Yigong by Sifu Jenny Lamb

[gendao]

With all this brouhaha I decided to try again last night. This is what happened.

 

First off, I had the sense to not try to attack him, I just connected. He immediately became a three-year-old boy, alone and afraid. Not quite as effective as a baby for extracting heart energy, but very good. Very different approach from last time, but once again took every last bit of my heart energy. On the other hand, didn't take anything else, so that was good. Fortunately was lying down on the sofa when I made the attempt. I couldn't get up afterwards. I fell into a trance, I think for about an hour. I suppose I can figure that out from my last post here. Woke from the trance, got up, went to the bathroom, staggered off to bed and slept for nine hours. Had this recurring dream about a Christmas ornament we have that is a plastic prism-thingie in the shape of a heart.

 

This morning I feel all tapped out.

Interesting, this experience would bolster my previous impression of a childlike, non-understood oddball who's craving love (heart energy) & acceptance..

 

And so he's likely not so much "stealing" your heart energy as accepting an overflow from you. That likely wouldn't happen with most average people who aren't so bursting at the seams with it and wanting to "heart ejac" into someone else..

[Lucky7Strikes]

I think that's a typo, he meant to type "witch" instead of "with". So in other words, not gay.

 

Scotty, too poor to just drop everything to take a plane to California for the weekend and drop several hundred dollars on a seminar (not to mention hotel room, etc.) And I don't think he drains his students, he's not stupid. I think he's just tapping them a little bit. Have no idea why I get drained to the bone when I connect--probably just me being delusional.

 

anamatva, not afraid of being labeled dark. Not afraid of darkness, darkness is a girl thing.

Ah ok that makes more sense.

 

Max has told stories of dark entities attacking him and being a serious threat to his life. It might have something to do with his past as to why he reacts so strongly to unknown forces.

Edited October 18, 2011 by Lucky7Strikes

[konchog uma]

Ah ok that makes more sense.

 

Max has told stories of dark entities attacking him and being a serious threat to his life. It might have something to do with his past as to why he reacts so strongly to unknown forces.

 

oh yeah im the same way man. Im just touchy, like overly sensitive. Claws and teeth on a dime.. for the same reasons

Edited October 18, 2011 by anamatva

[Aetherous]

Scotty, too poor to just drop everything to take a plane to California for the weekend and drop several hundred dollars on a seminar (not to mention hotel room, etc.) And I don't think he drains his students, he's not stupid. I think he's just tapping them a little bit. Have no idea why I get drained to the bone when I connect--probably just me being delusional.

 

Me too. Maybe sometime he will be near ya, and you can see what he's really like.

 

I don't think you're delusional.

[Sloppy Zhang]

I'd just like to thank everyone who has stepped forward and presented their experiences, knowledge, and yes, even rumors that they have heard.

 

They all add great knowledge to thetaobums. Not to mention they help build the lore of this forum. "Remember the crazy Kunlun days? They're still happening!"

 

When I'm a prospective student/buyer of a product, I LOVE finding conversations like this. I think all the things, good and bad, have a source, either personal, or with the thing everyone is talking about. There's usually a pretty good reason why everyone has the experiences/opinions they have. And for me, it ALL helps in a decision making process. So I'm hoping that these conversations can stay around (as unedited as possible, hopefully) for new people who come by in the future to possibly pick up the practice.

[Warrior Body Buddha Mind]

Witch sounds like you dont mind being Tea Bagged taking the energy from the balls? lmao

 

Anyone up for a Lipton?

[witch]

Am I interpreting that correctly as a challenge? I'm a bit under the weather today, but I'm sure I'll be back in the saddle in a few days. Any video of you, Sifu Garry?

[Warrior Body Buddha Mind]

I have a very HIGH LIBIDO, maybe you could use some? lol

 

Yeah I think you found my channel, take care Witch, also what wicca do you practice do you belong to any sect?

 

Daoist have magic also

[witch]

It's kinda my business to be able to tell that you have high libido.

 

Real wiccans get put out when other witches call themselves wiccan, which is silly since the lineage only goes back sixty years, but I'll stick with plain witch. I'm all fluffy bunny, a solitary. I follow the Egyptian pantheon, currently Tehuti and Sekhmet. I know saying Tehuti sounds pretentious, but if I say Thoth everybody thinks I'm into that goofball Crowley.

 

Ground rules--any energy I am able to take, if I am able to take it, I will return as heart energy. Not sure if you have the capacity to receive, but if you do, good for martial arts energy, you can just put it down in your dan tien. You can say uncle at any time and I'll stop. It's going to take me a bit to get my mojo back--I'm so depleted right now that my tai chi teacher had to give me energy through her hands just so I could get through the drills and I couldn't even do the form.

 

I know that taoists have magic.

[taooneusa]

[Seth Ananda]

This is my last Max post in this thread, but I would like to congratulate Scotty on his superb Information manipulating skills, I think he must be a Lawyer.

 

But despite all the double talk and pretending that truth is malleable, and accusing me of trying to make a 'tiny' bit of truth more concrete than it actually is, The truth here is not up for Intelligent, debate as it is absolutely set in stone.

 

When Max said, "this has never been taught out side of a Monastery", that is exactly what he meant. He was painting a picture... A false but mysterious picture...

 

If he had wanted to say until a few generations ago, this was not taught outside of a monastery, he would have but, but it would not have served the picture he was consciously painting.

The picture he wanted portrays him as a secret wisdom holder, a special being, with deep vows to only release this special sacred teaching when the time was right! $$$ Which is Now! $$$

 

The picture does not give Jenny her Due as lineage holder of one of the main parts of his 'unheard of' only in a monastery teachings. {very very disrespectful}

Only later, did that stuff start to come out.

 

Again for legalists like Scotty, "Never taught out side", means Never.

 

It is blatantly dishonesty to try to infer that he did not mean Never, {as he wrote} but that he really meant some time in the past. 'Some time in the past' is not 'Never'. Can you see, Two totally opposed concepts and meaning structures...

 

It simply did not serve the picture he was painting to say "some time in the past"

 

Anyway I have said my piece, and it is here for all to see. Scotty's reply may be amusing in whatever tactic he takes to try to change blatant fact into some 'simple misunderstanding', but either way, i am out.

 

Max is what he is. Part Liar, and that is unarguable as again it is in the realm of solid fact, but he may also be part Awesomely good teacher.

 

So best wishes to him and his Students. [you too Scotty]

[taooneusa]

.

Edited October 22, 2011 by taooneusa

[Aetherous]

but I would like to congratulate Scotty on his superb Information manipulating skills, I think he must be a Lawyer.

 

LOL thanks for the compliment.

 

I do really think it's a simple misunderstanding...or if it's even a story, it's not worth calling someone a "liar" about! That's quite harsh...and maybe is against forum rules when it's just your opinion?

 

Not going to report you, just saying (with all that's been going on the past day or two).

[Lucky7Strikes]

This is my last Max post in this thread, but I would like to congratulate Scotty on his superb Information manipulating skills, I think he must be a Lawyer....

What Max teaches is not just Jenny's Yi Gong. The Yi Gong and the energy it generates is only a fraction of the practice and in my experience is utilized to open your channels and generate energy so you can complete the alchemy through RP 1, 2, 3 and the GF. No one teaches Kunlun 2 or 3 besides Max to the public. When Max began teaching these techniques, they were known to no one except initiated students like Jenny. Monastery doesn't necessarily mean a physical location, but an order or a group of people bound by vows not to release certain knowledge.

 

Max is also not a student of Jenny's from my knowledge but their relationship is a brother to sister type. If he did not have authority to teach or Jenny would have come out publicly to denounce Max and stop it being released to the public. Jenny would've condemned it from the get go, especially releasing level 2 teachings. From what I understand, Jenny is not the only source Max attained the practices from. The background behind the practices is much deeper than you or anyone's knowledge on this forum.

 

This is just like when there was a controversy over Max's Maoshan lineage when one of the deranged teachers came on board with false rumors against him calling Max a liar and a fake. 5ET had to contact Max and Sifu Lum to clear that whole mess. That instance just revealed how there is a whole backstory to how teachers in that lineage transmit knowledge that no one on this board knew of and everyone was making quick assumptions on what little piece of knowledge they had.

 

If you are suggesting that money is the issue, Sifu Jenny charges the same rate Max does. The money from the book sales also was not just for Max's personal gain, but involved Chris and his company too.

 

Your version of events is very unlikely. Why would Max knowingly fabricate an origins story in the second book and give it to Jenny for approval if she was the one who taught him the practice? That doesn't make sense. Who goes to their teacher with a blatantly made up story about the very practice they taught you? Especially since the first book did not contain an origins story and it was totally unnecessary. Even before the seminar with Jenny you had negative biases against Max due to misunderstanding of Kan's interview. You're not seeing things clearly but just quick to find any evidence to criticize Max.

 

You, me, nor Scotty do not know the full story behind this issue. I suggest you don't jump ship and call Max a liar, but leave an open mind.

Edited October 19, 2011 by Lucky7Strikes

[Sloppy Zhang]

Part Liar, and that is unarguable as again it is in the realm of solid fact, but he may also be part Awesomely good teacher.

 

I do really think it's a simple misunderstanding...or if it's even a story, it's not worth calling someone a "liar" about!

 

Here is what I've seen, as someone who takes an academic interest and personal past time of manipulating words (but only for t3h lulz and only to have good, clean fun with friends.... also to get girls talking dirty ), and as someone who has followed Kunlun as a cultivator who is always on the lookout for the best teachers out there (if not for myself, then at least so I can refer them to someone who may be in need of them).

 

 

The marketing side of Kunlun has done well to "paint" many "pictures" which, if you go back and legalistically look at what is ACTUALLY being said, is not, in and of itself, a lie.

 

I recall on the old website it talked about Max learning from his first teacher who was trained in Wudang. The teacher was a janitor somewhere and helped Max out. Then it said that Max spent the next 15(?) 20(?) X number of years "learning from teachers from Maoshan, Tibet, Siberia, etc etc" (or something to that effect).

 

I do recall thinking "wow, it was pretty cool that a 15 year old was traveling to China, Tibet, Siberia, etc etc, and learning high level secret stuff, he must really be a genius!" But then I started to think about the political climates, the safety aspects, the language barriers.... I was like "how did this work?"

 

Doing some google searches, I turned up the occasional discussion forum where people had those same questions! They weren't sure how a 15 year old was doing this stuff.

 

Then TTB's turned up info on Andrew Lum and Jenny Lamb. I went back and looked more carefully at the wording...

 

No one ever claimed that Max went to these places, only that he learned from teachers who had lineages from those places!!!!

 

But hey, that's not what it sounded like.

 

But is it Max's fault if you misinterpret that to mean that he was a 15 year old third eye fused open genius who was getting initiated into all of the secret things that 85 year old gurus weren't getting? Nope.

 

 

Anyway, that's what I noticed. I found that interesting. Is it straight up lying? Well, no, not really. Is it intentional misdirection? Well who's to say it's intentional? Does it lead people to get a certain image? Well... yes.

 

Would an honest person go back and change it to be as direct as possible? Hm, who knows...?

 

 

Personally, I'm all about who's got the goods and who can verify that he's got the goods, which means doing things yourself, and producing students who can also do those things.

 

To that extent, for me, it takes away NOTHING for you to say "I learned from Andrew Lum, who lives in Hawaii (cool place anyway) who does X, Y, and Z. And I learned from Jenny Lamb, who's a super nice person who does X, Y, and Z. And I found that by combining these two practices, you get tremendous effects, and that's what I teach."

 

But, you know, some people want to hear "I learned how to do energetics from Wudang, which helped me energize my body, then I learned super duper Maoshan magic stuff and combined it with the enlightened Kunlun traditions to make a quick-quick path of mega-enlightenment that will produce results quicker than staring at a wall for 85 years."

 

Second story sounds flashy... too flashy. I will ALWAYS go on a search for concrete names and places that can be traced back from the present to the past. I will support such disclosure, unless such disclosure is against the express wishes of the teacher (like John Chang wanting to go away), or will lead to harassment or safety issues on the part of the teacher. And I support people who will come out and tell the names and places that a teacher learned from.

Edited October 19, 2011 by Sloppy Zhang

[konchog uma]

those are interesting points sloppy zhang, and i like your take on that, very pragmatic.

 

However, just to play devil's advocate, i should ask, isnt a mark of highly spiritually accomplished people Personal Integrity? Why dress up the plain truth a little bit if you are marketing yourself as a daoist energy teacher? Thats not very dao man .

 

Don't get me wrong thats all just point counterpoint, i am not against Max at all. I don't get caught up cultivating those kinds of personal opinions. I just have a hard time understanding why someone who has developed their spirit to such a high degree would engage in anything less than a straightforward representation of their practices, lineages, etc. Why bother with marketing angles? It would seem like, from a teacher's perspective, that would attract the kind of people that you wouldn't want in the first place! ?!?

 

I have read that Kan is rather adept and Sifu Matsuo also has quite a reputation for being accomplished. So the fact that he can teach his art to these people speaks for itself. I am sure they are not the only ones among his students who are accomplished. And there is a big difference between being energetically accomplished and spiritually accomplished, they are related, but totally different things!

 

So take it easy on those questions you bums, I have a right to question Max or anyone else in a respectful straightforward way. He is not above scrutiny, as i said before. I know you love him, but that doesn't mean it is against the Law to say "i wonder why he did that". So before you get all upset about my questioning his methods or motives just take a deep breath and remind yourself of the benefits of critical thinking. Thank you. I am not interested in getting personal with anyone, just to discuss this interesting phenomenon from a logical point of view.

[Birch]

I have a "thing" about logic these days. I think i might be "logic-handicapped" (need to address that one) but what I have noticed is how "rational" all this has seemingly gotten. No more crazy talk of lizards?Now it's about logical truth all of a sudden?

Are teachers now required to put a disclaimer about their origins and abilities or get a teacher's certificate??? Sloppy, i understand your school model but to me that seems just slightly more rigid than i think i'd like a "spiritual" teacher to be (maybe a sign i should go there hahahaha) Has it all gone the "certified yoga teacher route"? Is it just a pyramid scheme? If i see another teacher website with "store" as a menu item i may (don't want to do an unfortunate invocation here:-)) hurl.

I felt myself unhappy that 5et was basically telling us how "unsuccessful" he was financially with his teachings.

While at the same time we've got megachurches, Deepak Chopra, Wayne Dyer et al. I mentioned Joey Yapp to someone the other day.

I think we've had a version of this conversation before and i don't know where I'm going with it but "something's up" as they say.

 

Edited: I don't mean Sloppy's post above (that would bring the linear logic monster alive:-)). It was a comment i saw him make in the other 5et thread.

I guess this is where my logic problem is! (Sorry, i think i might have found it:-))

Edited October 19, 2011 by -K-

[Sloppy Zhang]

I have a "thing" about logic these days. I think i might be "logic-handicapped"

 

It all depends on how you define "logic" and "rationality"

 

My economics professor, on the first day, was talking about the inherent assumptions that economics makes, one of which being that people are "rational". I said that different people have different criteria for "rational". He said "and there's the problem".

 

I suck at playing chess, so when I play chess, I play to have fun. When I play against someone who is good at chess, they are baffled by my moves. They say I am not making "rational" decisions with how to move my pieces. I tell them that I am doing exactly what I need to do to accomplish my objective- the problem is that my objective is not his own!

 

So watch out for different "kinds" of "logic" and "rationality", and don't assume that just because you aren't going by a mathematical/textbook model, that you aren't being logical/rational in your own right.

 

Are teachers now required to put a disclaimer about their origins and abilities or get a teacher's certificate??? Sloppy, i understand your school model but to me that seems just slightly more rigid than i think i'd like a "spiritual" teacher to be (maybe a sign i should go there hahahaha) Has it all gone the "certified yoga teacher route"? Is it just a pyramid scheme? If i see another teacher website with "store" as a menu item i may (don't want to do an unfortunate invocation here:-)) hurl.

 

No one is "required" to do anything. Having a certificate, being part of a lineage, having the blessing of a teacher to teach, etc, are just one of many ways that people come to decide how they want to interact with a system- practice it, respect it from afar, ignore it, attack it, etc etc etc etc.

 

There is some value to lineage. There is some value to knowing what someone knows, and knowing that that person has been "approved" to teach. If someone was such great friends with their teacher and was such a great student, why does that teacher not contact or acknowledge that person's school for students who wish to learn more? If someone was such great friends with someone that they learned something from, why do they not talk about them publicly or in print?

 

I think these are questions that are raised and answered by having/not having lineages.

 

But again, it's just one facet.

 

I've said time and time again that I'm all about the goods. If you've got it, you've got it. There's no need to hide behind some lineage or a story. If you made it up in your back yard, there's no shame in saying that provided you can do what you say you can do.

 

The thing for me is that I like to include as much information as possible when I am involved with something. If my teacher has the goods, do I care if they made it up in their back yard? No. But if I found out that he's been telling people that he learned it from some monk in the Tibetan mountains... well, I might question why that teacher has been doing that, and that knowledge may augment my impression of the teacher.

 

Does it impact the quality of the teachings and stuff? Mmmm, maybe yes, maybe no, if you believe that honesty is part of development and if you believe that that teaching is supposed to increase your development

 

The point is, rarely ever is one thing the only "nail in the coffin" when it comes to "judging" a teacher or a teaching (for some grim, un-cultivated, judgmental humor)

 

I felt myself unhappy that 5et was basically telling us how "unsuccessful" he was financially with his teachings.

 

It's an unhappy situation, and there are a lot of different ways to think about it, I guess.

 

I heard once upon a time that it was not considered respectable for martial artists to make money from their teachings. The implication there being that teachings can't be "bought", and that they should only be conferred upon those worthy. So many times teachers had "day jobs", and their students also had "day jobs", but at night, in the privacy of their own homes or wherever they could, they'd practice.

 

But then at the same time, many a martial artist was sponsored by the government to teach soldiers So who's to say what about anything.

 

But these days it's an issue that can go lots of different ways. Because to get really good at, say, martial arts, it really help to go full time. And you are providing a service that people are willing to pay for because they see value in it, so they pay money. And that's the foundation of capitalism, which is the foundation of the society in which we live. So who knows

Edited October 19, 2011 by Sloppy Zhang

[Bubbles]

Hi Sloppy Zhang,

 

For how long have been practicing with B.K.Frantzis's material and what are the benefits you get from it- given that it is said to be low energy range material?

 

Thanks

[Sloppy Zhang]

Hi Sloppy Zhang,

 

For how long have been practicing with B.K.Frantzis's material and what are the benefits you get from it- given that it is said to be low energy range material?

 

Thanks

 

Going on it for 6 years now. Mostly just the material from "Opening the Energy Gates Of Your Body", "Relaxing Into Your Being" and "The Great Stillness". I think, even if you just practice that material, you can get very far. In Energy Gates, he says that masters can open their energy gates like you open and close your eyes, and that masters can feel and open/close the energy gates of other people. For me, that has always been the standard that I want to attain. The practice is all laid down it the book, all you have to do is do it.

 

Over the years, I've dabbled with the occasional shiny new toy (usually practices that are higher energy), but in times of panic or crisis, I always fall back on Frantzis' stuff. I recall something that someone said (the Ronnietsu al salaami guy, but I may be mistaken) about choosing a practice "imagine you were going to die tomorrow. What practice would you do? Do that one." If I knew I was going to die tomorrow, I'd do the practices laid out in those books.

 

I also think that Frantzis leaves lots of hints in the writing. Maybe I'm just making that up and seeing what I want to see but that's why I think that the material in those books is very comprehensive. I also think it's pretty typical as far as the whole teaching scheme goes- you know the practice, you just have to do it, and that's why it's so easy to fail, or why it seems like you need to do something more.

 

As far as benefits- better health, clearer mind, sense of inner peace, yadda yadda. It is very much the philosophy of the Tao Te Ching put into practice. Very much so. I have also applied the principles taught in Energy Gates to other physical disciplines like ball sports, marksmanship, and pen spinning skills. People look at me and say I'm a natural or that I catch on quick. I'm just relaxing and going with the flow

 

 

Pretty much, do the practice, and trust that it will take you into things. Frantzis doesn't promise high energy or super mystical powers. And despite being a person who claims to want to find super high energy magic power granting practices, the only practice I really choose to do is one that doesn't promise any of that (and in fact says if you want that then don't do this practice) silly me!

[Bubbles]

And despite being a person who claims to want to find super high energy magic power granting practices, the only practice I really choose to do is one that doesn't promise any of that (and in fact says if you want that then don't do this practice) silly me!

 

Well, at some point gut instinct and common sense chime in as good safeguards.This is not being silly. When needed, you know what to do to return to your self and this is not by having "super high energy magic power granting practices".

[Sloppy Zhang]

Well, at some point gut instinct and common sense chime in as good safeguards.This is not being silly. When needed, you know what to do to return to your self and this is not by having "super high energy magic power granting practices".

 

Maybe so. Thanks for your kind words!

[konchog uma]

Sifu Jenny was in my dream last night, she was teaching me how to transplant orchids without killing them! Good omens.

[fiveelementtao]

Something I should have addressed earlier...

Just my opinion.

Max has authorized me to relay the following message concerning Scotty's remarks in this thread:

 

" I (Max Christensen) did not authorize his (Scotty) speaking on my (Max's ) behalf... Tell the Taobums that I (Max) said that you did not take any method from me."

 

(based on my communications with Max, I take this to mean that this includes any all statements concerning any "opinions" about myself (Mike), Max and any other teacher, including any unverified opinions about the history and sources of any practices of said teachers.)

[suninmyeyes]

Sifu Jenny was in my dream last night, she was teaching me how to transplant orchids without killing them! Good omens.

Nice dream! Yes good omen.