Qi Condensing

[TaoIsTruth]

I do reverse breathing exercise. Most of the time when doing this practice I can feel the heat sensation inside the stomach and around dantien area.

 

But there are times when the heat isn't inside but the heat which I believe to be the Yang Qi goes out around my body and I can even feel it on my hands. I can even switch it on / off. When the stomach expands I can sense it on my both hands, when the stomach contracts the qi stops.

 

I don't want this to happen, because my goal is to charge the dantien, I don't want the qi to disperse into air.

 

Can someone please guide me on condensing the qi, so that it doesn't go out to the air...

 

The posture of my exercise is shown below, except I sit in full lotus position with left leg on the inside.

 

Thanks...

[Trunk]

Have you tried a torniquet? *joking*

 

Jing is the root of yin & yang for the whole body. Circulation is part of it. You can't completely seal off a section of the body and "just work on that".

[TaoIsTruth]

Have you tried a torniquet? *joking*

 

Jing is the root of yin & yang for the whole body. Circulation is part of it. You can't completely seal off a section of the body and "just work on that".

 

Hm... So I should be willing to let go some of the portion to flow away ? Yes, I think I shouldn't be too obsessed with this condensing idea...

[Trunk]

Hm... So I should be willing to let go some of the portion to flow away ? Yes, ...

Correct.

 

As "the deep-center" (aka, "the mysterious pass" etc) clarifies and harmonizes it does provide a gravity that allows the tan tien to build more, sustain more, hold & harmonize more. But it can't be rushed nor forced. And you still can't disconnect one part from the rest... there is a balance concentration ~ circulation.

[Trunk]

A couple more things:

 

~~~ moderation on ~~~

1. If you want to post a general topic/question, you should post in the general discussion area - you'll get much more response there. I'm a moderator, I can move this thread there if you want (?). The "Personal Practice Discussion" area is used pretty much exclusively for people's personal practice sub-forums. It's not like there's a law against posting here; it's just that no one looks here.

~~~ moderation off ~~~

 

2. re: your ? and the practice, just to show an opposite way. Sifu Matsuo (DSG) has a dvd called "Kwan Yin Magnetic Qigong" that uses hand movements and energetics in order to assist central channel and centers development. So, it uses the extremities in order to assist the center. My experience is that the channels in the arms and legs help to harmonize energies which results in more balanced and healthy centers. The body is integral.

 

This is not to say that concentrating in the center isn't a good and important practice principle, even a critical one to get to Deeper development, and still it is part of an integral thingamajig.

 

cheers,

Trunk

[TaoIsTruth]

Thank you for your full of insight answer...

 

I'm checking the link you gave me...

 

Please move the thread to the most appropriate place Btw just let me know where the thread is moved so that I'll be able to go there...

 

Btw how important is movement in meditation ?

 

I know there are 4 factors that play great roles in qi manipulation :

Mind

Breath

Eyes

Movement

 

But what role does movement play in qi manipulation ? Does it help in directing qi ?

 

Must I direct qi manually or just let it flows ?

 

Because All I do right now is still breathing exercise and still meditation.

[Trunk]

~~~ TTBs Moderation ~~~

 

Please move the thread to the most appropriate place Btw just let me know where the thread is moved so that I'll be able to go there...

I've moved this thread to the main "Taoist Discussion" section (where - by far - most talk occurs on TTBs) and left a link for you in the original location.

 

Hopefully in this new spot others will chime in with answers to your above questions.

 

- Trunk

 

~~~ / Mod Squad ~~~

[Informer]

Condensing and cultivating are seperate.

 

You fill the Dan Tien before you condense it to make room to put more.

 

There are more ways than one to get yang to go to the dan tien.

 

It can be directed there directly down the spine, or directed there through the hands.

 

Which concentration of chi are you putting there?

 

If you feel the fire below the navel in your Dan Tien, then it is working in that aspect.

 

There is the celestial chi that may also go there. If you want to be able to tell your progress, you can put your right hand over the dan tien, (palm facing it) and feel how strongly your hand is repelled, you can use the left hand in the same manner and see how it is attracted or pulled towards the dan tien.

 

It may be in reverse, depends on your body.

 

I personally find the greatest effect for me is to put my right palm directly on my lower stomache, with my left palm on the top of it, thumbs interlaced and touching. Then I call celestial chi from the heaven and direct it there directly down the spine as well as through the hands.

Edited May 18, 2011 by Informer

[Informer]

I have been practicing for maybe 10 years or so. Although not formally.

 

The expansions seems to be very gradual, and actually condensing requires me to split focus between the root and brow chakra, creating a path for jing to travel.

 

I have yet to succeded in cutting its ties completely, although I can coax it anywhere between heart and root.

 

I would ask you the same questions in kind

[Informer]

Thank you for your full of insight answer...

 

I'm checking the link you gave me...

 

Please move the thread to the most appropriate place Btw just let me know where the thread is moved so that I'll be able to go there...

 

Btw how important is movement in meditation ?

 

I know there are 4 factors that play great roles in qi manipulation :

Mind

Breath

Eyes

Movement

 

But what role does movement play in qi manipulation ? Does it help in directing qi ?

 

Must I direct qi manually or just let it flows ?

 

Because All I do right now is still breathing exercise and still meditation.

 

The reason lotus is prescribed is to prevent chi from traveling down and out your legs. Not everyone can direct the chi, if you can, then I think you would progress faster, as well being able to cultivate while standing or sitting in a chair.

 

Movement and how it does help is not fully understood by me, I have found it beneficial, and it may have something to due with increased sensitivity to the energy of motion aids you.

 

I have a suggestion, put your arms straight out and level, palms facing down, then slowly and meaningfully raise your palms so that they are facing away from you, until you can feel a sort of tension in your finger-tips. Then attempt to hold that very tension in your fingertips as you move your arms around.

 

Once you feel tension in all over your fingertips, then try to feel it in your palms. Every movement that you make should be with the tension, if the tension goes away, then that isn't the proper movement.

[growant]

If you go to www.chikung.com you can find articles and videos (under media) that teach you how to do condensing breathing for free

[Informer]

If you go to www.chikung.com you can find articles and videos (under media) that teach you how to do condensing breathing for free

 

http://www.chikung.com/jing/

 

"This is the only place in the world where you can learn this INTERNAL material. Are you serious enough for the good stuff? Just decide and start!"

 

??????????????????

 

Where is the free video?

Edited May 18, 2011 by Informer

[growant]

http://www.chikung.com/media/videos/

 

Scroll down to the bottom of the page to CK 1 and CK2. Curious, whats the name of the chiking you practice Informer that you describe above?

Edited May 19, 2011 by growant

[TaoIsTruth]

Condensing and cultivating are seperate.

 

You fill the Dan Tien before you condense it to make room to put more.

 

There are more ways than one to get yang to go to the dan tien.

 

It can be directed there directly down the spine, or directed there through the hands.

 

Which concentration of chi are you putting there?

 

If you feel the fire below the navel in your Dan Tien, then it is working in that aspect.

 

There is the celestial chi that may also go there. If you want to be able to tell your progress, you can put your right hand over the dan tien, (palm facing it) and feel how strongly your hand is repelled, you can use the left hand in the same manner and see how it is attracted or pulled towards the dan tien.

 

It may be in reverse, depends on your body.

 

I personally find the greatest effect for me is to put my right palm directly on my lower stomache, with my left palm on the top of it, thumbs interlaced and touching. Then I call celestial chi from the heaven and direct it there directly down the spine as well as through the hands.

 

When I exhale, I feel warm sensation goes down to the lower stomach. There are two ways the sensation goes down:

1. Front lower stomach. This happens when I inhale and concentrate on the front body (below solar plexus), it feels like pulling up some muscles around lower belly.

 

2. Inside stomach. This happens when I inhale and concentrate inside the body, It feels like I pull up muscles inside the lower belly around the spine.

 

Perhaps I don't explain it very clear, because I don't have good knowledge in body anatomy. And what I do is partly intuitive.

 

When I put my right palm facing on the lower abdomen, I can feel the energy (softly) pushing my hand during exhale and pulling it during inhale, the power gets bigger when I concentrate.

 

Btw How do I know that the dantien is already full and ready to be condensed ?

[Friend]

Edited November 16, 2011 by Friend

[Spectrum]

Condensation breathing is the primAry breath in my Wei Dan practice.

 

Inhale silent Hen tongue flaps to roof mouth fill lungs slowly bottom to top

exhale aspirated Haa tongue opens completely empty lower Dan tien

inhale/relax lower abdomen/ silent hen silmutaneously

 

this creates a vacuum pump by completely relaxing the trunk at the onset of the inhale (the relaxation of the compression doing the work) and also completely relaxing at the peak of the inhale the work being down by the compression of the expanded upper cavity. This way the tongue alone acts as the active bridge for circulation unnessecary tension being isolated to the single movement of the tongue and accomplishing the maximum cardio pulminary effect.

 

I was taught this as the primary breathing method for

cultivation in a variety of static and moving forms. It was called Condensation breathing and can also be performed in reverse for a tonic effect.

[TaoIsTruth]

Tell us more about your insights on the Mind, Breath and Eyes.

 

I have more questions than answers..

 

All I know from experience, By looking at the Dantien at the start phase of breathing exercise, help me focus and activate the qi.

 

Btw, there are days when I lose the feeling of qi, on that day all I do is testing several times, If I have no qi feeling at all, I'll skip the practice to the next day.

 

Usually when I test several times at different times in a day, I usually successfully sense the qi again, that's when I resume the breathing exercise.

 

I don't know why the qi sometimes disappear I just learn to let go...

[Friend]

Edited November 16, 2011 by Friend

[Informer]

"Btw How do I know that the dantien is already full and ready to be condensed ? "

 

You will know

 

I guess your breathing is a bit different than how I do, when I work with the fire, I hold it there regardless on inhale or exhale. As you said intuitive, is mostly how I worked as well. So do what feels ok for you or as your master instructs.

 

If you can't put more in your dan tien then . . .

 

Also a master can tell you how far along you are (in person), not that it will make much difference in knowing.

[Informer]

Thanks, Informer.

 

My formal energy cultivation started one year ago with Michael Lomax's stillness-movement qi projection. Embryonic breathing state unfolded shortly after starting s-m, then slowly grew into a measurable and profound expansion/dissolving of ldt. The condensed qi has been circulating/expanding over the past few months.

 

I connect to the heavenly qi to enter my ba hui, ldt & all my cells, as ML (TTB handle: Ya Mu) teaches. The hand positions are also the same as you describe. My focus is gently at the center of ldt and then silencing of all thoughts (my biggest challenge ).

 

 

A side note, RE: http://www.chikung.com/jing/

 

The author's use of the phrase 'wimpy chi kung' at the above site reminds me of banned TTBum Starjumper7. Wonder if those two are 'brothers in TAO.'

 

Cool, is that similar to kundalini awakening? Did you do anything similar to recogonize the centers?

 

My path began with kundalini and has progressed to here by intuition and some reading.

 

Mostly intuition and sometimes spirits teach me now.

 

Have you ever tried to hold the fire in your Dan Tien, then call celestial chi at same time?

 

It is takes some practice to get the fire to stay. I put it there and do an inner smile, then start calling the heavenly chi. The fire will beging to creep, so you push it back down and resume. After a while I learned to keep both going.

[TaoIsTruth]

Friend, Informer, and Rainbow Vein, thanks for your advice. Btw I don't have a teacher to tell my progress. I'm learning most of them from many sources like taoist breathing, meditations and my own explorations.

 

My only alert system that I set is I won't force things to work. I need to be patient, letting go, and try again

 

Btw Friend, you suggest me to learn to sink qi. Does the Zhan Zhuang exercise serve this purpose? I found the link on youtube :

 

What surprises me is when I watched this movie I realized that I actually discovered such exercise on my own. There were times after breathing exercise the front of my body generated heat,from chest to stomach. It feels like ball of heat, so I stand intuitively in Zhan Zhuang position, and it feels good, calm, and I can sense the heat clearer. These things happened recently. So if this is good to sink qi, I plan to do it regularly.

 

My question is must I do the Zhan Zhuang after or before breathing exercise?

[Friend]

Edited November 16, 2011 by Friend

[ChiDragon]

Thank you for your full of insight answer...

 

I'm checking the link you gave me...

 

Please move the thread to the most appropriate place Btw just let me know where the thread is moved so that I'll be able to go there...

 

Btw how important is movement in meditation ?

 

I know there are 4 factors that play great roles in qi manipulation :

Mind

Breath

Eyes

Movement

 

But what role does movement play in qi manipulation ? Does it help in directing qi ?

 

Must I direct qi manually or just let it flows ?

 

Because All I do right now is still breathing exercise and still meditation.

 

If you are doing isotonic Chi Kung, you are involving with you mind, breath, eyes and movement.

 

1. Your mind helps to control your body movements.

2. You eyes follow your movement of the arms will increase your concentration and help your mind to control the arms to move to different positions.

3. Breathing is helping to generate the inner chi, body strength, within the body.

4. The movements will build up your muscle tone and transform your muscles to be stronger and to have faster reflex.

Edited June 3, 2011 by ChiDragon