Jump to content


Photo

Stretching for mobility, flexibility, wellbeing

stretching mobility flexibility

  • Please log in to reply
104 replies to this topic

#17 blue eyed snake

blue eyed snake

    slithering serpent

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 1183 posts
  • Gender:None Selected
  • Location:here
  • Interests:being

Posted 20 September 2016 - 12:13 AM

Yes, I think this is exactly it. Perhaps if I had started with ballistic stretching at the beginning it would have gone badly, but because I had been stretching for so many months I had certainly developed a sense of my limits.

 

I can kinda see why a physio would warn people away from ballistic in general -- there's probably a liability issue, when people have no body-awareness and go too far as you say, and hurt themselves. And it's certainly not to be recommended for stretching the back!

 

For spinal mobility I've been trying a few things, though it's going pretty slowly. What kind of things did your physio recommend?

 

i had several thing advised by him, but by now there replaced by stuff i learned from chinese teacher, works better.

 

there's one for spinal mobility, but it's to complicated to teach in words, or even by a little film. Took me much looking and nudging before I got it.  These things are generally best learned from someone who can directly show you and correct where you're not getting it


There is only one truth, but it has many manifestations.

The mystery of life is not a problem to solve but a reality to experience.

#18 dust

dust

    灰眼胡

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 2440 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 20 September 2016 - 07:00 AM

Stretching is of paramount importance in my life, but not the militarized, hard style kung fu/sports type stretching that is often supported in the 'no pain, no gain' school of thought.  I'm of the very gentle, breath based release of tension over time, throughout the day in all activities.

 

 

...

 

At my age I can now sit in half lotus for as many hours as my mind will tolerate it.  Of late, working more and more with my lower body, which has always been stiffer for me, I can now sit in full lotus on some days, but not all.  When I can't do it comfortably, I never, never push it.  Pushing is punishing, is harming, in my experience... but that's just me.

 

I've been trying to implement a more regular, throughout-the-day approach to stretching, with the idea that a small but frequent dose will be easier on the body and more likely to initiate a more permanent change. But I'm not very good at remembering....

 

 

 

 

Stretching the muscles & sinews (tendons & ligaments) is extremely important in Chinese culture for health (易筋经/Yi Jin Jing) and as the foundation for alchemy (洗髓经/Xi Sui Jing)

There may be relatively faster, but I don't know of an absolutely fast way to do this, though.  If there was, yoga would simply be a weekend workshop, and not a regular lifestyle routine...

 

I've been stretching for probably at least 5 years now, and still can't do the full splits or get into full lotus without using my hands.   I've made enormous progress, but stretching is not like weightlifting where you can make gains fast and basically hit your max ceiling within a year or so...

 

Yes, it is slow. And impatience isn't helpful. But I've had to push away from being too patient, I think.

 

I'm reading the PDF now..


I'm just trying to be somebody I can talk to in the morning with a smile


#19 silent thunder

silent thunder

    Oneironaut

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 3277 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:South Bay, California
  • Interests:Rain, Nature, Qi Gong, Nei Gong, Meditation, Kung Fu, Camping, Photography, Sacred Geometry, Lucid Dreaming, OBE's, Solfeggio Harmonics, Cymatics, Humorous Stuff...

Posted 20 September 2016 - 08:07 AM

Stretching goes so much deeper than the mere soft tissues.

Hence my love affair with the far infrared sauna and deep, soft, breath based stretching all through the day, in every movement.

 

 

"here we are watching what happens when the spine returns to it's fluid origins...

we have to remember that bone is connective tissue and that it is filled with fluid."

 

vibrancy and potency of fluid dynamics in bone

bone began in the oceans

bone health is maintained through flexibility and dexterity


  • Taomeow, gendao, joeblast and 2 others said thanks

Not one raindrop has ever fallen in the wrong spot... there are no accidents.

Everything I Love and Everything I Hate come from the Same Source.

I don't believe everything I think.

stop glorifying busy


#20 Vajra Fist

Vajra Fist

    Dao Bum

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 171 posts
  • Gender:None Selected

Posted 20 September 2016 - 11:33 AM

That's incredible. Can it be learned from dvd?

#21 dust

dust

    灰眼胡

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 2440 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 20 September 2016 - 11:50 AM

Stretching goes so much deeper than the mere soft tissues.

Hence my love affair with the far infrared sauna and deep, soft, breath based stretching all through the day, in every movement.

 

 

"here we are watching what happens when the spine returns to it's fluid origins...

we have to remember that bone is connective tissue and that it is filled with fluid."

 

Cool video. I have seen it once before. Not sure what she's actually saying half the time, though.

"The inclusivity of a species' abundance becomes apparent as we enter into this vast and mysterious world of fluid." ...?

 

Either way, these kind of movements are something to work on for sure.


I'm just trying to be somebody I can talk to in the morning with a smile


#22 dust

dust

    灰眼胡

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 2440 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 20 September 2016 - 11:52 AM

Damo Mitchell on stretching:

 

http://www.scholarsa...-internal-arts/

 

This video made a big difference for me then.

 

Thanks. I knew he was very flexible though wasn't aware of such a talk. Watching now!


Edited by dustybeijing, 20 September 2016 - 11:53 AM.

I'm just trying to be somebody I can talk to in the morning with a smile


#23 silent thunder

silent thunder

    Oneironaut

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 3277 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:South Bay, California
  • Interests:Rain, Nature, Qi Gong, Nei Gong, Meditation, Kung Fu, Camping, Photography, Sacred Geometry, Lucid Dreaming, OBE's, Solfeggio Harmonics, Cymatics, Humorous Stuff...

Posted 20 September 2016 - 07:26 PM

Cool video. I have seen it once before. Not sure what she's actually saying half the time, though.

"The inclusivity of a species' abundance becomes apparent as we enter into this vast and mysterious world of fluid." ...?

 

Either way, these kind of movements are something to work on for sure.

I think that statement is an allusion to the concept of morphic fields and shared/stored energy of a species.

 

That's incredible. Can it be learned from dvd?

I've not looked into it, but the name associated would be Susan Harper I believe.


Not one raindrop has ever fallen in the wrong spot... there are no accidents.

Everything I Love and Everything I Hate come from the Same Source.

I don't believe everything I think.

stop glorifying busy


#24 dust

dust

    灰眼胡

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 2440 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 10 October 2016 - 03:37 AM

The rigid person is a disciple of death; the soft, supple, and delicate are lovers of life.

An army that is inflexible will not conquer; a tree that is inflexible will snap.
The unyielding and mighty shall be brought low; the soft, supple, and delicate will be set above.

(76)

 

Nothing under heaven is softer or weaker than water, and yet nothing is better for attacking what is hard and strong.

(78)

 

 

 

On another note,

 

What are your most / least flexible portions?

 

Do you find that different muscles / muscle groups require different treatment / stretching routines?

 

Do you find that basic qigong and/or Taiji alone are sufficient for maintaining your suppleness?


  • CloudHands said thanks for this

I'm just trying to be somebody I can talk to in the morning with a smile


#25 sagebrush

sagebrush

    Dao Bum

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 397 posts

Posted 10 October 2016 - 04:20 AM

I did not like the video. I cried.not that that matters.

 

not sure if it is fear or angst about WTF is going on or WTF is going to happen in my life. let me not forget to add that I wonder about OTHER LIVES AS WELL........

 

people go their whole life without intrinsic movements.....

 

do you think john butler has a supple spine and fluid pulsing through....I doubt it.

 

I rate it as an extremist video...

 

maybe on simple suppleness of ones spine and the fluid it is not big deal...

 

stretching and movement are healthy_ I would not refute that....

 

I pray that my day is simple. Simple in the manner of my emotions.....

allowing the day to unfold as it does...

 

 

wondering what you are quoting about the tree not snapping...etc etc.is this from susan harpers book?

 

watching my own pitfalls.....I will begin to sand two wrought iron rails....and pay attention to my whatever I pay attention to

 

I will be on steps at on exterior entry way..

 

running errands and wondering WTF.....

 

extremist

 

very rigid in all categories...except willows blowing in the wind....

I can dig on the nature part of flexibility.....

and adding movement besides career moving ladders(24 ft) aluminum and whatever is labor in my work.

 

can I just be me or do I need to modify?


Edited by sagebrush, 10 October 2016 - 04:28 AM.


#26 dust

dust

    灰眼胡

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 2440 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 10 October 2016 - 04:43 AM

I did not like the video. I cried.not that that matters.
 
not sure if it is fear or angst about WTF is going on or WTF is going to happen in my life. let me not forget to add that I wonder about OTHER LIVES AS WELL........
 
people go their whole life without intrinsic movements.....
 
do you think john butler has a supple spine and fluid pulsing through....I doubt it.
 
I rate it as an extremist video...
 
maybe on simple suppleness of ones spine and the fluid it is not big deal...
 
stretching and movement are healthy_ I would not refute that....
 
I pray that my day is simple. Simple in the manner of my emotions.....
allowing the day to unfold as it does...

 

I'm curious that it elicited such an extreme response. I still have some difficulty deciphering her language, but the video itself, the movement.. well, I'd agree that the ability to move and manipulate the spine is more fundamental than we modern humans realize.

 

wondering what you are quoting about the tree not snapping...etc etc.is this from susan harpers book?
 
watching my own pitfalls.....I will begin to sand two wrought iron rails....and pay attention to my whatever I pay attention to
 
I will be on steps at on exterior entry way..
 
running errands and wondering WTF.....
 
extremist
 
very rigid in all categories...except willows blowing in the wind....
I can dig on the nature part of flexibility.....
and adding movement besides career moving ladders(24 ft) aluminum and whatever is labor in my work.
 
can I just be me or do I need to modify?

 

The quotes are from (Mair's translation of) the DDJ! (I wasn't responding to anything about the spinal wave video.)

 

You can be you and modify, if you allow that part of being you is modifying when you feel the need to.


I'm just trying to be somebody I can talk to in the morning with a smile


#27 silent thunder

silent thunder

    Oneironaut

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 3277 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:South Bay, California
  • Interests:Rain, Nature, Qi Gong, Nei Gong, Meditation, Kung Fu, Camping, Photography, Sacred Geometry, Lucid Dreaming, OBE's, Solfeggio Harmonics, Cymatics, Humorous Stuff...

Posted 10 October 2016 - 09:28 AM

We store so many memories in our bodies. 

 

I recall how this was demonstrated in a year of intense study in body work back during my acting lifetime, that brought deep memories and past experiences to the surface for many of the participants.  We would spend hours playing Cat Yoga, over and over until we were exhausted physically.  Then we would rehearse.  The intention was to strip away all of our usual personal physical tendencies, in order to clear the palette and be able to more readily access a new language of physicality for the character you were bringing to life.

 

In the process, we also engaged in deep tissue massage, eye gazing and rhythmic, cyclical partner and solo breathing.

 

We were all deeply affected by the process, but on several occasions, and one in particular, we all were stunned when one of our number, suddenly recalled years of severe, childhood abuse in our presence.  There were eight of us who worked together for thousands of hours that year and when she broke down, we all spontaneously went to her and laid our hands on her as she lay on the floor weeping.  We all held her and held space for her as the wave passed.  I recall it like it was this morning...

 

And it was as painful as it was beautiful and inspiring.  The way we all came together around her as one.  The way the memory and the emotion opened in her like a great weeping flower, which was then nourished in the presence of all of us, who loved each other and knew each other so well...

 

It pointed out viscerally, just how deeply we carry the resonance and blockages of memories and emotional waves into the vibration of our very muscular essence.

 

edit: spelling


Edited by silent thunder, 10 October 2016 - 09:32 AM.

  • liminal_luke, cheya, CloudHands and 2 others said thanks

Not one raindrop has ever fallen in the wrong spot... there are no accidents.

Everything I Love and Everything I Hate come from the Same Source.

I don't believe everything I think.

stop glorifying busy


#28 CloudHands

CloudHands

    Dao Bum

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 622 posts
  • Gender:None Selected

Posted 21 October 2016 - 03:30 AM

The rigid person is a disciple of death; the soft, supple, and delicate are lovers of life.

An army that is inflexible will not conquer; a tree that is inflexible will snap.
The unyielding and mighty shall be brought low; the soft, supple, and delicate will be set above.

(76)

 

Nothing under heaven is softer or weaker than water, and yet nothing is better for attacking what is hard and strong.

(78)

 

 

 

On another note,

 

What are your most / least flexible portions?

 

Do you find that different muscles / muscle groups require different treatment / stretching routines?

 

Do you find that basic qigong and/or Taiji alone are sufficient for maintaining your suppleness?

 

There is no basic tai chi training. One goes where he can/wants to go. If one wants to dig he will have to do more than basic. 

 

Specific treatment ? Depends on what you need. I had to work the right upper back then the right leg to relieve my knee. Now it's the lower back (it generally lacks of flexibility for men) and still the waist and the ankles. All is good to stretch but my needs are tightly tied to my history.

 

A good teacher is a healer plus someone able to guide a student on paths so anything like that is deeply individual and personal  that's why I keep saying anytime about these things don't study lonely by yourself if that's something of importance you're ready to put time and energy into.


Edited by CloudHands, 21 October 2016 - 03:31 AM.

The bright blessed day, the dark sacred night.

#29 cheya

cheya

    Dao Bum

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 877 posts
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:N. Carolina
  • Interests:Internal energy work, alternative health

Posted 21 October 2016 - 04:49 AM

Can anyone offer insight into what I've been told is called 'sinew stretching'?

 

The way I've been showed it, it seems a little like PNF. A partner gently pushes the limb into the stretched position, while the person being stretched simultaneously pushes against the stretch -- but only enough so that the limb/muscle in question moves very slowly into the stretch.

 

For example if I want to stretch hamstrings, I lie down on floor/table and a partner lifts my leg up, pushing it gently but firmly towards my torso, as I push back as if trying to return my leg to the floor/table. But I never push back so hard as to prevent the leg being stretched.

 

Is this along the lines that anyone else has practiced?

 

 

This sounds like resistance stretching, which I have found incredibly effective. Dara Torres, the swimmer who came back to the olympics at the age of 31 after having a baby.... and placed against the teenagers... has a book and DVDs that explain the technique.  They show you how to use it to stretch (and strengthen) 20 odd muscles, mostly without needing a partner. She has credited resistance stretching with her ability to make that comeback.

 

 I use this in my bodywork practice, and the changes in flexibility are often kind of astonishing, especially on people who are actually in holding patterns and have just forgotten how to let go of some muscles (sensory-motor amnesia, just means you've lost track of the muscle's "off button") With some people the tightness is more... like concrete... even with the resistance stretching, they don't let go as much. But it is still effective in most cases, just not always kind of miraculous.  :D

 

Find her books and DVDs on Amazon.

https://www.amazon.c...Torres,aps,1754


  • johndoe2012, Jeff and dust said thanks for this
"The mind follows the body
like the stream clings to the earth."
— Waysun Liao, Nine Nights with the Taoist Master

#30 dust

dust

    灰眼胡

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 2440 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 21 October 2016 - 09:30 AM

There is no basic tai chi training. One goes where he can/wants to go. If one wants to dig he will have to do more than basic.

 

My mistake in writing. 'basic' was paired only with 'qigong' in my head. Could read it instead as "Taiji or basic qigong". All I meant to ask is: I know many on TDB only practice these internal arts, and are they alone enough for your flexibility needs?

 

And I'm sure someone will tell me that there's no such thing as 'basic qigong' either. But, well, I practice Baduanjin, and after so long it seems pretty simple/basic compared to other qigong practices.

 

 

 

A good teacher is a healer plus someone able to guide a student on paths so anything like that is deeply individual and personal  that's why I keep saying anytime about these things don't study lonely by yourself if that's something of importance you're ready to put time and energy into.

 

I am not a good student....

 

And I don't know that there is a specific person who I want to have as a teacher anyway, or a specific practice I want to learn. I'm just floating around.


I'm just trying to be somebody I can talk to in the morning with a smile


#31 Rishi Das

Rishi Das

    Dao Bum

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 460 posts
  • Gender:Male

Posted 21 October 2016 - 10:00 AM

cool thread dustybeijing. i am also very interested in movement, mobility, flexibility and wellbeing.

 

years ago i stumbled upon a movement specialist named Ido Portal. his philosophy and take on movement changed me and my practice which in turn has transformed my body.

 

i would encourage you to look into some of his work if these videos interest you.

 

 


Edited by Rishi Das, 21 October 2016 - 10:50 AM.

  • dust said thanks for this

“May what I do flow from me like a river, no forcing and no holding back, the way it is with children.”- Rainer Maria Rilke
 


#32 Taomeow

Taomeow

    Dao Bum

  • The Dao Bums
  • Pip
  • 6940 posts
  • Gender:Female

Posted 21 October 2016 - 10:46 AM


 

On another note,

 

What are your most / least flexible portions?

 

Do you find that different muscles / muscle groups require different treatment / stretching routines?

 

Do you find that basic qigong and/or Taiji alone are sufficient for maintaining your suppleness?

 

1.  This depends on my diet.  I am at peak flexibility if I avoid all grains.  Less so if I eat some.  And the least flexible when I fall off the gluten-free wagon.   Nothing glues your joints together worse than the glue.

 

2. Yes, absolutely.  E.g. very few yoga stretches are compatible with taiji, and none of the ones that lock the joints or overstretch the ligaments or both.  A prime example is Snake Creeps Down.  It is very easy to do the yoga way, very hard to do the taiji way.  The taiji way relies on elongating the spine, opening the qua, smoothly operating the psoas up and down, and being able to transfer the weight/qi/power from the back to the front 100-0 to 0-100 -- to name a few intricacies.  The yoga way is easy peasy, you just stretch out the ligaments, this requires no leg strength, no joints control, no spine "unfusion," no internal muscles involvement.  So, this has to be done the taiji way for a real deep impact.

 

3. Yes.


Edited by Taomeow, 21 October 2016 - 10:47 AM.

  • gendao, Uroboros, joeblast and 2 others said thanks
>^..^<





Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: stretching, mobility, flexibility

0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users