How deep does your feeling go ?

[seekingbuddha]

I have seen this commonality among those who have spiritual practices.  There seems to be lot of emotional capacity in them.  The words of the African English actor in the movie Species comes to my mind.  When asked how can he sense where the Species is, he says "I feel things deeply, thats all".   So, i wonder how many of you here have noticed this ability to feel deep feelings of OTHERS.

 

For  example,  do you sense and feel as strongly as the person on TV (reality show) feels ? Do you feel it to the extent that tears roll down your eyes, when you see someone in real world suffering deeply (say in a funeral or hospital etc.) ?  Give some description of how deep the feeling of others is  sensed by you - just saying that "Yes, i also feel it deeply" is not enough of a description for others to understand you.

 

[Tibetan_Ice]

I have to ask you then. How do you think Dawg is going to feel when he reads your post in which you deny his enlightenment based on your opinion? Are you more advanced than he is? Do you think that you hurt his feelings when he asked you not to call him "master" yet you persisted? Did he hurt your feelings deeply?

[Chang]

I have seen this commonality among those who have spiritual practices.  There seems to be lot of emotional capacity in them.  The words of the African English actor in the movie Species comes to my mind.  When asked how can he sense where the Species is, he says "I feel things deeply, thats all".   So, i wonder how many of you here have noticed this ability to feel deep feelings of OTHERS.

 

For  example,  do you sense and feel as strongly as the person on TV (reality show) feels ? Do you feel it to the extent that tears roll down your eyes, when you see someone in real world suffering deeply (say in a funeral or hospital etc.) ?  Give some description of how deep the feeling of others is  sensed by you - just saying that "Yes, i also feel it deeply" is not enough of a description for others to understand you.

 

 

I also have noticed this commonality amongst the cry baby pseudo follower of spiritual practices.

 

Those who diligently follow a path will develop a state of unshakable calm. If they witness suffering and are able to alleviate it then they may well do so. To simply feel empathy with the sufferer and burst into tears is really not a lot of good.

 

I cannot comment on feelings engendered by those participating in or viewing reality tv. Life is just too short.

[wilfred]

I have to ask you then. How do you think Dawg is going to feel when he reads your post in which you deny his enlightenment based on your opinion? Are you more advanced than he is? Do you think that you hurt his feelings when he asked you not to call him "master" yet you persisted? Did he hurt your feelings deeply?

 

if he really was enlightened, wouldn't pay it any mind at all.

 

or maybe he'd use all his insight and come up with another post like this:

 

http://thedaobums.com/topic/30012-a-path-to-enlightenment/page-9#entry607204

 

as for the OP, depends how far down the path you are. for many people, being able to feel deeply, even without a great deal of control over emotions and when things are spilling out, is a huge leap from the condition of most in our society. especially if we're talking typical male conditioning. but Chang is right, someone making progress is not going to be much disturbed, their ability to feel empathy and connect is unlikely to generate big external responses very often.

 

also, there's the factor of how much we're drawing on our sense of acceptance (love) or how much we're getting entangled in other people's energies and/or triggering our own defilements when experiencing emotional outbursts. being physically close to someone seems much more likely to elicit the latter, as there's a lot of interaction between energy fields and we easily lose control of the whole process. 'connecting' to other people's feeling isn't really desirable in that sense.

 

over here i'm just learning how to feel again, crying a lot as realisations hit home and generally feeling very humbled by the whole experience of detaching from being the centre of the universe. this includes connecting to other energies whether i much like it or not, but for now it's a learning experience. it's always a fine line between being open enough to let things go and getting entangled in other people's stuff. there's quite an art to how you organize your energy field between being open and more closed ('defensive mode') depending on situation/environment, such is the harshness and incoherence present in the modern environment, including other people.

[steve]

I have seen this commonality among those who have spiritual practices.  There seems to be lot of emotional capacity in them.  The words of the African English actor in the movie Species comes to my mind.  When asked how can he sense where the Species is, he says "I feel things deeply, thats all".   So, i wonder how many of you here have noticed this ability to feel deep feelings of OTHERS.

 

For  example,  do you sense and feel as strongly as the person on TV (reality show) feels ? Do you feel it to the extent that tears roll down your eyes, when you see someone in real world suffering deeply (say in a funeral or hospital etc.) ?  Give some description of how deep the feeling of others is  sensed by you - just saying that "Yes, i also feel it deeply" is not enough of a description for others to understand you.

 

I'll share a few words about my feelings -

 

I would say that I was an emotional cripple for many years. I was highly successful in non-emotional endeavors but really completely out of touch with deeper emotions in myself, though completely unaware of it. Sure, I could tell you that I felt sad or happy, and I was very good at being angry. I had a general sense of others' feelings but was not nearly as connected with others as I thought. 

 

A few things transpired that changed me profoundly from an emotional point of view. I don't plan to share details but I've become much more aware of the presence, depth, and value of my own feelings and, in doing so, I am much more sensitive to and concerned with the feelings of others. This is something that occurred over a long period of time and multiple factors played into it. It is not possible to really understand the feelings of others if we are not first in touch with ourselves deeply. And we are living in a very narrow and sterile bandwidth when we are not living a full emotional life. 

 

It is a bit painful and a bit frustrating to read so much discussion here concerning spirituality, awakening, enlightenment, higher levels of consciousness, meditation, transformation, and related topics, and seeing so little discussion or demonstration of feelings, of caring for each other, of kindness. So many intellectual discussions and arguments here but often so sterile and theoretical - so little juice! What good is a theoretical dissertation on enlightenment when we're lonely and mean? Why bother with any of this if it's just to pick fights, put others down, build up our own ego? For me, that's worthless and I'm not saying that I'm not guilty as well but I'm trying to be very aware of that and go in a different direction in my life. It's really wonderful to see this thread and I hope to see many more like it. But what I really would love to see is more kindness and friendliness here, more genuine concern for each other rather than for our arguments and points of view. 

 

Until we begin to explore our feelings, not analyze or understand intellectually, but simply spend time feeling and opening to others, and seeing how that affects our day to day lives, we are simply playing mental gymnastics with talk about awakening and spirituality. I see people use words like light and bliss but do they recognize and feel that what these words are pointing to is connection, awareness, openness, and love?  

 

We are collectively starved for human contact and relationship in our modern lives, we've lost so much of our sense of community and family. I think it's one of the great poisons in our lives and is responsible for much of the pain and suffering we see and feel. When I think of these things in my meditative practice, I can feel enormous pain and find myself in tears. And yet in that deep sadness is beauty because it's that very pain that is a manifestation of feeling and connection. 

 

Sorry for the rant and especially sorry to sound so preachy...

I love you all (well, I'm trying anyway)

[liminal_luke]

I think that´s right on the mark Steve. Yesterday, I was struck by something Sillybearhappyhoneyeater said in the midst of a very technical thread about opening up meridians. He said that Taoism was about kindness. Who knew?

[C T]

One of my teachers, (to me) the embodiment of Mother Wisdom, once said to me in a very endearing sort of way, "There is no need to try to love others, to get anxious about being kind and to be constantly straining to help others ~ just try your best to remain open, like the sky... in that way, the love, the kindness, the genuine concern thats already in you will simply manifest effortlessly..." 

 

Her words came to mind suddenly when i read Steve's post above. 

 

Thank you. 

[Jetsun]

While many spiritual people focus on love and compassion I have found in my own life that if you want to really become emotionally mature it is more about accepting the more unpleasant feelings like rage, jealousy, envy. You have the capacity to become Hitler and the impulse to murder isn't actually that far from the surface.

 

The human being has absolutely everything in it and ego consciousness is often about trying to deny certain parts and only keep the more socially acceptable aspects of humanity and everything else is thrown into the dark of the unconscious, where is actually becomes more powerful and dangerous than if it is conscious and accepted.

 

When we wall ourselves off from "negative" feelings it overall reduces the capacity to feel, by shutting off your anger you also shut off your love. The essence of anger is actually prajna, or the primordial wisdom which cuts through all the bullshit. The main issue I think is that our emotions get entangled with all our stories and beliefs about life where they stop being genuine and start being about things we have dreamed up, for example a great deal of the emotion you see on tv on reality shows is all about peoples stories they have about themselves, it largely isn't genuine emotion. 

Edited October 3, 2015 by Jetsun

[steve]

"There is no need to try to love others, to get anxious about being kind and to be constantly straining to help others ~ just try your best to remain open, like the sky... in that way, the love, the kindness, the genuine concern thats already in you will simply manifest effortlessly..." 

 

Wonderful

[idiot_stimpy]

Over the last few years, through self awareness, I have been able to sense when others are experiencing emotions and thinking about me. 

[Bodhicitta]

This story may come from the buddhadharma or elsewhere, cannot recall.  

 

A toddler fell into a cesspool and he began to wail pitiably, his mother shrieked & sobbed & cried 'My baby, my darling' etc.  But the stench of the shit and the depth of it kept her away.  The father came out, saw the peril to his son and waded into the cesspool and pulled the baby out to safety.

 

Empathy is needed, but not to the point of paralysis from powerful feelings.

[seekingbuddha]

I have to ask you then. How do you think Dawg is going to feel when he reads your post in which you deny his enlightenment based on your opinion? Are you more advanced than he is? Do you think that you hurt his feelings when he asked you not to call him "master" yet you persisted? Did he hurt your feelings deeply?

 

T.ice,  it was not my intention to humiliate him or chide him in that thread.  In fact, Dawg's posts in that thread is what brought me to this forum.  Dawg has made extremely valuable contributions to my life, through the internet, without him even knowing it.  My refutations of his claim to enlightenment came out of a good place in my heart - they came out of a space, which had the intention of showing him that he has further to go;  they came out of goodwill and compassion for him; they came out of my realization that his exposure to Buddha's words were lacking  depth;  they came out of my  penetration into his level of accomplishment (based on his own words) and seeing that he is not enlightened.  If you read that thread further, you will see that the conclusion  is NOT based on my opinion,  but based on facts. 

 

In fact, Dawg's posts are a perfect example of a common westerner going to an eastern country, winding up with a random teacher (who is well known among the locals, but is NOT liberated - there are thousands like this).  Then, after a period of spending time in ascetic practices, proclaims liberation or enlightenment, comes back to west and starts teaching, throughly convinced that the mental state that they have seen is liberation (or enlightenment - use your word of choice).  A discerning/wise student will be able to see through.

 

If you go through that thread, you will see that I held my respect towards whatever he claimed he has accomplished.  Let us say, I happened to meet an enlightened person in real life;  let us say, I am convinced that the person is enlightened;  let us say,  the enlightened person  asked me NOT to show any respect towards him; let us say, i do not  address him respectfully  because of his instruction to me; let us say another wise  man comes along and notices that i did not pay respect to the enlightened being.  Would that be better than  me  explaining to the enlightened being that I do not wish to address him without  respect ?  You can come to your own conclusions - no need to dwell on this further, because the topic of this thread is  different.  Metta to you.

Edited October 4, 2015 by seekingbuddha

[seekingbuddha]

It is a bit painful and a bit frustrating to read so much discussion here concerning spirituality, awakening, enlightenment, higher levels of consciousness, meditation, transformation, and related topics, and seeing so little discussion or demonstration of feelings, of caring for each other, of kindness. So many intellectual discussions and arguments here but often so sterile and theoretical - so little juice! What good is a theoretical dissertation on enlightenment when we're lonely and mean? Why bother with any of this if it's just to pick fights, put others down, build up our own ego? For me, that's worthless and I'm not saying that I'm not guilty as well but I'm trying to be very aware of that and go in a different direction in my life. It's really wonderful to see this thread and I hope to see many more like it. But what I really would love to see is more kindness and friendliness here, more genuine concern for each other rather than for our arguments and points of view. 

 

Until we begin to explore our feelings, not analyze or understand intellectually, but simply spend time feeling and opening to others, and seeing how that affects our day to day lives, we are simply playing mental gymnastics with talk about awakening and spirituality. I see people use words like light and bliss but do they recognize and feel that what these words are pointing to is connection, awareness, openness, and love?  

 

We are collectively starved for human contact and relationship in our modern lives, we've lost so much of our sense of community and family. I think it's one of the great poisons in our lives and is responsible for much of the pain and suffering we see and feel. When I think of these things in my meditative practice, I can feel enormous pain and find myself in tears. And yet in that deep sadness is beauty because it's that very pain that is a manifestation of feeling and connection. 

 

This is a lovely post;  I have held these sentiments ever since I became a member of this forum.   That last paragraph triggered my thoughts regarding  some of the study i have done regarding  ancient cultures/history/timelines-of-spirituality.   During my study of  the most ancient  cultures  known to modern humans,  I realized that  these cultures  had a chance  to live  much more close to nature  than us.  It was the dawn of Agriculture in human history - imagine a time when the most modern technology that they possessed  is Agriculture and  knowledge of Iron/Copper/Bronze. That's it.  No further complications or knowledge.  No wonder they were much more connected to their feelings, without the need to think/rationalize  so much.  

 

Their lifestyle was much more relaxed than ours because their daily work was much more connected with nature than us (sitting in offices).  Relatively speaking, they had much more free time and relaxed nature of mind, without the compulsive behavior of modern-day, city dwellers I see around me.  Many around me constantly face the compulsion of mind to "do something constantly / accomplish things one after another / seek unceasing success".   With this compulsion of mind, how are we ever going to understand "non-doing" and connect with  our most subtle/deep-rooted  feelings/capabilities-of-mind ? 

[Horus]

Edited January 28, 2016 by Horus

[seekingbuddha]

Horus,  thank you for the response.  When i was reading .....

 

"....That is an intense experience. The most intense of which was the White Rhino...I was clearing orangutangs, elephants, whales, lions, tigers, snakes..on and on it went. Some had a few things, some had one. All were divinely grateful. The Rhino made me feel more anger than I have ever experienced, and when I cleared that anger, a lightening bolt jolted through one of my arm channels, exceedingly painfully, causing me to double over and shout out in shock...."

 

I started wondering if you worked in a zoo.  

 

Have you done TLM on yourself ? If so, you will know how you acquired  the ability (as a small child)  to classify the demon as a demon (the very first time you saw him).

[Horus]

Edited January 28, 2016 by Horus