Transmission in Christian Mysticism

[Jeff]

...

Based on occult principles it would probably depend on who gives the Baptism and prepares the Communion? Or likewise on the person receiving? Maybe Jeff can add?

...

 

The giving can make some significant difference, but the real difference is found in the "receiving" or the openness of one's heart. It is about surrender to the "divine".

[Jonesboy]

Jeff,

 

When a master sends energy/transmission to an individual. They will receive that which they are open to receive.

 

My question is when the person is feeling the energy from the transmission can a person associate such energy as an attack or in a negative fashion? Even after agreeing to such a contact?

 

Is there an astral aspect to such a transmission?

[Jeff]

Jeff,

 

When a master sends energy/transmission to an individual. They will receive that which they are open to receive.

 

My question is when the person is feeling the energy from the transmission can a person associate such energy as an attack or in a negative fashion? Even after agreeing to such a contact?

 

Is there an astral aspect to such a transmission?

 

It depends on the nature of the transmission (or energy being sent).  Some just send energy to the pleasure centers with create a very good feeling.  Some provide energy to help open channels, as the energy hits obstructions/issues/fears the person can release the issues or not.  If released, there is expansion, if not, the energy resistance can create some scary stuff as it get translated by the local mind.  Additionally, such a directed energy transmission can create it's own karma issues.

 

Yes, on the astral, but that is again more about how the receiving person perceives the energy flows.

[Jonesboy]

Thank you Jeff,

 

If you send me energy/light transmission.

 

An example of you just thinking my name with the intent to send energy.

 

I receive the energy and see snakes and other things with the energy. Is that me/local mind or is that you?

 

Can you also explain why some may feel nothing at all, others a little warmth while some may feel the energy as ecstatic or a silent mind?

Edited July 7, 2015 by Jonesboy

[Jeff]

Thank you Jeff,

 

If you send me energy/light transmission.

 

An example of you just thinking my name with the intent to send energy.

 

I receive the energy and see snakes and other things with the energy. Is that me/local mind or is that you?

 

Can you also explain why some may feel nothing at all, others a little warmth while some may feel the energy as ecstatic or a silent mind?

 

On the seeing, it really depends on the energy/transmission that is being sent.  Some people send "images" and hence you can see something.  Others send energy, so it would be more your subconscious translation of the energy into some form.

 

The differences in feeling are the same as above.  The more open one is, the more they tend to be able to perceive.  Also, people tend to either lean more towards the heart or mind.  Those who are more heart orientated tend to feel more energy/vibrations.  While those who are more mind focused tend to see things or feel shifts with the mind quieting.

[Horus]

 I didn't think post 13 would get much response since its not neato sounding, it's just the hard facts related to,  "For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required"

 

Another spin-off: "be careful what you ask for, you might get it"

 

I prefer to see that as "always choose the highest thing, and live through compassionate awareness in NOW, thus not needlessly manifesting that which you are not. With great power comes great responsibility.".

[Horus]

 It may sound cool to have the power to fight a demon, but then you will be expected to fight a demon.

 

Only if attached to said power will you create such need, to fight that is.

 

Rather "It may sound cool to have the power to fight a demon, but then you will have to take responsibility for what you do with that power".

 

And power without the skill and knowledge commensurate with said power leads to unfruitful use of power; irresponsibility.

 

Incidentally, any power to fight demons is best respected with the same love you have for any other sentient being, unconditionally - the great fight to end all fights is LOVE.

[Horus]

In later stages of development, the chakra system collapses into sort of a "unified field".

 

Thanks for this Jeff...

 

I've actually had a Prudent Body projection inside a couple of people that have this unified field.

 

It's like a normal dantien looking field of power/awareness - ie like an enormous jin dan that instead of being in the 7D equivalent of the lower abdomen - it spans way beyond confines.

 

When viewing this in two different people, I had to "lean in" to view the outer edges of the field - the body like dr who's tardis - whereas viewing someone's jin dan is just a case of looking at the space afront ming men.

 

The unified field also has a very different feel and colour - it feels like primordial 1st dimension cunsummated with all dimensions into a unified field of accumulated awarenesses - and the palate is like a setting sun, yet primordial pastel colours merge throughout unconstrained by 3d concepts such as swirls or streaks of colour. To me its the seat of God Consciousness - and actually thes colours therein reminded me distinctly of another projection I achieved only once - a projection into what I might call the primordial Garden - a place where original Source created another Source, who under "him" had created other Gods and Goddesses that populated the earth (before any fall).

 

The two individuals with the unified field are the only individuals I have ever viewed with such a field. I've seen others with a full tai chi in there, but none with the unified field like that.

 

Advanced initiates they both were.

[Horus]

Generally speaking, I and others have been “going to” or in other words, psychically aligning with any such person or area, and then rendering the desired effects via intention. On more rare occasions I have also aligned with, “God/the intent at large” and intended that Its' intent be manifest. A subtle awareness of the feelings which run throughout the body, are dependable indicators of both the initial contact and the degree of success in the casting/transmission. Repeated castings render cumulative effect.

 

Thanks very much for sharing this...by "rendering desired effects via intention", do you mean just that - plain and simple?

 

Or do you mean that intent be activated with regard to fluxing or emission of light from a given center...?

 

I'm presuming you meant just intent, as it reads - just felt like I'd like more clarity there.

 

ie I can create flow in another/or a center, earth center, star what have you... at a distance just intending it, but then I can also pump it, inject it, flow it through, invisible needle it etc..

 

But you are talking about activating a given state of flow just by intending it, yes?

[Horus]

In a light transmission, the sending party "knows" there is really no separate person and just directly shares presence. Also, knows they are one with consciousness and hence "skips" the concept of local mind or being, and just lets the "light" directly flow through. It happens in the "inner heart" or soul to soul.

 

Best,

Jeff

 

Hmmm, pretty

 

 

It happens in the "inner heart" or soul to soul.

 

Is the "inner heart" a white flame in said tradition?

 

Inside myself there is a golden disk (jin dan) at LDT afront the Mingmen, above that inside MDT there is a big fat white flame, and above that in UDT there is a growing degree of reflected light from the flame below...to me that represents soul in three ascending/descending states. I feel through observing this, or know without knowing that when the capacity or rate of vibration ascends sufficiently - all these fields merge into one field.

 

What then is the difference between a chakra and a dantien in that process?

[Horus]

Surrender is easy to talk about, but when it feels like your body is rearranging and you are being zapped with a million volts, it is very easy to flinch...

 

There's a story about an old man that was wanting to see the Buddha, but the disciples turned him away as foolish.

 

The old man was ready to die, and was considering jumping off a cliff...

 

The Buddha came and found him, asking him why he wanted to see him.

 

In effect, the man said his life is over, he has no more reason to live - he came across your camp and thought, oh well, why not see this Buddha.

 

The Buddha took this old man as a disciple, and directed him to meditate in a nearby graveyard.

 

The man took up the offer...

 

To the surprise of the other disciples, this old man advanced very rapidly and soon realised enlightenment.

 

"How did he do it so fast, master?" exclaimed the other disciples to their Buddha.

 

"He was already done with the body, so letting go was just a matter of simple focused intent".

 

The graveyard helped in that he was the impermanence of life, he simply let his body "rot" to him and released himself from its bondage.

[Horus]

Jeff, Do you have "the intent of Mastery"?  Or even high Mastery?

 

In your context, what I'm really asking is, "Do you intend to gain such a level of consciousness as that of a Christ or similar figure?"  Or have you crossed into such level(s) on various occasions already?

 

If so to any of the above, then I would fuirther ask, "What specific focuses or practices do you engage, or which are recommended from your teachings' tradition, to gain a Masters' level?

 

Nice Q.

[Horus]

 I have found that one does not "gain" mastery, rather one "clears" the obstructions that hide what we have always been. Call it a Buddha or a child of God, it does not matter, the process is much more like remembering than learning.

 

Simple wisdom, BOOM, Jeff!

 

Regarding practices, I think it is highly dependent on the where the person is in their own development. I do believe that late stage practices are critical and much of that knowledge has been lost to humanity. True light transmission is an example of that.

 

I've discussed this at length with a lot of passion unto Source/God and my Guides...that the higher level practices are not "here for me". They patiently keep assuring that "when you and humanity are ready, the knowledge will present itself to you. That is how the higher teachings came before, that is how they shall return again and not before".

 

But, if you (or anyone) is interested, I would be happy to discuss issues and possible practices for various levels in spiritual development.

 

I'd love to hear this...would the foundation to your Christian Mysticism tradition be similar to what we might presume is covered in a text like:

 

The Seven Christian Initiations in the Gospel of St John    By Kristina Kaine

 

Or can you suggest another foundation text?

[Horus]

Yours is what might be called the "passive/acceptance" stance, ("let go, let God") whereas I tend to lean to the opposite extreme...."active/self initiative"  ("if not me then who?").  In the case of "self initiative", the practitioner tends to take all responsibility onto themselves, ("take individual responsiblity and often exclusive action").  It occurs to me that a seemless combination of these two modes of action, in different proportion at different times,  would be considered "the middle path" in Tao and thereby more effective.  What do you think?

 

BOOM!

 

Love it...

 

I've always perceived this and always naturally gravitated to both paths leading to the same point, like I just couldn't help myself but embody both.

 

I didn't though make the middle path connection so figuratively, so thanks

 

Though I have witnessed that the highest evolved being that I know is more aligned with the First "path"...

 

A child-like, simplistic, passive, unquestioned, unwavering acceptance - and an unwillingness to "require" any practice but effortless right action and the highest choice in every moment in thought, word, deed.

 

But then, that is a person who was born whole, fully awakened - a spiritual master of the highest returning.

 

But then other similar masters come back and adhere to process very naturally.

 

Personally, as I said, I embrace both and pull them together to one unified point; LOVE.

[Horus]

Kundalini is not the Holy Spirit.

 

Actually, it's not the first time I have read this, that Kundalini is an aspect of the Holy Spirit. It can be found in Gnostic Christian Mystic Texts, and Alchemical reference - essentially that the Holy Spirit (sexual energy) is the fallen aspect of Holy Spirit having descended from the Garden Of Eden (the brain and collective nerve centres) down into the Gonads.,

 

"The Book of Genesis tells us very explicitly that the one who makes the universe is

the Holy Spirit. The one who creates is the Holy Spirit. Many times we have stated in

our lectures that the Holy Spirit in the human organism, and in any organism, relates

to the sexual force, the sexual energy. God is not a person, it is an energy. God as the

Holy Spirit is the sexual force that we carry in our genitalia. We the Gnostics always

put a lot of attention, a lot of emphasis, in the sexual energy because without it there

is no creation."

 

Kabbalah of Genesis, a Free Online

Course

The Garden of Eden (1) written by Samael Aun Weor

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samael_Aun_Weor

 

There are many divergent systems that all lead to the same place, LOVE.

 

i value your presence and underlying intention TI, but on the contrary - footnoted references or not I have really enjoyed Jeff's posts here in this thread.

 

Actually, he has renewed several vigours within me in this, just as you have at other times.

 

I can only suggest that you try dropping the magnanimous righteousness and take up humble, accepting observation in this light.

[Tibetan_Ice]

Actually, it's not the first time I have read this, that Kundalini is an aspect of the Holy Spirit. It can be found in Gnostic Christian Mystic Texts, and Alchemical reference - essentially that the Holy Spirit (sexual energy) is the fallen aspect of Holy Spirit having descended from the Garden Of Eden (the brain and collective nerve centres) down into the Gonads.,

 

"The Book of Genesis tells us very explicitly that the one who makes the universe is

the Holy Spirit. The one who creates is the Holy Spirit. Many times we have stated in

our lectures that the Holy Spirit in the human organism, and in any organism, relates

to the sexual force, the sexual energy. God is not a person, it is an energy. God as the

Holy Spirit is the sexual force that we carry in our genitalia. We the Gnostics always

put a lot of attention, a lot of emphasis, in the sexual energy because without it there

is no creation."

 

Kabbalah of Genesis, a Free Online

Course

The Garden of Eden (1) written by Samael Aun Weor

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samael_Aun_Weor

 

There are many divergent systems that all lead to the same place, LOVE.

 

i value your presence and underlying intention TI, but on the contrary - footnoted references or not I have really enjoyed Jeff's posts here in this thread.

 

Actually, he has renewed several vigours within me in this, just as you have at other times.

 

I can only suggest that you try dropping the magnanimous righteousness and take up humble, accepting observation in this light.

The difference between knowledge and wisdom is that wisdom comes from experience.

[Jeff]

Hmmm, pretty

 

Is the "inner heart" a white flame in said tradition?

 

Inside myself there is a golden disk (jin dan) at LDT afront the Mingmen, above that inside MDT there is a big fat white flame, and above that in UDT there is a growing degree of reflected light from the flame below...to me that represents soul in three ascending/descending states. I feel through observing this, or know without knowing that when the capacity or rate of vibration ascends sufficiently - all these fields merge into one field.

 

What then is the difference between a chakra and a dantien in that process?

 

I think we are describing slightly deferent things. In your terms, the soul would be above the UDT and sort of on a different quantum level. Or you could say that it is at a different level of refinement.

 

As you are describing it, there is not really a major difference between a dantien and chakra. Both are sort of a mental mapping in (local) mind. Different traditions map the stored issues/fears in different "buckets" at the mind level. That is why different traditions have different numbers of chakras (3, 5, 6, 7 or 12, etc...). Think of it more like underneath it all you are a light blob that is obstructed. Clear away the stored energy structures of issues, fears and obstructions and you find what I am calling the "unified field" (light body).

[Bindi]

Hmmm, pretty

 

 

 

Is the "inner heart" a white flame in said tradition?

 

Inside myself there is a golden disk (jin dan) at LDT afront the Mingmen, above that inside MDT there is a big fat white flame, and above that in UDT there is a growing degree of reflected light from the flame below...to me that represents soul in three ascending/descending states. I feel through observing this, or know without knowing that when the capacity or rate of vibration ascends sufficiently - all these fields merge into one field.

 

What then is the difference between a chakra and a dantien in that process?

 

From what I can gather the dantian system and the chakra system are interrelated but separate systems.

 

It seems to me that the dantian system responds to certain physical postures, whereas the chakra system primarily responds to emotions.

 

But they’re interrelated in that the chakra system has to be cleared to a certain extent before the dantian system should be worked with, and then when the dantian system has been completed to a great extent work on the chakra system should be resumed.

 

Maybe dantians/chakras are like a higher level yin/yang system, like ida and pingala are simpler level yin/yang systems. This might be why it is not useful to try and compare the two systems, because they’re really chalk and cheese, but both equally important of course.

 

I personally believe that the gold disc itself has to ascend to the MDT and then the UDT.

[Bindi]

Actually, it's not the first time I have read this, that Kundalini is an aspect of the Holy Spirit. It can be found in Gnostic Christian Mystic Texts, and Alchemical reference - essentially that the Holy Spirit (sexual energy) is the fallen aspect of Holy Spirit having descended from the Garden Of Eden (the brain and collective nerve centres) down into the Gonads.,

 

"The Book of Genesis tells us very explicitly that the one who makes the universe is

the Holy Spirit. The one who creates is the Holy Spirit. Many times we have stated in

our lectures that the Holy Spirit in the human organism, and in any organism, relates

to the sexual force, the sexual energy. God is not a person, it is an energy. God as the

Holy Spirit is the sexual force that we carry in our genitalia. We the Gnostics always

put a lot of attention, a lot of emphasis, in the sexual energy because without it there

is no creation."

 

Kabbalah of Genesis, a Free Online

Course

The Garden of Eden (1) written by Samael Aun Weor

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samael_Aun_Weor

 

There are many divergent systems that all lead to the same place, LOVE.

 

i value your presence and underlying intention TI, but on the contrary - footnoted references or not I have really enjoyed Jeff's posts here in this thread.

 

Actually, he has renewed several vigours within me in this, just as you have at other times.

 

I can only suggest that you try dropping the magnanimous righteousness and take up humble, accepting observation in this light.

 

I agree that God is not a person, it is an energy, and most likely the very fabric of the universes, but that energy is surely the purest form of unconditional love imaginable. The Holy Spirit which represents that energy must then surely be associated with that same unconditional love energy. 

 

As far as I can gather, this quality of energy 'descends', and is associated with the crown chakra. In Christian terminology it is 'the descent of the Holy Spirit', for example in Acts 2:2-4: “Suddenly there came from heaven a noise like a violent, rushing wind, and it filled the whole house. There appeared tongues as of fire and it sat above each one of them. And they were filled with the Holy Spirit.”

 

The fallen aspect of 'God' could be quite easily associated with kundalini that is carried near the genitals, that actually makes a lot of sense to me - what if the gnostics got it right in that sense, that there is an embodied aspect of God (not necessarily 'fallen'), but the gnostics didn't have the terminology for a separate concept of kundalini as we are familiar with it.

 

Kundalini has been associated with fire (as the fire serpent), and the central channel that kundalini needs to travel up, Brahmanadi, is also associated with fire, as is the Holy Spirit (as tongues of fire). So I would agree that these various energies and channels ultimately have the same nature, but I also agree with T_I that they have markedly different roles to play, and to lump them all in together is just confusing and unnecessary.

Edited October 30, 2015 by Bindi

[Jonesboy]

Hi Bindi,

 

I completely get your point.

 

I see repeated over and over again the separate nature of these various energies.

 

It is all just light. It is this separation that causes issues and confusion.

 

Just like with the mental mind state of seperation or duality. We are the light by any name, Holy Spirit, kundalini or universal consciousness.

 

Realizing it is all me is the key. Just like with transmission of light. You have to realize you are the light.

Edited October 30, 2015 by Jonesboy

[Bindi]

Hi bindi. Your words are somewhat similar to my experience. There is no "gold disc" that I know of. Some may have visions, but ultimately, like your statement of God as just energy - the soul is simply energy. (Ultimately, there is nothing to see.) I do agree that the refinement process is the spirit ascending from lower parts of the body to higher parts of the body. The easiest way to put, in Taoist terms, it is like you said , rising from the LDT, then "to the MDT and then the UDT."

 

Some may experience energy rising as colored visions. But to successfully raise one's spirit to the UDT, chi must be experienced in its inherent formlessness, apart from any formed representation it may have once appeared as. (Oversimplified for brevity.)

 

Hi Rainbowvein.

 

All I can suggest is that at the level I am working at, which is not an enlightened or formless state, things of the subtle body do have form, and can be worked with energetically. I personally have no problem with traversing the landscape of subtle form first on the way to formlessness. In this landscape, mainly available to me through my mother’s seeing, there is a gold disc, there are pearls, doors, gates, barriers, stairs, a palace, a tunnel, etc, etc. These images are not meditation phantasms, they’re not auras, I understand them as indicative of the underlying reality of the subtle body at specific points in time which must be traversed whether they are seen or not.

 

Much like the chakras are there whether they’re seen or not, and whether one believes in them or not.

 

To see or not see any of these things doesn’t change their underlying reality IMO, but visual knowledge of the subtle level does help in knowing how to direct energies at any one point in time in order to progress as efficiently as possible, directions which change regularly.

 

The quote below captures the sense of these ‘images’ in a positive light.

 

Increasingly able to let life and the body go on changing as they please, they can forget themselves and dissolve into the higher patterns of the Dao. This Dao, in the Daoist context, however, is not just a flow of energies, but populated by gods, spirits, and other supernatural entities. As the practitioner becomes more attuned to his life and body as the universe, he or she also comes to actively perceive the gods and spirits as inhabitants of the human body. The body and thus the self becomes increasingly a microcosmic replica of the starry heavens above, full of palaces and chambers, towers and terraces, gods and immortals. The deities who reside in the paradises of the other world are as much at home in the adept’s body, and again—as through the ingestion of the five sprouts—the adept comes to cosmicize his or her self, expanding identity into a larger sphere.

 

http://abodetao.com/daoism-and-the-origins-of-qigong/

[3bob]

I'd say the light is a result of what we most deeply are, then that light is woven into a soul.

[Bindi]

Hi Bindi,

 

I completely get your point.

 

I see repeated over and over again the separate nature of these various energies.

 

It is all just light. It is this separation that causes issues and confusion.

 

Just like with the mental mind state of seperation or duality. We are the light by any name, Holy Spirit, kundalini or universal consciousness.

 

Realizing it is all me is the key. Just like with transmission of light. You have to realize you are the light.

 

 

 

 

But I do differentiate between these forms. For instance I don't think kundalini plays like tongues of fire above the head. Nor do I think that the Holy Spirit is trapped at the root chakra in the form of Kundalini.

 

I completely agree with standard Hindu teaching on kundalini residing at the root chakra, sleeping there until woken up, at which point it starts to act in the particular way kundalini acts upon us, which I believe is different to the particular way in which the Holy Spirit acts upon us.

 

Just as initiating these forms is done in different ways. Effective methods for awakening the kundalini  will not result in an experience of the Holy Spirit whereas experiencing the Holy Spirit cannot be initiated by ourselves but is through the grace of God.

 

Beyond this plane it might all be one, but for now we are on this plane, where duality must first be genuinely traversed.  This is of course just my opinion, many people believe they are functioning beyond duality right now, I just personally highly doubt it.

[dawei]

whereas experiencing the Holy Spirit cannot be initiated by ourselves but is through the grace of God.

 

Beyond this plane it might all be one, but for now we are on this plane, where duality must first be genuinely traversed.  This is of course just my opinion, many people believe they are functioning beyond duality right now, I just personally highly doubt it.

 

I think this is an interesting example to explore your second point.

 

Is the source of the initiation beyond this plane or in this plane?

Is the initiation beyond this plane or in this plane?

Is the experience beyond this plane or in this plane?

 

These might help in understanding Jesus's comment: 

 

I have given them your word, and the world has hated them because they are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. I do not ask that you take them out of the world, but that you keep them from the evil one. They are not of the world, just as I am not of the world. Sanctify them in the truth; your word is truth. As you sent me into the world, so I have sent them into the world. And for their sake I consecrate myself, that they also may be sanctified in truth.

 

This is sometimes seen in brief as the "in, but not of" statement of Jesus... or, "not of, but sent in".

 

All I am exploring here is whether there is any such boundary between this plane and beyond this plane... and that only once we seem to be able to get beyond any boundary will grasp 'in, but not of' and therefore there is passage across the boundary.

 

Steve said something interesting in another thread about his master saying the mind travels faster than the speed of light and therefore, beyond time.    This kind of 'mind-travel' (for lack of a better word) is what I've been trying to understand for some time as that appears to be an experience many people from many walks of life can attest to.

[Jonesboy]

 

 

 

But I do differentiate between these forms. For instance I don't think kundalini plays like tongues of fire above the head. Nor do I think that the Holy Spirit is trapped at the root chakra in the form of Kundalini.

 

I completely agree with standard Hindu teaching on kundalini residing at the root chakra, sleeping there until woken up, at which point it starts to act in the particular way kundalini acts upon us, which I believe is different to the particular way in which the Holy Spirit acts upon us.

 

Just as initiating these forms is done in different ways. Effective methods for awakening the kundalini will not result in an experience of the Holy Spirit whereas experiencing the Holy Spirit cannot be initiated by ourselves but is through the grace of God.

 

Beyond this plane it might all be one, but for now we are on this plane, where duality must first be genuinely traversed. This is of course just my opinion, many people believe they are functioning beyond duality right now, I just personally highly doubt it.

Hi Bindi,

 

I think we both are aware of each other's view on kundalini being universal consciousness.

 

With regard to duality and none duality.

 

Look at what you wrote and see all the seperation you are attaching to. That you are creating for yourself.

 

Just something to think about.