DZOGCHEN & QUANTUM MECHANICS

[Wells]

.

Edited October 28, 2014 by ZOOM

[GrandmasterP]

This much I do know as I share a faculty refectory with some 'Quantum Mechanics' ( superstringers really but same old and they used to be Quantum until the research funding for that dried up and they switched).

You can take this to the bank lads...

Not even 'Quantum Mechanics' researchers understand quantum mechanics fully - hence any thread with "QM & X " in its title online is speculative at best and pure BS at worst.

Edited September 4, 2014 by GrandmasterP

[Brian]

I must not be expressing myself well. Let me try a different approach...

 

 

You say that "creating a specific state (which can be described by scientific quantum, wave & field theory) in your mind / brain and expanding that state to the whole matter of your body, in effect transforming ("releasing") your complete being into it's wave state and achiving multidimensionality, or even overdimensionality" "follows the rules in established scientific models & theories."

 

I don't see any commonality between those two quoted phrases, other than the use of sciency expressions like "scientific quantum, wave & field theory." Help me understand the scientificality of "releasing your complete being into it's wave state and achiving multidimensionality, or even overdimensionality." Is that a theory, a postulate, a condition, an assumption or what? I'm trying to figure out what an experimentalist would be looking for.

[Brian]

This much I do know as I share a faculty refectory with some 'Quantum Mechanics' ( superstringers really but same old and they used to be Quantum until the research funding for that dried up and they switched).

You can take this to the bank lads...

Not even 'Quantum Mechanics' researchers understand quantum mechanics fully - hence any thread with "QM & X " in its title online is speculative at best and pure BS at worst.

My personal belief is that we are approaching a moment like in the mid- to late-19^th century, when Scientists^TM had it all figured out. Then, as they sought to nail down the last few details, the cracks started to appear. Things like the blackbody problem and Michaelson-Morley (which ought to be revisited...)

 

I believe a change is in the air.

[Wells]

.

Edited October 28, 2014 by ZOOM

[Zhongyongdaoist]

Interesting thread Zoom, I have only had time to skim it, but wish I had time to read it in detail and comment more.

 

My personal belief is that we are approaching a moment like in the mid- to late-19^th century, when Scientists^TM had it all figured out. Then, as they sought to nail down the last few details, the cracks started to appear. Things like the blackbody problem and Michaelson-Morley (which ought to be revisited...)

I believe a change is in the air.

 

It was Maxwell whose equations were the writing on the wall, it took Einstein to play Daniel and read them correctly and see their real implications. This is why:

 

Not even 'Quantum Mechanics' researchers understand quantum mechanics fully . . .

 

They keep trying to interpret the implication of Plank's constant in a bottom up cosmology that no longer appears to work and never really could.

 

Yes, there is profound change coming, but I suspect it is coming more from information theoretical approaches and not from 'string' theory with its eerie resemblance to such failed Nineteenth century theories 'vortex atoms'.

 

I don't have time for further discussion, but will come back to see how Brian and Zoom work this out.

[goldisheavy]

This supports my own conviction, that significant meditation (at least for Dzogchen purposes) happens in the GAMMA RANGE!,

the range of utmost conscious alertness & attentiveness!

 

How do you use this knowledge in day to day practice?

[Wells]

.

Edited October 28, 2014 by ZOOM

[Wells]

.

Edited October 28, 2014 by ZOOM

[Wells]

.

Edited October 28, 2014 by ZOOM

[mla7]

hi,

 

Zoom, you said:

 

As far as I understand Jax' interpretation, successful Dzogchen practice,

which finally leads to your complete being (including your material body) being "released" into a permanent wave state,

creates during training an extremely high-frequent, high-amplitude, highly coherent holographic electro-magnetic wave phenomenon inside your brain.

 

Are you aware of Jackson Peterson saying anywhere that:

1: he personally knows (or knew) anyone who attained rainbow body?

2: that he expects to attain rainbow body himself (or already has to some degree)?

 

If so, could you direct me to where he says this? I would be really interested to know more.

[Wells]

.

Edited October 28, 2014 by ZOOM

[Wells]

.

Edited October 28, 2014 by ZOOM

[joeblast]

Interesting thread Zoom, I have only had time to skim it, but wish I had time to read it in detail and comment more.

 

 

It was Maxwell whose equations were the writing on the wall, it took Einstein to play Daniel and read them correctly and see their real implications. This is why:

 

 

They keep trying to interpret the implication of Plank's constant in a bottom up cosmology that no longer appears to work and never really could.

 

Yes, there is profound change coming, but I suspect it is coming more from information theoretical approaches and not from 'string' theory with its eerie resemblance to such failed Nineteenth century theories 'vortex atoms'.

 

I don't have time for further discussion, but will come back to see how Brian and Zoom work this out.

"works" depends on context - i.e. what level of approximation is acceptable.

this is why, QM is approximation.

just as GR is.

just as newtonian mechanics is.

 

After having trained for some time in and having achieved a certain (hopefully: high) success in this first base exercise to create a high level of mental intensity & pureness,

it's time to implement the second base exercise I was already talking about in this thread:

http://thetaobums.com/topic/35799-the-most-direct-training-practice-in-dzogchen/

to "Turn the Light around and Shine Back" at its source to achieve some kind of "short-circuit" in your mind and to focus this refined mental force at yourself.

According to my own logic and to the essays from Jax I read, this leads to a "backfilling" (storing up) effect of your mental energy and in ultimate effect to enlightenment and rainbow body.

Too simple to be true?

I don't think so.

All the usual mumbo-jumbo is just stripped away and all is reduced to its true pure essence.

Also, this way is simple but it's also very hard daily work.

Sitting for a long time in a cave and practicing very hard all time awake while staring at the wall surely increases the chances of high success while having to live and function in western society surely diminishes it.

haha, short circuit. in a way, perhaps.

 

but it is nothing more than the superlative conditioning of habit energies, thoughtstreamenergy potential being insufficient to motivate thought, instead the focus of awareness at the niwan arrests these potentials before they manifest,

 

so the key is they ongoing dynamics of the shining awareness utilizing potentials to turn them around to their source before it is allowed to collect, become idle, and spontaneously move.

 

this is why I was laughing at that doofus who says I dont say anything about xing and ming - I didnt use those words right there, but I sure as hell did

[Wells]

.

Edited October 28, 2014 by ZOOM

[joeblast]

you cant even tell when I'm agreeing with you and when I'm not

[Wells]

.

Edited October 28, 2014 by ZOOM

[asunthatneversets]

you cant even tell when I'm agreeing with you and when I'm not

I wouldn't worry about it, it is literally a bunch of complete nonsense that isn't related to Dzogpachenpo in any way whatsoever.

[Brian]

Thought there was some rigor buried in amongst the hyperbolic bolds, underlines and caps tying the specific method obliquely described to QED in a structured fashion but the take-away is really that there are some really strong parallels and alignments between modern physics and some esoteric systems, such as Dzogchen. (see also: Dancing Wu Li Masters et al)

 

I am in absolute and complete agreement. The parallels and alignments should surprise no practitioner since both scientific pursuit and internal cultivation are drawing us closer to the Light. Experience shows that excluding neither yields more balanced results.

 

 

The relationship between brain waves and legitimate energetic practices shouldn't surprise, either. In fact, we've had at least one teacher on the forum who, when asked why he didn't set things on fire, referred to research he'd participated in relating to brain waves.

 

I would be cautious about the conclusion that a single waveform entrainment is the key, though. Our energy-bodies are more elegant than that.

 

As an aside, I think the more elegant physics statements are often the least understood because their complexity is contained within a streamlined package -- people think they've "got it" because, well, how hard can it be? I mean...

 

E=mc²

 

That little ol' thing?

 

For this discussion at hand, Planck's statement, that energy exists in discrete bundles and that energy is directly related to frequency, is pivotal:

 

E=hν

 

Jeez, that looks simple, doesn't it? It's just arithmetic.

[joeblast]

yeah, its such a pity when there is only a single word to describe a certain idea and it doesnt ever translate to other languages and cant be described in varying terms.

 

so unless I go grab the dzogchen dictionary and reformat it, its complete nonsense

[thelerner]

Putting aside quantum mechanics, I think Anna Wise has done some great work on brain waves and meditation. She spent years researching and measuring brain waves of various masters in meditation from Southern faith healers to zen masters to yogi's. Her books and guided meditation series are excellent.

 

What I found interesting was her finding that the top practitioners showed several brain waves happening simultaneously.

 

For info: http://annawise.com/awakened-mind-the-work-18

 

her guided meditations: http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/annawise (I like 1,2,4, 5 & 9)

[Wells]

.

Edited October 28, 2014 by ZOOM

[Wells]

.

Edited October 28, 2014 by ZOOM

[Wells]

.

Edited October 28, 2014 by ZOOM

[Wells]

.

Edited October 28, 2014 by ZOOM