing, hua jing and guang jing is the same as Nei Dan? 

 

I do think that practitioners of Xing Yi are aware of how to get there, it might be so that this progress is not the main focus when someone writes about it online. 

 

The six harmonies are clear enough when you use them. 

 

You might find Scott Meredith being a source that is unusually clear on this subject. 

[voidisyinyang]

16 hours ago, Mudfoot said:

So you feel that the progression through ming jing, an jing, hua jing and guang jing is the same as Nei Dan? 

 

I do think that practitioners of Xing Yi are aware of how to get there, it might be so that this progress is not the main focus when someone writes about it online. 

 

The six harmonies are clear enough when you use them. 

 

You might find Scott Meredith being a source that is unusually clear on this subject. 

http://www.ycgf.org/Articles/TJ_XY_BG/arti_TBX.htm

 

Quote

It is very common for Xingyi practitioners to remain
at the level of Ming Jin even after many years hard training because they do not know how to progress to the next step (An Jin) and
perhaps do not even realize the need to further progress.

I think again this is because the complementary opposites secret of the 6 harmonies is not taught.

As I have stated - I watched all the youtube vids and no one explains the complementary opposites.

That is the secret.

 

[voidisyinyang]

16 hours ago, Mudfoot said:

 

You might find Scott Meredith being a source that is unusually clear on this subject. 

Do you have any link of Scott Meredith referring to the right hand-left foot and left hand-right foot complementary opposite harmonics? That is a basic minimum level of understanding required for the true training. If you can show me he understands that then I will consider his work in full. thanks.

[Mudfoot]

7 hours ago, voidisyinyang said:

http://www.ycgf.org/Articles/TJ_XY_BG/arti_TBX.htm

 

I think again this is because the complementary opposites secret of the 6 harmonies is not taught.

As I have stated - I watched all the youtube vids and no one explains the complementary opposites.

That is the secret.

 

Or that they do not work enough with the wuji stance, and focus too much on their fighting ability. 

[Mudfoot]

And if you read up on his material, you will see that you need more to get an energetic wave from the feet up the niwan and out to the hands. It is contained in the six harmonies and in the physicality, but there is more to it. 

Edited May 11, 2018 by Mudfoot
Added sentence