Commercialized Buddhism?

[Birdoftruth]

Hi I went to this Buddhist Temple that I always wondered about because it looked very nice and the only one close to me. So I figured I would go in and meditate (possibly making it a normal habit to meditate there) and if nothing else it would be very interesting to see. Upon entry in the temple a lady wanted to give me some sort of piggy bank that I was to bring back with money inside of it. I told her no, yet she was very forceful and I had to tell her 3 times no. I enquired about their meditation practice but she didn't understand what kind of meditation practice they taught (it was only every other Wednesday) much less know what Vipassana was. She brings me into this tea shop area which was very nice but she tried to sell me some books when we went in there of this head guy of Humanistic Buddhism and what he taught. She did take me into this memorial hall that had some soothing chant in the background that plays 24/7 because it brings good tidings to the souls around. The room was amazingly peaceful. Towards the end of my tour she handed me approximately 7 pamphlets and tried to get me to sign up for their intro buddhist discussion class that was being held that night. I told her I just wanted to meditate in the hall. She allowed me to go in and do such and I gotta say it was a pretty powerful meditation. Very concentrative. But then the ladies started being very loud and it was quite disturbing (even though there was one other family in there with me sitting down).

 

I guess I just went in as an uncarved block open to whatever because I've never been in a temple before and I came out with a bad taste in my mouth. I feel like it was very commercialized. I later found out the temple took $5 million to build. Has anyone else had an experience like this or am I being unreasonable.

Edited June 25, 2010 by Birdoftruth

[Sunya]

Unfortunately we are in the land of samsara and nothing is immune to its negative forces.

Sorry to hear you had a bad experience. Is that the only center in town?

[Martial Development]

Who is responsible for building temples for you to meditate in? I understand you don't want to pay, but who exactly do you expect to pay instead?

[Guest paul walter]

Has anyone else had an experience like this or am I being unreasonable.

 

 

No, Bird, unfortunately you're not being unreasonable. The day after that guy Gautama Buddha died they started making a living out of him/his message. Has to be that way unfortunately or else he would have been wrong about the message he tried to give to people (that is, that the merely human world is a corrupt dead end). Don't let others change what you learnt that day, and remember a tree was good enough for that guy to call home for a while. I remember reading how some the Beat generation dudes were shocked when they got to experience the reality of how corrupt Buddhism was when they went east to be closer to what they thought was its home and protector, just like Christianity- old and decrepit after years of neglect and abuse.In strength, Paul.

Edited June 26, 2010 by paul walter

[unmike]

Hi I went to this Buddhist Temple that I always wondered about because it looked very nice and the only one close to me. So I figured I would go in and meditate (possibly making it a normal habit to meditate there) and if nothing else it would be very interesting to see. Upon entry in the temple a lady wanted to give me some sort of piggy bank that I was to bring back with money inside of it. I told her no, yet she was very forceful and I had to tell her 3 times no. I enquired about their meditation practice but she didn't understand what kind of meditation practice they taught (it was only every other Wednesday) much less know what Vipassana was. She brings me into this tea shop area which was very nice but she tried to sell me some books when we went in there of this head guy of Humanistic Buddhism and what he taught. She did take me into this memorial hall that had some soothing chant in the background that plays 24/7 because it brings good tidings to the souls around. The room was amazingly peaceful. Towards the end of my tour she handed me approximately 7 pamphlets and tried to get me to sign up for their intro buddhist discussion class that was being held that night. I told her I just wanted to meditate in the hall. She allowed me to go in and do such and I gotta say it was a pretty powerful meditation. Very concentrative. But then the ladies started being very loud and it was quite disturbing (even though there was one other family in there with me sitting down).

 

I guess I just went in as an uncarved block open to whatever because I've never been in a temple before and I came out with a bad taste in my mouth. I feel like it was very commercialized. I later found out the temple took $5 million to build. Has anyone else had an experience like this or am I being unreasonable.

 

I had a frighteningly similar experience from the SGI center in Santa Monica. Buddhism for the cost of a prayer handout.

[C T]

No disrespect, but often people regard these places as though they were spiritual 'stock exchanges', where they go to invest in the hope of big returns, or maybe just to hedge their spiritual futures, like trying to secure a comfortable after-life, so to speak. Its hilarious. Naturally its big bucks and big business. Its not that these places are essentially corrupt or anything, but from my experience growing up in an Asian country, visiting temples often as part of my mom's tradition (religious Taoism), i got to see lots of greed from people trying to 'bribe' their way to win the gods' favor, which oftentimes took the form of chunky donations of money.

 

To drive the circle of greed even greater, these temples usually have their own Oracles, who would often mediate with the gods after one has made a fair donation, and in return, the donor gets to go away with some 'lucky' numbers given by the gods (thru the medium), which they will then use as combinations in national sweepstakes and/or lotto games. Sometimes someone gets lucky, and spreads the word that such and such a temple has a very powerful Oracle who can bestow winning numbers, and people flock there in droves, hoping to strike it rich. Of course, once someone wins, naturally big donations follow. People would be afraid not to make donations after winning, in case there is some kind of heavenly retribution, or most do it simply for the reputation, just to make a big egotistical show of their generosity to other temple goers, and then there are those who constantly donate, in the hope of winning even more, or for some, winning little but often is great too (those who want to believe they are more 'pure' at heart, convincing themselves they are somehow less greedy than their neighbors who wish for heftier wins, so that makes them sort of more 'okay').

 

Having said this, i do not recall these manners of behavior in the Buddhist temples though. I mean, devotees still make donations, but never with the same kind of zeal as those who frequent the Taoist temples. In the Buddhist temples (the ones i went to belonged to the Thai Forest Tradition), one simply makes a small offering in the donation box often located in some obscure corner of the temple hall, and then stand in line, if one so wishes, to kneel in front of the abbot or senior monk, who then recites prayers and blesses the person with a sprinkle of water, usually with the aid of a stemmed lotus flower.

 

This is what i remember growing up in the sixties back home, but i am sure its still rampant today, perhaps more sophisticated and organized than in years gone by. Oracles with laptops and i-phones maybe? Emails to heaven, anyone?

 

 

 

................

 

Birdoftruth - that lady you tried to get info from? More than likely she would be one of the ushers/caretakers/temple-ground keepers. Asking her about meditation would be like asking the mailroom lads in the NYSE for advise in setting up an investment portfolio... (Not implying they are devoid of investment tips - i know some of them probably has all the 'inside' info and all, but the odds are pretty slim).

 

This article on "The Business of Religion": http://www.banned-books.com/truth-seeker/1995archive/122_3/35business.html

[Gerard]

Hi I went to this Buddhist Temple...

 

I am curious. In which country is this?

 

Thanks.

[Birdoftruth]

I am curious. In which country is this?

 

Thanks.

 

USA, Orlando Florida

 

I appreciate everyone's comments on this thread.

[Gerard]

USA, Orlando Florida...

 

Well I see. Like anything in life there are good places and places one should avoid. What I would liek to say is that I don't have much experience with Western temples, which I avoid like the plague for various reasons. I am not keen of Asian temples either but my experience with them wasn't like that; however I recall two incidents which were not likable as both temples were probably popular in their respective countries with a good afluence of Westerners, which means quite a significant amount of $.

 

But temples, generally speaking, are places that can intensify your spiritual experience as they gather spiritual energy, so I would recommend visiting them. Another thing is human interaction, which maybe more related to the main purpose of this thread.

[styrofoamdog]

CowTao is exactly right about the way many people treat the temples. If you give $$$, you get lots of merit, and merit is always associated with luck and fortune. That's the way many people think, so the temples in China can become very rich. I have a friend who is an important Chinese Buddhist monk, and he drives around in a Mercedes Benz. The master of a temple often has an opulent chamber and is surrounded by rich decorations and beautiful Buddhist art. These people range from the worldly, to the very cultivated. I have yet to meet any master of a temple who is not a very kind and gentle person, though.

 

The temple you visited was part of Humanistic Buddhism, and those places really do rake in the big money. They try to adapt Buddhism to modern standards and conveniences. That is, they are very focused on making Buddhism an affirming and feel-good philosophy for modern living. They don't really care so much about meditation. There was an incident in California where the biggest Humanistic Buddhism temple donated a large sum of money to Al Gore. There was some fallout from that, because it seemed odd that individual monks and nuns would donate thousands of dollars each to a political campaign. One of the nuns fled back to Taiwan when things went south.

 

Fortunately there is a really good Chinese Buddhism and Chan tradition in the U.S. that Hsuan Hua founded, exemplified by City of Ten Thousand Buddhas. They really care about meditation, studying the sutras deeply, and strict adherence to the traditional precepts for monks and nuns. Some of them even go beyond that and take vows of silence. They won't even let people burn incense in the temples, because they think that it is superstitious. The difference basically came from Hsuan Hua, who was very blunt and forceful about his views, eschewing money, comfort, and fame. One person like that can really make a difference in the world.

 

In all, it is really a mixed bag when it comes to Chinese Buddhism. There is ignorance and superstition, and there is amazing dedication and knowledge. It was also like this in the past. Around a hundred years ago, there was the same superstition and greed. However, there were also dedicated practitioners who would go so far as to burn off their fingers as offerings to the Buddha, or to write huge sutras like the Avatamsake Sutra (1600+ pages in English) in their own blood. There are still hermits up in the mountains, and still people who really endeavor in meditation. These people usually associate themselves with Chan, or simply with "Chinese Buddhism."