Daeluin

And really "Great Ancestry" captures something that feels right to me while "Great Antiquity" seems to disconnect from it. While Ancestry is not quite the right word, it might fit if we think of this Ancestry in terms of the full timeline of the relating of the 10,000 things and thereby calling it "old" or "ancient". But it is just a link in the chain from then to now. And given that the next section revolves around lineage and generational dynamics, that this Antiquity prepared us for, Ancestry seems apt.

 

In a sense are are talking about the ancestry of life. I wonder if this would be considered the "FIVE".

On 3/7/2020 at 1:20 PM, dawei said:

The passage here in Gu San Fen has always bothered me because it was not in the same order as Liezi and has much more detail.  As well, it talks of a numbering sequence as: 1>2>4>3.    I could not find this anywhere until I took the 3 as a reference to trigrams.  And what I found may be forced as 1,2,4,8 would really be the expected order (so I think) if one was looking at the trigram cycle:

 

There is a chart in the Qingjing jing that resonates with this ordering.

 

The idea there is that Old Yang ⚊ moves and because movement is also yang we have Tai Yang ⚌. Or Old Yang is still and we have Shao Yin ⚍. And Old Yin ⚋ is still and stillness is yin so we have Tai Yin ⚏. Or Old Yin moves and we have Shao Yang ⚎.

 

Four symbols (formless images) but only two changes.

 

They change again and we have three changes, and now our middles are created, and the four forces are contained within them. ☰ ☱ ☲ ☳ ☴ ☵ ☶ ☷

 

So the san cai, the three powers of heaven, earth and humanity, are really more like heaven, earth, and the fruits of the their exchanging. This resonates as a "Great Antiquity" as well. It would not be the first time Confucian influence emphasized the human role in the web of life at the expense of the totality of the web of life, if that is what is going on here.

 

For TaiYi, I think of a process of changes, of which the emergence of duality was the first. Here you have two different Great Beginnings, but there are two different characters, 始 and 初. Once is more of an inception. The other is more of a birth. I've gone with "Great Inception" and "Great Birth".

 

First there is something, ONE, then the clear and turbid separate and we have heaven and earth, representing the first change, TWO.

 

Then this change expands and becomes 4 in the great birth, and changes again.

 

盈 ying represents a fullness and repletion that I can see the "complete" meaning from, but for me it represents not completing, but expanding, filling even more, to create more. So "expanding change", from one change to two changes, from two changes to three changes.

 

This idea of them changing and changing again is also not quite there IMO. The four forces/symbols are there to represent the corners, the extremities. When yang moves, we have the yang of yang, and nothing is more extreme than this, it is simply the maintaining of that original pure yang potency, and vice versa. The third yang that emerges in the middle is not something new, but was always there. What is new is the yang within the yin, and the yin within the yang, so these changes are related to a centrality becoming formed within what was originally the whole. A new whole within the original whole, and thereby becoming its own elemental force, and all of these elemental forces are inherently linked within the changes of the ten thousand things they represent on behalf of the four forces present within them. So this third change is not really linear, just adding on more changes, but more of a coagulation of two of the four forces meeting in the middle to embody a new dynamic that is distinct. There are 8 distinct elemental forces, but they exist within these three capacities.

 

It is confusing because we are counting different things. With conception we have something and call it ONE. With the first change we have duality and call it TWO. With the second change we have 2x2 and call it FOUR, and with the third change we have 8, but we call it in regards to it being the Third change and how this creates the three capacities. But also, after the second change it says we already have the 10,000 things and this is the Third. So it is hard to say 8 when we already have 10,000. But if we think about it in terms of the four directions and the 3 natural divisions between things.

 

It makes sense to me in terms of the numerics of creation (1-5), as separate from the numerics of completion. The creation sets the 10,000 things up and is a part of the pre-eminence of heaven (xiantian), and the completion involves how they work to complete each other after the 10,000 things are created under heaven (houtian). Thus the 3 are part of the creation, and the 8 are part of the completion.

 

Here is my working translation of this section. This year I found that with the Pleco app and Kroll's addon dictionary it is very easy to render my own translations as I already have a sense of the material and it is presented in formulas, albeit grammar is tricky and I'm still working on it. Also it seems to bear mentioning for others that the section right after this continues on to describe the three capacities/powers from the perspective of human relations and ancestry. But it is rather challenging to make sense of.

 

清氣未升，濁氣未沉，遊神未靈，五色未分。

 

Clear Qi not yet rising,
Unclear Qi not yet sinking,
Wandering Shen not yet divine,
The Five Hues not yet divided.

 

中有其物，冥冥而性存，謂之混沌。

 

Inside having these phenomena,
Darkness upon darkness and then one's fundamental nature (Xing) remains,
We name this the identity-less mixing (Hun Dun).

 

混沌為太始。

 

Hun Dun carries out the Great Inception.

 

太始者、元胎之萌也，太始之數一，一為太極，太極者、天地之父母也。

 

As for the Great Inception,
It is due to the sprouts and new beginnings of this preeminent womb,
The Great Inception's numeric is ONE,
ONE carries out the Great Absolute (Tai Ji),
As for Tai ji,
It is due to being the father and mother of Heaven and Earth.

 

一極易，天高明而清，地博厚而濁，謂之太易。

 

ONE is the extremity of Change,
Heaven is raised up and luminous and therefore clear,
Earth is widespread and substantive and therefore unclear,
We call this the Great Change.

 

太易者、天地之變也，太易之數二，二為兩儀，兩儀者、陰陽之形也，謂之太初。

 

As for the Great Change,
It is due to the active permuting of Heaven and Earth,
Great Change's numeric is TWO,
TWO carries out duality,
As for duality,
It is due to the manifested forms of yin and yang,
We call this Great Birth.

 

太初者、天地之交也，太初之數四，四盈易，四象變而成萬物，謂之太素。

 

As for Great Birth,
It is due to the reciprocal intertwining and exchanging of Heaven and Earth,
The Great Birth's numeric is FOUR,
FOUR expands Changing,
The four formless images actively permute and then accomplish the 10,000 things (Wan Wu / Myriad Phenomena),
We call this the Great Simplicity.

 

太素者、三才之始也，太素之數三，三盈易，天地孕而生男女，謂之三才。

 

As for the Great Simplicity,
It is due to the Inception of the Three Capacities,
The Great Simplicity's numeric is THREE,
THREE expands Changing,
Heaven and Earth are pregnant and then create men and women,
We call this the "Three Capacities."

 

三才者、天地之備也，遊神動而靈，故飛走潛化，動植蟲魚之類必備於天地之間，謂之太古。

 

As for the Three Capacities,
It is due to the preparations of Heaven and Earth,
Wandering Shen is set into motion and then is divine,
For this reason sky-high running transforms unnoticed,
Stimulating activity in plants and insects and fish and so on invariably preparing with regard to the space between Heaven and Earth,
We call this the Great Antiquity.

12 hours ago, 鞏三孝 said:

None of my teachers use this book. Furthermore, every time I see some light or Qi because of my cultivation, the teacher will advise me to ignore it. According to them, those phenomena are not the point.

 

Excellent, this all clears up that bit of curiosity. Thank you.

I don't recall in great detail, but Wang Liping's instruction manual uses a certain technique to essentially look to the horizon and draw it back, send it out, via the third eye. Ling Bao Tong Zhi Neng Nei Gong Shu has this practice, I'm not sure if Internal Daoist Mastery has it - if it does, I would use that one, as its material is presented in a very clear way.

 

The other intention behind it was to filter the events of one's day by using shen and the third eye, processing out the mundane and refining and cleansing the activities of the thinking mind to reconnect with the original spirit.

 

So from that perspective it might simply be that this light / original spirit is unable to return, but it wants to, even though it is not safe (not compatible). So that is why it must first be sent away, or ignored, and then there are other techniques and ways that the original spirit can find its way within again. Simply turning the attention of the mind inward and using the third eye is the main part of the Secret of the Golden Flower practice. In class we bring the focus from there down toward the lower dan tien throughout all the work. Though I was able to have these experiences without fully being able to develop my lower dan tien, or my ren mai or my du mai.

 

My own practice was simply Chen Style Silk Reeling Qi gong, with some standing and brief sitting. All of the movement keeps the meridians open and the qi refined (if one is rooted to heaven and earth), and zhan zhuang is very powerful for emptiness and building yuan qi. Sitting with hands together in a prayer posture, palms flat, is very good for stilling the energy that has developed, much like hexagram 26. However few students in my school were willing to let their minds be empty.

On 6/19/2022 at 11:06 PM, 鞏三孝 said:

So, if there is no fate with that book, there are still other other roads that can be traveled.

 

I suppose that has been a question that has come up for me before. I resonate with my teacher's work, and Wang Liping's work, and they both, along with Taoist Yoga, seem to follow more of the Secret of the Golden FLower path.

 

But even though I had previously seen the ball of light in front of my eyes, my ren mai was still blocked and I still had trouble with that method I think. So what opened for me was more in relation to a water path than a fire path.

And that's what allowed me to connect with this video so well, for it described what I experienced exactly, and was much different from this idea of using the 3rd eye and the ball of light, which was not mentioned.

So I think I might be following a path that could possibly come to understand both, and others too, but I will need to tread carefully.

I stumbled onto this thread, and then found this:

 

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6. If enough yuan-chi is cultivated so that it can ascend to the head, it can (when enough have accumulated) lead to the emergence of the mysterious gate. It is also known as the White Moon on the Mountain Peak. If you practice diligently, you will eventually get to that point. When that happens, you will “hold the center to realize the oneness of heaven and earth”. The oneness of heaven and earth is achieved by the turning of the gaze inwards (similarly as when fixing spirit in its original cavity) so that you can see the light of the mysterious gate (but it should appear in front of you and not just inside your head). This generally happens after you have passed through all of the aforementioned phases in a meditation session. When this happens, you will eventually get the light to appear in front of you. It will need to move away from you once before you can gather it (otherwise it will cause pain in your head) but, when you draw it into your head, you will strengthen the energy of the positive spirit. It will then be dropped to the solar plexus. You could read chapter 7 of Taoist Yoga for more information.

 

This sounds like what I did - cultivation of enough yuan qi so that it could ascend to the head.

I suppose this is what I am trying to explain, by my 'two weeks'. For much more than two weeks I had been doing regular practice, but it was the innocence of these two weeks that allowed the fullness of the yuan qi to develop without being conditioned, that allowed my experience.

It seems I am back to the books, as I have ALSO had the experience of seeing the light in front of my third eye, quite potent, without really knowing what to do about that.

I know my Sifu studied from Taoist Yoga. Maybe I will find some more clarity there.

 

20 hours ago, 鞏三孝 said:

I'm not qualified to judge, but it does sound like hsuan kuan was active and your body has a series of reactions as a result.

 

Neither am I, but I am inclined to agree. The video was helpful in confirming this. For when it mentioned that the energy refines itself, that was precisely my experience. Whether or not I did anything specific, I could simply tune in and be aware of this mysterious energy moving through my meridians. It never stopped, all those months. And it didn't just shut off one day, but gradually it waned as I ceased to have room for its flow.

Sometimes people will admonish with - this energy cannot be felt. I don't know if I am qualified to speak to that. However, what it felt like was as though I was able to sense something moving through me, up and down just like meridians, but it could not be located or felt or pinned down in any way. And if I were to attempt to name the trajectories through which it flowed, I would be unable to do so. It was nothing like the sensation of houtian qi in the meridians. And yet, it was unmistakably present. And its presence held me connected to the mystery in some way.

I did reach out to my Sifu this week and told him I had finally digested my experience in class opening the mysterious gate, and had come to understand the principles behind my house and the other house, thanked him for his patience with all of us, and asked if I could take privates with his assistant to work toward returning to class. It took me 10 years to come to this point since that experience. He usually does not respond with anything but two emojis, but this time he thanked me and confirmed I could reach out for lessons. And I now have some lined up. I am not intending to go back because I feel I need the school to experience this again. But because I realized that he had hinted that he had more to teach those who could get to that point and make use of the mysterious gate.

 

Thank you for your cautions about having desire, or attempting to recreate the practice. I think these are so important to be emphasized for others to understand.

I am under no illusions however, and I have found great clarity on how this works. This is why I shared:

 

On 6/14/2022 at 8:08 PM, Daeluin said:

I can well comprehend now how the Xuan Guan might open in different ways in different locations, nurtured by different practices and techniques, for it is simply a matter of where the energy is able to come together and reach through to the xiantian realm when the conditions are ripe.

 

As it says in the first chapter of the daodejing, if we hold to desire, we cannot enter the mystery.

This is also why I shared in detail about how important the emptiness I cultivated for 2 solid weeks before having this experience was. For me this emptiness came not from meditation, but from finding a way to barely use my mind in in that time, such that the qi was able to develop from my patient training without 'me' getting in the way.

Undoubtedly it will take longer than some weeks or months, for me to accomplish this again. I have not even been cultivating. And even when I had this experience, I had been training for some time. Perhaps a way of describing it was that I had surrendered to the path, enough that I was able to merge with the universe when the timing was right, after consistent practice. I recall that during work I would often take breaks to go do taijiquan in my front yard for 10 minutes. So I was constantly de-conditioning my mind and re-aligning my qi. But even then, I sense that at some level the class setting amplified things, standing in a room surrounded by others doing the same work, in the presence of a master, no matter how hands off.

I also well understand that the timings of the celestial mechanism are ever changing, and such things may not ever be forced. And I am a different person now. I would not do to expect it to open in the same place in the same way, during the same practices. It will open when and where it is ready to open.

And yet, I do feel that this experience I had will allow it to be much easier this time. There is no desire that would help this, but there is benefit of understanding how the conditions formed, and those conditions may be recreated. Pure innocence is a key ingredient - I suppose that is part of the beginner's mind, and yet it is also a joy to cultivate innocence for its own sake. And as Liu Yiming said, at its heart it simply simply comes down to Yin and Yang. The yin part of this is clear, and the yang comes from the other house. Having experienced this, and recognizing the principle, it all becomes simple. I suppose that is ever the way with these things. The words are puzzles until we cross the threshold, and then they simply speak clearly.

It feels good to be walking a cultivation path again.

 

And in an odd turn of events I was told I needed to find a new home, and that there was one opening in a nice home in the mountains, shared with a vedic cultivator. It isn't confirmed yet but is dripping with signs. So perhaps in lieu of class I can benefit from the mountain qi for this next stage - one of returning to innocence.

But of course, only time will tell.

One last thing I would like to add here. I cannot overstate the importance of ming work.

I do not feel I am deserving of opening the mysterious gate again simply for selfish reasons, or for any reasons - but if there is a potential there perhaps it relates to having finally found my path of destiny on the earth, and working hard to follow where it leads. I am not seeking transcension or ascension, and I highly doubt I will be interested in shedding my shell if I accomplish something. To me the work is one of anchoring the higher realms to this realm, and that to me is the answer to this realm's increasing corruption. That is the answer to the expanding of the universe. For such a path, perhaps the mysterious gate could do good work.

This relates to the chapter of the daodejing I quoted.

Thank you for your gift, and I am glad I found it when I did.

Yay! I finished the video, and would like to share my reflections and experiences with the Xuan Guan concept.

 

This is the first of these videos on Xiu Dao I have seen, and I am quite impressed with the clarity offered here. I would like to share some of what I found especially resonant:

 

Quote

Xuan Guan is the fine line between practicing with intention and practicing without intention.

 

I feel like this is easily overlooked, but incredibly important. This was the key to the experience I had. That leads into:

 

Quote

Xuan guan is from the emptiness.

 

The experience I had was in class with my Sifu - but the most important part is that I had spend 2 weeks of continually just going through the motions of life and work and training without allowing my thinking mind to have control.

In our modern busy lives I think many people can really fail to comprehend how much activity goes on in our minds, and how it might take more than just 30 minutes a day to find the space for the energy to quiet.

I worked 5 hours a day on the computer, four days a week... but at work during that time I was really just going through the motions and not very actively engaged. Otherwise all I really did was walk 30 minutes to a 90 minute class twice a week, and did an hour or so of training in the morning, an hour in the evening, and did tai chi here and there throughout my day.

Obviously I am a mental person and so perhaps it took a bit more space for me to create to get beyond the control of the mind. I didn't really do lengthy (30m+) meditations then.

In class around that time I remember my Sifu mentioned to the class that I should not be taken for granted - I basically felt like the entire back of my spine from head to toe was empty and full of water/marrow and able to conduct the qi. However, to me he mentioned that it wasn't enough to be empty, but that I needed to work with spirit as well. I think that to some in the class, it was clear that I wasn't doing energy work like they were doing.

At the time my front channels were blocked, though I did not know it, and I ended up leaving school and doing a lot of healing work, changing my career and finding my path to fit in with my destiny in this world. After all, our Ren Mai represents our relationship with the world. During these past years I have hardly cultivated, but the rewards of discovering how to follow my thread of destiny I believe are worthwhile as well. I now feel connected and merged with a course that has the potential such that as I grow, so does everything around me. Of course that is always the case, but this is different to me.

 

But in any case, at the time I felt like an empty vessel, able to be filled. "I" had gotten out of the way.

 

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Xuan Guan is the bridge connecting Xing and Ming in Xiu Dao practice. One may find it difficult to directly work on Xing and Ming  in practice since they are fundamental concepts. So focusing on Xuan Guan practice and entering the state of Xuan Guan becomes a key step in making real progress in Xiu Dao practice.

 

I found this to be very clarifying.

 

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After Xuan Guan opens then there is no difference between internal and external, since the energy manages the practice of refining itself. Also, the great medicine will be generated when Xuan Guan emerges.

So, the key principle is to wait for the mystery gate to emerge, and then let the primordial (xiantian) energy work naturally.

 

This is incredibly resonant with the experience I had.

So basically I was in a school of tai ji, where we did standing moving and sitting. Our teacher is western and humble and does not project himself onto the destiny of his students, or take indoor students. On the other hand, he will reward students on the threshold of making progress with a word or half a sentence in key moments that help people navigate transitions. In this way I learned much from him, as he is able to follow his own path without attachment, while still allowing himself to be present for those who do the work. He is very much in the world but not of it. There is little curriculum other than the movement work and various principles like turning the light around and focusing on the lower dan tien.

In the curriculum, there was a standing meditation sequence that I resonated with very much, which was simply called Pre-heaven standing.

First we grounded with palms flat, then we slowly embraced the heavens with arms raised up, then brought them parallel in front, fingers straight out, pausing for several minitues between each transition we continued like this following the preheaven bagua sequence from heaven to lake. It was a sequence Sifu had channeled from the ancestors and immortals in his private work.

Sifu said this practice helped to cultivate pre-heaven energy in the body, and what I felt resonated with that idea. Doing this sequence always felt the most transformative on my qi, like it was growing something deeply within that changed and refined with the palm changes. Of course since it follow the principles of stillness and emptiness, it is just one of many such practices that might lead one to transformation.

After those two weeks of simple living, during this standing meditation in class, I began to feel something different. It felt similar to my sense of the xiantian / pre-heaven / primordial energy, but more strong. As our changes progressed it became stronger and stronger.

At the time I recall feeling like I wasn't really there, but I was there. I was fully present, but it was more like my consciousness was resting so contentedly that I was almost not there. This is my description of the idea of practicing with intention but without intention. I had awareness, but more in the observational sense as I experienced living change.

As this feeling grew, the Xuan Guan opened. For me it was in my upper dan tien, in my head, more near the back. It felt like a field expanded within me, roughly the size of a softball, that was both a part of the energy I had been cultivating within myself all this time and a gateway or portal opening into something more mysterious and intangible.

By the way, they say the big bang can be seen everywhere and nowhere all at once. It was like I was tapping into whatever dimension that was from to connect with the energy there.

As I was experiencing this, our meditation came to a close and we transitioned right into the chen style tai ji quan form, slowly. As we moved through the form, I experienced the sensation of this mysterious energy moving through this gateway into my form as I shaped my movements and changes. It did this throughout the form, and gradually as I moved and became more conscious and in control, the gate dissapated...

 

... and yet the energy that had come through remained. I could feel it cycling through my meridians in mysterious flows for the next 6-10 months as I maintained regular practice. As I practiced the energy would refine itself, but it was also present when I was not training. I recall being at a social event and feeling a little overwhelmed as I spoke with someone, and then I just sort of returned to my breathing and merged with that flow and suddenly my anxiety was gone and I was able to converse with this person as though I was behind the protection of this energy circulating through me. It felt so humbling and also confusing to me, as I had not had any education on what it was I was experiencing.

As my daily practice eventually waned, and my thinking mind regained control and the emptiness within my connective tissues became clogged with mundane thoughts, these rivers of mysterious energy began to dry up until it was gone, though it took a month or so. Again at the time I was not aware of how the principle worked, what it was called, or how I needed to work with it. At one point after this I heard in class Sifu mention something about people losing their way, and that he had seen it happen before. I knew he was speaking of me and yet I knew he did not answer questions readily, and I didn't really understand.

It is my belief that my teacher's gift to me has been to show me the way. And now as I come comprehend, and now as I have found my thread of destiny to follow, perhaps I will take upon myself the task for reawakening it again on my own, from my own work and understanding. Not that it was not my own work before - my teacher as I said is somewhat hand's off - but there is something important about me doing the work on my own.

For those who can, please don't bother looking for me in spirit. There is nothing to see but someone with stiff qi lost in their mind. I do not welcome you. I ask my guides to escort you away. You have your own work to focus on that does not involve me. These words are to help those who find them to perhaps gain some understanding from reading about the experience of someone else. It is merely one perspective. I can well comprehend now how the Xuan Guan might open in different ways in different locations, nurtured by different practices and techniques, for it is simply a matter of where the energy is able to come together and reach through to the xiantian realm when the conditions are ripe.

After this I have two chapters to share that I feel relate to this concept of Xuan Guan, but not might readily seem as though they do.

 

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Chapter 54, dao de jing, tl Hu Xuezhi

 

What is properly built cannot be shaken,

What is properly attached to cannot collapse.

Thus, it will enjoy the honor of posterity without intermission.

Cultivate Tao with oneself,

And Te can be fully recovered to the uncarved simplicity.

Cultivate Tao with the family,

And Te will abound to benefit posterity.

Cultivate Tao with the village,

And Te will expand to embrace more people.

Cultivate Tao with the nation,

And Te will be abundant.

Cultivate Tao beneath Heaven,

And Te will be everywhere,

Therefore, I will enable my body to meditate upon my body.

My family to meditate upon my family,

My village to meditate upon my village,

My nation to meditate upon my nation,

My universe to meditate upon my universe.

How do I know about all the universal things?

By meditating in this way!

 

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Chapter 13, Cultivating the Tao, Liu Yiming, tl Fabrizio Pregadio

 

The Other House and My House

 

The Wuzhen pian (Awakening to Reality) says:

 

Desist from exerting your skill in crafty pursuits:

discern the method of not dying of the other house.

 

It also says:

 

This perfect Treasure is in every house --

it is only that the foolish people do not recognize it.

 

Both passages show the place where the precelestial Medicine is generated.

 

People in later times have not understood the secret truths of the ancients. When they see the words "other house" and "every house," they imagine that they refer to women, and fall into the techniques of the "female elixir" (guidan). They commit themselves to filthy practices and create damages of all kinds. People like these, who enter the animal realm, could not be enumerated. How could they know that, since the precelestial Breath comes from Empty Non-Being, it cannot be sought in what has a form and an image?

 

Now, human beings are endowed with the precelestial Breath: they possess it since their birth, by virtue of their father's essence and their mother's blood. However, this Breath grows day after day and night after night, and when the Yang culminates, there is necessarily the Yin. The Yang in the Palace of Qian  ☰ moves to the Palace of Kun ☷ . At that time, Qian becomes empty and turns into Li  ☲ , and Kun becomes full and forms Kan ☵ . The reason why Li has this name is that is separates itself from its own Yang; and the reason why Kan has this name is that it traps Li's reality. When the Yang is trapped within the Yin, it does not belong anymore to "me." This is why we speak of the "other house."

 

The Wuzhen pian says:

 

You should know that the source of the stream, the place where the Medicine is born,

is just at the southwest -- that is its native village.

 

The southwest is the land of Kun ☷, the place where the Yin culminates and the Yang is born. Lu Ziye said:

 

The Medicine comes forth in the southwest, the position of Kun;

if you wish to seek the position of Kun, how could it be separated from that "man"?

I have disclosed the secret in clear words, and you should remember it;

but I am afraid that when you meet him, you will not recognize the True.

 

The name of this man is "man who does not die," or True Man (zhenren). An ancient immortal said:

 

If you want a man not to die,

you must seek the man who does not die.

 

This "man who does not die" is just the same as the "method of not dying of the other house."

 

When we speak of "my house" (wojia), we mean that one's own True Yang has separated from oneself; therefore Li ☲ represents "me." When we speak of the "other house" (tajia), we mean that one's own True Yang has been trapped by the Yin; therefore Kan  ☵ represents "the other." The names "other" and "me" are owed to the separation between Kan and Li, and these names are used until the Yang returns. When it returns, what is "other" becomes the same as "me." and what is "me" becomes the same as the "other." They are just one, and they are not two.

 

The Huanghe fu (Rhapsody of the Yellow Crane) says:

 

When you take as a model man and woman generating life,

you certainly release the mechanism of Heaven but cause the dispersion of the mechanism of Heaven.

 

When this text mentions "taking as model" and "causing the dispersion," it means that by engaging oneself in the laws of the world one causes the dispersion of the laws of the Tao; it does not mean that thee worldly "man and woman" are equivalent to "me and the other" with regard to the Tao.

 

People in later times have not understood the wondrous meaning of the words of the ancients. Thinking that "other house" refers to an external "other house," they perform acts that are suitable for animals and harm the teaching. They cannot even hope to be reborn as humans: how can they expect to become immortals?

 

Whenever the scriptures on the Elixir speak of "me" and the "other," they refer to Yin and Yang; when they speak of host and guest, they refer to the operation; when they speak of reversal, they refer to taking hold of something in one's own hands; when they speak of Being and Non-Being, they refer to movement and quiescence; when they speak of Dragon and Tiger, they refer to Nature [xing] and emotions [qing]; and when they speak of Lead and Mercury, they refer to floating and sinking. What is most essential does not lie outside of the two words, "Yin" and "Yang"; what should be investigated does not lie outside of the two words, "Nature" (xing) and "Existence" (ming); and what is real and authentic does not lie outside of the two words, "body" and "mind."

 

Those evildoers do not understand the great Way of the sages and the worthies. They think that women are the "other house," that their "initial flow" is the perfect Treasure, and that the endometrium is the medicine of long life. This is not cultivating the saintly Tao; it is actually slandering the saintly Tao. They will go to hell, where their tongues will be pulled out.

 

Alas! It is "in every house" but is not "in my house": this is essentially because "what you see cannot be used." You want to search for it, but the most important dharma-assets necessarily are found within the Red District of the Spirit Continent [spaceless center]: this is because "what you use cannot be seen."

 

What you see cannot be used;

what you use cannot be seen.

 

If it is not in the body, how can another person have it? If it is not seen within, how can it be sought outside? Unless you clearly understand Yin and Yang, deeply comprehend creation and transformation, and are aware of the precelestial Breath of True Unity, how can you know the secret found in those words?

 

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It can be seen that the principle in the video related to the emptiness required to open the Xuan Guan are the same as the principle followed here related to reclaiming the True Yang that has been lost to heaven and may be found within the emptiness of earth, Kun ☷.

 

In class one day I heard Sifu say at the end of our meditation:

And thus there is Heaven on Earth.

23 hours ago, Daeluin said:

The full moon today is rather potent, and this is the yang most time of this water tiger year.

 

That seems to get into Tian Ji Bu Ke Xie Lu again though. I realized in my sleep that something important was left out.

For as we know, the yang most time of the year is the summer solstice.

Alas! When we establish clocks and calendars, we begin to separate from natural timing, and in so doing also experience consequences.

In Cultivating the Tao, Liu Yiming emphasizes that Zi, Wu, Mao, and You, are not determined by the clock, but by the energy.

Zi is midnight - the middle of the night, when the sun is opposite where one sits on the planet. Noon is straight above and is Wu. The middle of Mao is the middle of sunrise. The middle of You is the middle of sunset.

But these days midnight and noon are not midnight and noon. Acupuncturists say the stomach channel is strongest from 5-7am, regardless of daylight savings time in many cases.

The sovereign I Ching hexagrams are supposed to begin with the return coming at the winter solstice, not when Zi begins two weeks earlier, as is often listed these days to match with the 12 branches - but to do so renders hexagram Tai (11) not even reaching the vernal equinox as it should.

And even then, if the yin most time of the year is influenced by the new moon nearest to it, and the yang most time of the year is related to the full moon closest to it, how do these things influence principles like the return of yin and yang?

If we are deciding people's futures based on Bazi, but our calculations are not even following the energies (or even the turning of the planet given that China uses 1 timezone), how many mistakes are made when deciding people's fates?

If we have trouble calibrating with what is obvious in these natural phenomena, how much more so do we challenge our selves to find what is mysterious?

 

Perhaps the punishment from heaven is merely our very own disconnection from the energy of heaven that is required to support us and life on this planet and the fulfillment of our destinies. Taken far and long enough, we simply separate from nature and deny our own ability to sustain ourselves.

1 hour ago, Iskote said:

Also, you put the topic as '玄關/Hsuan Kuan/Mysterious Gate', but in your original post you commented about wide differences in daoist views and practices and how daoists tolerate different schools, and about correct and incorrect practices, etc. That opened the door for for a much broader discussion.

 

And that is where I started. However I do intend on continuing. The full moon today is rather potent, and this is the yang most time of this water tiger year. I hope to return later today to continue where my timeline required me to pause the video yesterday. (-:

5 hours ago, Cobie said:

@Daeluin What does 罔兩 mean? 

https://ctext.org/zhuangzi/adjustment-of-controversies

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Why do Taoists respect those who use very different methods?

 

I see that some other people are translating zhen ren as 'real man'.

To me it feels more poignant viewed as 'complete human'.

From the moment of conception, we work to embody our higher self into this form, and this may be continued to a state of completion.

In this sense, it is like climbing a mountain to reach the top.

There are as many paths to the top as there are people. We are not all the same, we are all different. Some of us may be resonant with similar paths, but in the end we all must walk our own path and find our own center.

Therefore, what works for each of us will be different. Accepting this, seeing the truth in this, we may find it easier to appreciate the paths of others, however different they may be.

 

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Tian Ji Bu Ke Xie Lu

 

Wow. Before I even get into the main topic of this video, I find destiny.

 

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Heavenly secrets must not be divulged. This sentence means that heaven will punish you if you share a secret with others. Many practitioners believe Xiu Dao concepts to be inherited from heaven and they won't dare to share them with the public. However, I do not support this idea at all. I believe, it is just the means for elitism and control. If Xiu Dao can benefit others, then why not share this with people. It doesn't make sense if you believe that interpretation.

Now, there exists another interpretation of this term. Something I agree with. Let me explain. In the term Tian Ji Bu Ke Xie Lu:

• Tian means heaven
• Ji means secret
• Bu means not
• Ke mean able to
• Xie Lu means divulge

The translation is that The secret of practice is impossible to be taught. In other words, real knowledge can only be achieved with personal practice.

I first heard this translation from my grandfather, Yang Qin-Lin (?), though of course there might have been other people who supported this thought.

Now, you can see that this same sentence, Tian Ji Bu Ke Xie Lu, has two totally different interpretations. The first tells us to keep it a secret or to be punished by heaven. The other interpretation is that personal practice is necessary to understand the knowledge. I support this interpretation, not merely out of love for my grandfather, but mainly because it is the most rational explanation available.

I have taught many people about this term. Yes, of course I have experienced hard times in my life. And so has every other human being. But, the idea that someone would be punished for sharing Xiu Dao knowledge is, in my opinion, implausible.

In case you believe in such superstitious ideas, I hope you can let go of those and look for rational interpretations.

 

Amused.

As ever, to me, the rational interpretation is found in between both of these contrasting thoughts.

Our timelines run based on cause and effect. Cause and effect are influenced by the choices we make.

There are two questions I feel it is appropriate to ask when considering this principle. What happens when secrets are divulged to those who are unable to understand them by putting them into practice? And what does the punishment of heaven look like?

First of all I would suggest that punishment here might be another concept easily translated in other ways. Consequences seems appropriate.

And in the west we have a fairly clear example of this principle of Tian Ji Bu Ke Xie Lu.

 

The Bible.

 

Secrets contain power, and power may be used without being understood. In the west the bible holds power over us even as the wisdom contained within is barely put into practice. Many of the religious people in my country do not love their neighbors at all, and are hardly willing to turn the other cheek. Quite the opposite, the religious institutions have become politicized and are being used as a tool to control power over my country.

 

And in the East, there is another form of evidence we may look at.

 

The practice of using heavenly secrets to order human affairs, as seen in using BaZi to arrange marriages.

 

BaZi essentially becomes a form of knowledge that is able to connect with heavenly principle, but when written and taught it may be practiced without connection to heaven. It may be allowed to order the world, but in so doing it prevents natural order. Man follows Earth, Earth follows Heaven, Heaven follows the Course, the Course follows what is naturally self-so.

But when we use constructs to decide how things should be, we disconnect from allowing things to follow their natural self-so courses.

And of course this idea of arranged marriages is deeply rooted in confucian culture, which at its core can be found the idea of filial piety, which is a recognition of the human web of life and an aspiration to keep that web of life connected and nurtured.

However, by setting commandants about what should be done and what should not be done, we make it artificial. Who was it that decided men are yang and women are yin? Who was it that decided that women must be under the control of men and kept inside out of the sun and men's gazes?

And yet these things come from our secrets, when they are not fully understood, but put into practice without complete realization.

After all, if we cater only to the human web of life, we disconnect from the web of life of nature. And in so doing, we discover that eventually we are killing nature, something we likely thought impossible long ago.

And thus we see the punishment of heaven.

Einstein wished that he had never helped create the atomic bomb. And today we suffer the punishment of heaven as Ukraine struggles against Russia and the world is afraid to act in fear of a nuclear retaliation at the hands of one person.

The punishment of heaven can be seen in the acts of those daoists who were willing to divulge secrets to the emperors, who then used those secrets to retain their powers or destroy knowledge that was threatening. Meanwhile the writings of dao says again and again, the if the emperors were able to follow the dao, and return to the people the energy that was fed to them, their empires would be ordered. Perhaps if the emperors put the knowledge into practice such that they understood it for themselves, they would have become sage kings and have ended the dynamic of emperial rule. Such after all is the lesson to be found within Qian's top line ䷀ .

 

Looking back, we see the biblical story of the fallen angels. They were the ones who came to earth from the heavens to divulge knowledge. And yet too we see that it is these angels who became known for their sins of sharing knowledge, and the story goes that god sent the floods upon earth to destroy them -- and here again we see the story of knowledge that is shared being met with punishment from the heavens.

 

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I've since stumbled over my own secrets, and have needed to ponder long and hard on what may be shared without it being somehow misunderstood and misused for the power it is still able to yield in the hands of those who only see how to leverage things to their own desires.

This is part of my karmic journey, as I have long carried guilt over the consequence of secrets I shared and that were abused. In Atlantis the pattern I carry now, was then used to divulge the secrete of cloning crystals. Crystals became the power source of Atlantis, and that power was abused and led to the destruction of that civilization. All the time, I was crying out that this was not how my contribution should be used.

Carrying that guilt, still strongly felt, into my next incarnations of this pattern, I became a knight that went on a quest to find the holy grail - a vessel of spiritual power manifest upon the earth, manifest upon the earth full of corrupted people, and I helped to escort that vessel into the spiritual planes away from human greed.

Carrying that guilt, I became a knight templar, fighting for justice.

Only, alas. Such an extreme composure is not balanced, and I too reincarnated in lifetimes that capitulated and turned toward shadow.

Navigating these extremes, sometimes a warrior of peace, sometimes a warrior of shadow, I eventually found my way into more recent lifetimes as a woman, in monastic spiritual situations. This seems to have been a way for me to learn a lesson I had been missing about balance. In this current life time as a man again, I am able to step more solidly into the balance. The balance between feminine and masculine. The balance between understanding and loving. The balance between divulging secrets and sharing living knowledge in the moment.

And this too, reveals how we may witness the form of punishment from heaven. It is merely the consequences of our choices. But oh how impactful they can be.

 

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As an astrologer, I can see well how the planetary configurations influence to a high degree the courses our lives take. And yet our decisions are still our own, and strongly shape the manifestations that occur within the balances upon the planet. And ultimately if we wish to become complete humans, we must learn to reconcile the cycling of the planets in order to expand with some stability beyond the limits of our solar system.

And that is when we are able to take destiny into our own hands and become freed from our karmic bonds of heavenly punishment, EVEN AS OUR ACTIONS UPON THE EARTH STILL HAVE CONSEQUENCES. It simply may not matter, from a selfish perspective, as we have at such a point transcended the confines of reincarnation by merging our hun and po and transcending to a higher realm.

 

And yet... isn't it odd that it is this 'desire' realm in which we have the leverage to ascend all the way to Buddha hood, while, in those form and formless realms, they do not have such leverage and progress becomes much slower?

For again, becoming complete involves becoming an anchor for those realms of higher vibration. We are part of the root.

And therefore, when we do escape the punishment of heaven, and hold destiny within our own two hands, we may still follow a wuwei ziran course, we we allow heaven to act through us as we follow the natural and spontaneous path that unfolds before us. And as such, we become now a greater vehicle that begins to work on the karmic / destiny of the living planet itself.

And extending the principle, in this way we begin to do the work that allows the expanding universe to begin to return to itself. Such is the way of Bodhisattvas.

But I digress.

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There is another important principle that may be revealed about this topic, and it concerns one's destiny.

There are some things we need to discover for ourselves. For in being told of them by others, we struggle to own them of our own merits. We might think to attribute such a task to the one who told it to us, as though that was a task from that person, and feel obliged to accomplish it FOR that person.

This is important, because such destined tasks are of our own curriculum, and it will not do for us to think they are merely tasks from another. And if we DO them for another, then perhaps we do NOT do them for ourselves.

And thus the critical importance that we discover them for ourselves.

Perhaps this is why the sage's actions are designed such that people think they accomplished certain things on their own. Cleverly planting seeds and guiding their growth from the side lines, never taking credit. Great wisdom may come from pondering such courses.

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There is a quote from the Confucian Analects that reveals a comprehension of this principle of Tian Ji Bu Ke Xia Lu.
 

Quote

The Master said, "I do not open up the truth to one who is not eager to get knowledge, nor help out any one who is not anxious to explain himself. When I have presented one corner of a subject to any one, and he cannot from it learn the other three, I do not repeat my lesson."

This readily demonstrates a way for us to share with those who are able to follow and own their own work.

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And too this topic changes when it comes to modern society.

We live in an age of information (and misinformation). It is everywhere. We can find anything we want to find, from any perspectives.

 

So it becomes easier to divulge secrets, especially in ways that are not easily found except for those who know where to look for them, without such impactful consequences. But it still depends on how we do it.

A good example of this can be found in the published books of Mantak Chia. A great deal of secrets were published in such a way that they became highly popular in the west... and yet, because they did not cater to the nuances of peoples need's to walk many paths, but instead catered to peoples desires, many people who practiced the arts in these books had set-backs. Having these set-backs they lashed out at the author, and the author's reputation and karma is influenced by this, just as he influenced their karma.

And yet when it comes to disseminating knowledge in the moment, like on a forum when a question is asked, it becomes much more likely for the people who need it to find it, and much less likely for those who would not benefit from it to not be exposed to it.

 

And so this indeed paves the way for videos like this to reveal secrets. We find the needles in the haystack that we are meant to find naturally.

I've pondered on this a bit. I haven't posted here in some time, but somehow I found myself drawn here today, and then I found this.

Perhaps what I've left here will be met with resonance for some, perhaps not for others. Whatever it is that is found, please make it your own in whatever way works!

When it comes to such things, perhaps this is one of the mysteries of the dao de jing. It is able to retain enough circularity and subtlety, that even for people who misunderstand it, the meaning is able to still guide people closer to their natural paths. Even if the idea of what is natural (self-so) remains mysterious.
 

On 10/3/2020 at 2:23 PM, Mig said:

I have posted some questions about Daoists in general regarding inequality, their precepts, etc. to understand how it is perceived or understood by fellow Daoists or well educated individuals in this forum. One thing, I keep noticing is that Daoism as well as other religious groups, they tend to lean where the money is. I don't see their temples or congregations in low income areas or impoverished neighborhoods. It seems in the past Daoists where in full battle against buddhists for the sake of power. Am I wrong or can you give examples of the contrary?

The dao is the flow of the way in front of each of us into a merging with the coherence between all things.

It is a somewhat individual path.

When we gather in groups and discuss the dogma of isms, we are required to finance stasis within the flow.

 

It is no different from chinese medicine. If we want to hold onto a memory instead of letting it go, we often finance it with our energy and bury it somewhere within us.

The buildings and shelters and towns and cities of humans are all types of stasis blocking flow.

 

Meanwhile the tissues and organs are all merged within the flow.

There is nothing inherently wrong with groups.

 

Look at schools of fish or flocks of birds.

 

They can change on a dime.

 

Because they are empty. Empty, together.

Humans together get lost in their minds.

This tends to require financing of some kind.

Thinking and talking a lot requires shelter and food.

 

Things that would be naturally acquired by following a flow through nature.

 

But we aren't flowing so we need to finance the acquisition of those things, and need to finance their stasis too, so we can have them when we need them.

 

I used to have friends with free time to play in the woods.

 

Then they got families and need to finance their needs.

 

It is just the natural way of gathering outside of natural flow.

 

 

On 12/2/2020 at 12:37 AM, manitou said:

 

 

I've been trying to figure out how to approach all these current events with my extremely conservative elderly relatives down in The Villages.  They're frightened to death because they are convinced that there are packs of torch bearing liberals about to descend on their neighborhoods.  They've been in this state since the riots originally started from the BLM movement.  Their fears are fed by their neighbors and friends.

 

Hi manitou. <3

 

I'd say we appear to be undergoing a paradigm shift.

Change will ever catch up to us and require adaptation. What cannot adapt decays and the new is born to take its place.

 

It seems like now if we wish to avoid seeing the long fallout of things being unable to adapt to change, it is time to start preemptively building the foundation to support the new.

 

One of the new bits of this paradigm seems to be related to information overload. As vibrations increase due to all manner of factors, we are having trouble keeping track and keeping current. It becomes easy for people to start feeling distrust for authoritative sources of information. And in the security void that results it is easy to grasp onto something that provides easy answers. Especially when those answers connect all the dots and give an enemy to be responsible for all the inner fears.

 

A new "Age of Aquarius" is an age of air - the realm of the mind.

 

Let us not forget that the chinese word includes heart AND mind as one.

Our feelings drive our thoughts.

When our thoughts become overwhelmed it can be therapeutic to simply return to our feelings.

 

"How am I feeling right now?"

 

Feelings are one word answers.

 

Lonely. Depressed. Happy. Content. Ecstatic.

 

They aren't reasons and justifications and stories.

 

The more we are able to separate our feelings from our thoughts, the more we can build a bridge back to a simpler reality. One that we can navigate without needing conspiracy theories and enemies hiding in the shadows.

 

NVC (Non-Violent Communication) is great at this. We can use Feeling cards to navigate and practice working with our feelings. And we can use Needs cards to navigate our core needs - which differ from our desires. Perhaps your friends would enjoy this type of experience instead of watching TV?

 

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NVC is a great example of a foundation that can support the new paradigm.

Many foundations are already in place, like this one. Many others will need to be built, like ways we can leverage social media to self-represent each other and our communities.

And these foundations then can become bridges to those stuck in the old paradigm.

We don't have to watch it all fall apart. We don't have to watch the world burn as people feel like cornered animals and reach deep within their creative reactivity. We can say "here. here's a way out that doesn't corner you."

 

We can't force anyone to do anything. We all need to be willing to adapt to changing times in our own ways.

 

But when people are presented with new choices. Well, there may just come a time when they decide - "you know what? this old thing isn't serving me any more, I think I'm going to try this new thing instead."

 

 

 

 

Poking around in here, seeing if anything stimulates a response...

 

What is the impact of the stretches i did up to know on my health?

 

Hexagram 61.

 

Changing lines 3 5 6.

 

Changing line 3:

Finding enemies, sometimes drumming, sometimes stopping, sometimes crying, sometimes singing.

 

Getting into aberrant practices, attached to your own body, attempting forced manipulations, is like faith in which one finds enemies -- faith becomes enmity; after a time there inevitably comes a change, as one first believes in this, then that -- when this practice doesn't work, one then tries that practice; "sometimes drumming, sometimes stopping, sometimes crying, sometimes laughing," vain and insubstantial, this is what is referred to by the statement, "It's easy to work with what is of the same species, hard to work with what is not of the same kind." Believing in what is not to be believed will inevitably destroy faith. This is faith that takes the false to be true.

 

Changing line 5:

 

With faithfulness that is firm, there is no fault.

 

Being strong and also balanced, and correctly oriented, yin and yang blended, essence [xing], feeling [qing], vitality [jing], and spirit [shen] all return to the center [earth], benevolence [wood], justice [metal], courtesy [fire], and wisdom [water] all return to the mind; the five elements aggregate, truthfully unified without division. This is faithfulness that is firm; it is secure and cannot be dissolved. This is what is meant by the saying, "When a grain of gold elixir is swallowed into the belly, for the first time you know your destiny depends on you and not on heaven." When the work reaches this point, you are integrated with natural principle, the celestial design, and all entanglements are void; there is naturally no fault. This is faithfulness in which strength and flexibility are one.

 

Changing line 6:

 

The voice of a pheasant reaches the skies; even if devoted, the outlook is bad.

 

If one uses one's own intelligence to indulge in guesswork and personalistic interpretation, unable to humble oneself to seek from others and thoroughly investigate true principles, and plunges into practices impetuously, one who advanced rapidly regresses swiftly; though one originally wanted to climb to the heights, instead one falls. This is just the call of a pheasant, incapable of soaring to the heavens to accomplish that which is rare in the world. This is faith that misuses intellect.

 

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So it sounds like that might actually answer your question appropriately.

 

This is from Cleary's translation of Liu Yiming's "Taoist I Ching" also found in "Taoist Classics Vol IV" , which I recommend.

 

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As for changing lines, that was them. I see a 6 or a 9 as being activation of the coagulation of yin or vibration of yang - activation of the change within the hexagram. Not changing polarity. Harmen has a video about the history of treating the lines as a changing polarity in his YiTube series, and this is also mentioned in Richard Rutt's book. Basically it is not a convention that was always used with the I Ching.

 

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As for yes or no questions. The I Ching is perfectly capable of answering a yes or no question. Or a this or that question. It answers what is between yes or no, what is between this or that. That is my experience. So if you want to try to interpret that, great. For some questions it can be helpful, for an advanced reader capitalizing on the mechanism. I wouldn't recommend it for beginners.

 

To Harmen I'd say that I think not asking a question at all is a fantastic way to divinate without getting in the way by setting up an extra vector with a question. And that if we are getting into the WenWangGua here I'd say the WenWangGua is armed with a lot more interpretational resources in which to answer a yes or no answer than a typical I Ching reading.

 

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As for your other two questions, you ask multiple questions at one go. This complicates things. If you want clear answers, ask clearly focused questions. If you ask two questions you might get an answer that combines two answers or something. Why not ask them separately and keep things clean?

 

When we go to cross a road, we want to know if it is safe. So we look in one direction, and look in the other direction, and from the tapestry revealed we make a proper judgement about whether or not it is safe. We end up with a "yes" or a "no" in some sense, but we did not ask a yes or no question. We asked what it looks like over here and over there.

I would advise treating the I Ching the same way. Use it to paint a clear description of the tapestry of change you are navigating. Be simple and patient. Sometimes just describing a situation is a better way to add complexity than asking a question about it.

 

 

 

On 7/10/2017 at 4:23 PM, CedarTree said:

*I am putting this in Daoist discussion because I principally would like to hear Daoist and other schools view points on this :)*

 

I am familiar with the Theravada view on Rebirth and also the Zen portrayal.

As someone that has pursued strong meditation based traditions such as Thai Forest and Antai-ji - Gyobutsuji Zen Monastery I have been able to experience a lot of the teachings and or at least understand them in both a logical way and experiential way.

Rebirth however has been a hard one for me. Not for disbelief but in achieving a level of experience and understanding in which it fits in smoothly into how I have come to understand the teachings both through study and experience.

I am hoping those knowledgeable in the other traditions can explain how it is talked about in their school and also experiences and or things that have helped deepen their understanding on this teaching.

 

Thank you friends

 

There is dao, and there is creation from dao, and there is return to dao.

Within this are myriad cycles of transformation, such as the cycles of transmigration within the planet earth.

 

The "daoist cosmology" reveals many complicated symbolisms, which when studied with the model of nature, may or may not help one to intuitively grasp the workings of the celestial mechanism, including transmigration.

 

Separation, heavy sinks, light rises.

Integration, heavy and light merge.

 

Patterns and shapes, the motion of the planets, the current of a species, all are connected.

One whole, life and death, the whole separates.

Patterns find like patterns.

Conception has its own pattern, patterns find like patterns. Rebirth.

 

What is on the surface must not be taken for the real without examination within.

I feel this thread sorta reveals the core essence:

Zhuangzi, in chapter 1 poses the question of what we depend upon... and what were to happen if we were to depend only upon heaven and earth?

 

Everything else is in-between, and in between can be gauged by how fluidly something is able to adapt to the changes occurring between heaven and earth.

 

When this adaptation becomes stagnant, the flow and harmony become obstructed. Rather than trusting decisions to our intuition, our ego comes to decide right and wrong based on attachments.

 

When the flow is not hindered, the intuition marks a fluidity that naturally balances between yin and yang. This is being close to dao.

 

When when the flow is hindered, we enter a buffered state where there is separation and stagnation to this way of seamlessly flowing with dao. The entire manifest realm is such a stage of buffering, and yet even it has an ebb and flow, a beginning and ending.

 

In buffering, we lean to the extreme. In cultivation of balance, we lean to where we may surrender to intuition of what is right and wrong in any given moment through divine knowledge and connection to refined vibration.

10 minutes ago, Earl Grey said:

 Better to die than to be destroyed by the unworthy, perhaps?

 

Die how? In the flesh? Does that prevent another from receiving the transmission?

 

Is direct inheritance by a so-called "indoor student" better? It would appear that sometimes such students transform the art in beautiful ways, reinvigorating its heart... while others may not have understood much beyond the surface, or beyond their teacher's ever present guidance. Does the "name" make inheritance more official than the ability to reach the heart of the teaching?

 

Once a pattern exists, it has an essence, like a musical theme. It may not bear the name of its founder, and may not be applied with the same steps, but that essence may continue to be expressed through the changing medium of time and space for as long as people are willing to listen.

 

In some cases it may simply be a matter of timing and sincerity. In other cases it may be more intentionally tended through guides. Perhaps both at once is common.

 

Easy to forget, all that about how something is more easily brought down after it is raised up; how cultivating the "value" of something or of one's self is to limit one's freedom.

 

Those who study the art of energy movement would do well to continuously study the daodejing and zhuangzi. IMO.

6 hours ago, Mudfoot said:

For a teacher, the teaching is precious. 

 

And when teaching the higher levels, you reveal things important to yourself. 

 

So,  a student that creates trouble and argument while learning the basics might not be the one you want to teach more to, because you will have a more personal relation in that situation. 

 

And a student who have trouble grasping the basics, or trouble practicing the basics, might not be the one that should learn more advanced methods. 

 

The idea that the students should be worthy is different from the notion that you are buying a service from the teacher. 

 

Fair?  Not relevant. 

 

The best way? Not relevant. 

 

If I was an active teacher, I would prefere students whose personality I could get along with, and ability to grasp what I was teaching. 

 

Well put.

 

Where I train... the teacher has gone beyond indoor/outdoor.

 

When in class, the teacher observes the whole, and what is spoken is what each of us need as a whole. Speaking is very minimal, as too many words activate our human-minds and take us away from cultivating the mind of dao.

 

When in private lessons, we practice harmonization with one another. There is a one-on-one, or one-on-two relationship, but whenever this is "taken" as the means to increase desire for a particular teaching, it impedes the operation of becoming spiritually whole, as one begins to emphasize horizontal connection to another rather than maintaining vertical development.

 

In both cases though, I feel "indoor" training is readily available. We are encouraged to avoid missing classes, and each class takes place at a different time within the season, even though they are twice a week. Every day has a different energy, and every class has different instructions - sometimes harmony is emphasized, sometimes cultivating of roots is emphasized, sometimes we learn new material, sometimes we get a lecture, sometimes we are instructed to move at natural speed, and so on, according to what we need as a whole and according to how we may best harmonize with the environmental changes. There is much to be learned from this if one listens.

 

For the student who diligently trains, the transformations come of their own. When in class, those changes are instructed with a work or half a sentence at the precise time they are needed. This matter of timing is where things become very indoor. Every other student may hear this instruction and find use of it, but for the one student who was on the threshold of a major transformation, it holds a secret that shows where the threshold is, and what to do upon reaching it.

 

To me, this type of indoor instruction is appropriate, as it keeps things relatively natural, almost entirely avoiding issues that come from mental attachments such as enabling, entitlement, co-dependence. The indoor teaching is also largely invisible, preventing issues of inheritance and so on. It is not a model for everyone, but the principles it applies may be useful to some, in their own way.

 

48 minutes ago, Zenmode said:

Yeah blue snake, I only was told recently that I was a special case. I thought I was always under par because I was just not good at things, but my new lessons have taught me that what makes me special is because of things I thought were natural but aren't available to everyone unless they train hard. My talent Always made others upset an that got in the way of their teaching me, one reason is because it took them years to get what I already had naturally.

 

I've recently begun claiming my talent instead of seeing myself as less than. I am what I am blue snake, lol I like how you said your an idiot. That's how I begun everything, I knew I didn't know an have no hesitation bout being completely open to a new way of doing things. Even then if it goes against what I knew, I compartmentalize an do whatever the new thing is. You're a smart one Blue Snake, wish you good stuff bro

 

Oddly enough, my first 2 years in training brought about some profound results.... it was in looking back upon them and studying them that I let my mind impede my progress. Humility and openness and surrender are what enable progress. Ego ever gets in the way. For those with talent, this is the hardest lesson.

 

If you are talented, then perhaps something within the celestial mechanism is working out for you - your mind wasn't part of that. I recommend doing yourself a favor by not presuming you have the ability to control things better than surrendering to dao.

 

Hi @Spotless. I think it is pretty clear, but when you say "this" above, you are speaking about the intention of the OP, in regards to exchange - correct?

 

Just wanting to help keep things clear.

 

Also, the Shamanic passing that was described was not (as I see it) referring to mere information, as from Akashic records - but to the substance of momentum of a soul/consciousness - the literal merging of momentum and destiny of one part of the whole with another.

Several things being spoken of here...

• skillful navigation of reincarnation/transmigration (into newly conceived life)
• passing of soul/de/consciousness from one body to another
  • the elder soul assumes control
  • the elder soul surrenders to the new host

 

This last is what I felt was being described above - is it possible? The new host would need the skills to navigate such potent energy, but presuming that preparation had been made, I imagine that energy being absorbed and assimilated into the new host, without the old being able to control anything after the gift had been given.

 

Also brings to mind something explored by Frank Herbert - where a strong past life incarnations may take the reigns as one delves deep, if they are stronger than the current presence.

 

Then there are channels and so on.

 

I've been taught that we should avoid sharing the vessel with others - it is our responsibility.  And that responsibility our spirit is burdened with is to dissolve the ego and heal the soul - complete the de and return it to dao.

Interesting, @Taomeow. Now I recall how my mother used to raise me in a slightly more feminine fashion - the first day I went to school, I had barrettes in my hair... she always loved my corn-silky hair and I never had a boy's haircut, and so on. A feminine seeming name, not having a father - quite an outcast to my peers.

 

Not having a father to role model masculine things was yet another form of protection from the patriarchal influences, I know recognize. It has taken some effort to reach into my own past and into the rare examples present around us, to really gain an understanding of the true potential of masculine power. Which of course is contained within its own balance of femininity, and thus, is "masculine" even the proper term.

 

I've also not trusted others in terms of my own past... and yet when that rare person arrives in my momentum with whom such a gift can be offered, it generally can be trusted. In such.... I've been able to tap into the general theme of the momentum of the tapestry and the roles I may have played.

 

It is interesting how extremes work. In "masculine" terms it seems that it is when the masculine power is at its weakest that it also is attempting to be the most forceful and dominant.... unable to contain itself, yet on trajectory to apply itself externally at all cost, it desperately clings to that brittle unsustainable path.... I suspect that if certain gravities are exercised, these energies may be dissolved upon the very foundation which they rest, without too much collateral damage. I don't know if that is where we are headed or not, or how soon.... yet I hope that whatever the change that comes, it is able to ply itself such that extreme trajectories and their future reboundings are not beyond the capacity of the deeper momentum to contain them. When all the historical layers of shaping are able to come into close enough resonance, something magnificent may be within reach.

24 minutes ago, Jeff said:

Yes, but that is possession like I mentioned above.

 

Something like this is mentioned in Chronicles of Tao.

 

However there it was not described as something like possession, but rather the opposite: as though the jewel of the refined soul is passed from one spirit, at the end of its time within physical embodiment, unto the care of another spirit. The new spirit would have full autonomy, though of course the karmic gravity and momentum would also be transferred.

 

There was not much elaboration, and I am not very clear on the purpose for such an exchange. It was described as a sharing between a master and a student, so perhaps as a very poignant tool for extension of lineage.

1 hour ago, Drifting_Through_Infinity said:

So my friend Austin and I have come to the conclusion that we were supposed to be born in each other's body

 

I offer the perspective that whenever something "was supposed to be different" with the way we were born, that we try to feel out the reason for this feeling.

 

Were we born into a pattern that is seemingly very different from our historical transmigrationary patterns? This could be related to a need we had, to deal with a difficulty in balancing certain momentum based influences, while in our "familiar" role.  So perhaps we are now gaining the ability to digest those lessons while embodied in a pattern that can do that more easily. Or perhaps we have now become able to face challenges that we had not been able to face in the past, which only seem new from a limited perspective. Perhaps both at once.

 

This could be choice related and intentional, even though it may not seem intentional after embodiment.

 

Could it be choice related to something like impatience? Feeling the need to embody and not wait for the right patterns to arise, when certain patterns did arise, perhaps we jumped at the opportunity - and simultaneously accepted the new and perhaps transformational lessons these fundamental changes in patterns would bring.

 

I suspect this is common with gender imbalances - one who has difficulty in cultivating yin qualities while in masculine momentum may be led to try on femininity to learn more naturally before returning to the main momentum. Or perhaps a pair whom have shared momentum in the past now desire to embody in the same timeframe and locale. Whenever there are specific patterns that need to be matched, they are more difficult to find, and naturally come with their own shapings.

 

It is common for the "ego" to project expectations onto the world in declaring what is supposed to be. In reality such control is only possible in a walled garden, which is then separated from the whole and also risks destruction whenever it begins to open again to exchange with the whole. When trust and acceptance are exercised, we may not get what we think we are supposed to, but often we get exactly what we need - a discovery soon realized after working through it rather than rejecting it.t

 

It is up to us to both feel out what our challenges are and also walk the path of integration by working through those challenges. The more resistance, the more restriction - the more acceptance, the greater freedom.

 

61

THE YIELDING NATION

A great nation, like a river delta,
Receives the riches of the land.
In being receptive - possessing the Yin,
Receiving the Yang unto it,
Overcomes all by its very peacefulness and quietude.

So -
A great nation, placing itself below a lesser,
Absorbs the lesser.
A lesser nation, submitting to a greater,
Conquers and wins adherence of the greater.
Thus -
To absorb, conquer and win adherence,
- One must yield.

Truly -
Those who triumph, do so by yielding.
A great nation prospers by absorbing,
A lesser by joining and participating.
For both to so benefit,
the greater nation needs be a yielding nation.

 

tl. Alan B. Taplow

Yes, exactly.... in my case I'm told I was mostly female in monastic situations or tribal ones. I'm not sure how much of the patriarchal exploitation I participated in given these 'protections.' And yet in this life I find myself very sensitive and understanding of these issues, and very connected to the importance of tapping into them.

 

Part of this is being raised by a single mother, whom in the early 80's had much difficulty in raising me alone. Growing up I was very sensitive to her struggles and the inequalities which she so strongly fought. And yet there is something much deeper - I was often bullied physically and verbally, yet something inside did not know how to lift a finger in defense, but only walk in acceptance.

 

The tapestry of change within momentum is vast and complex, and I know there are myriad origins for these experiences. The experiences of being female I only know were very important for me. You are probably right about how much time would be needed for every man to experience "his" feminine counterpart. I don't know, but it seems things are priming for something that isn't so far off... perhaps the earth herself has a new role to play in setting the balance.