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#1 Lomistick

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Posted 18 November 2010 - 08:10 AM

So, I was getting really into all of the microcosmic orbit breathing techniques and I was having really cool and interesting results. I felt like I was making real progress. I think I had really opened up my back channel from the base of my spine up to my head, because I could feel energy pulsing through it. There is just one big problem. I started getting REALLY bad headaches.

These headaches aren't just normal natural headaches, it is clearly caused by my practice. I usually get them shortly after practicing (usually the next day) and they build up to an unusual strength. When I was a kid, I could always just go to sleep and my headache would always go away, but with these headaches I wake up and they are still pounding strong. Clearly I am doing something wrong.

I am assuming it's because I haven't opened up my front channel and all of the energy is getting stuck in my head. The only problem is when I use my mind or breath, or any technique to try and open the front channel to teach the energy to go back down my front into the dantien, the back channel begins pulsing and I get headaches again.

I have tried focusing solely on the dantien with my breath to keep the energy down... Headaches. I tried solely focusing on my feet to ground the energy into the Earth... more headaches.

What am I doing wrong?

I have stopped practicing all breathing due to these headaches. After I practice a long session of breathing, I am pretty much miserable for the next 2 days because of these headaches.

I have hit a serious wall here. Could anyone help me with some advice on how to prevent these headaches?


I would love to begin practicing my deep belly breathing again, but I am just dreading these pounding headaches.

Any and all help would be greatly appreciated.

#2 Apech

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Posted 18 November 2010 - 08:32 AM

Be careful - do you have a teacher? You should ask them.

Otherwise - how relaxed are you - it is very easy to get energy stuck in the head. Are the headaches migraine type i.e. light in eyes and so on?

Energy going down front is different feel to energy up back. Its more a question of letting it flow down without any effort at all.

I sometimes use a visualization of roots growing into the earth from soles of feet. Each time you breath out the roots grow deeper and deeper until they reach the center of the earth where there is a pool of cool dark water. When the roots reach this then just let all the energy flow down into the water - like an earth wire. Could try this.

Otherwise see a Doctor if headaches don't go away - just in case.

"Over himself, over his own body and mind, the individual is sovereign."  J. S. Mill

 

 


#3 Aetherous

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Posted 18 November 2010 - 09:08 AM

You should never get headaches from practice. If you do, you should stop what you're doing.

Have you tried simply practicing zhan zhuang?
Tara's Triple Excellence Buddhist program

"Motivation is the key; discipline is the key; teamwork is the key" = basic training pushup mantras.

#4 Lomistick

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Posted 18 November 2010 - 09:16 AM

You should never get headaches from practice. If you do, you should stop what you're doing.

Have you tried simply practicing zhan zhuang?


That would be why I stopped practicing.

I am currently unable to practice standing postures due to a leg injury.

Be careful - do you have a teacher? You should ask them.

Otherwise - how relaxed are you - it is very easy to get energy stuck in the head. Are the headaches migraine type i.e. light in eyes and so on?

Energy going down front is different feel to energy up back. Its more a question of letting it flow down without any effort at all.

I sometimes use a visualization of roots growing into the earth from soles of feet. Each time you breath out the roots grow deeper and deeper until they reach the center of the earth where there is a pool of cool dark water. When the roots reach this then just let all the energy flow down into the water - like an earth wire. Could try this.

Otherwise see a Doctor if headaches don't go away - just in case.


In my current life situation it is nearly impossible to get a teacher until March.

No migraine types I guess... No light in eyes.

I supposed I do not feel all that relaxed when I am doing the breathing.

The headaches always go away within a couple days.

I like your root visualization practice.



I am confused though. I thought deep belly breathing was supposed to be safe, easy, and beneficial.

Why does focusing energy and moving it through my body cause such headaches?

#5 Apech

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Posted 18 November 2010 - 09:21 AM

Well I agree with Scotty ... so suggest don't do any energy practices without guidance ... especially forced stuff.

Take it easy ... you could just sit and watch breaths ... you need to do this first anyway ...

"Over himself, over his own body and mind, the individual is sovereign."  J. S. Mill

 

 


#6 Lomistick

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Posted 18 November 2010 - 09:52 AM

Asking me if I have a teacher or telling me to get a teacher is pretty pointless.

I used to do qi gong and tai chi quan every day for 2-3 hours with a teacher over the course of a year. The practices I am currently doing have been taught to me by qualified teachers, but I have never had such a problem with them before. This really started happening recently after my spinal channel began pulsing with energy.

Unfortunately for me, I currently live in Yokohama Japan, and I can not exactly go to my local convenience store and order a microcosmic orbit and sexual energy teacher.

I can't remember my old teachers holding my hand every step of the way. I also can't remember accidentally exploding my eyeballs because my teacher wasn't there to supervise me at that exact moment. The fact of the matter is that most of our practice is on our own.

I came here seeking advice on how to progress further safely and healthily. Any advice would be appreciated.

Edited by Lomistick, 18 November 2010 - 09:57 AM.


#7 freeform

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Posted 18 November 2010 - 10:18 AM

Energy is going up, but not coming down. Deep breathing only fuels the energy.

Do ankle rotations. Get a tennis ball and roll it under your feet for a while.

when you've done that for a while you can learn to open your front channel.

#8 Apech

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Posted 18 November 2010 - 11:20 AM

...<snip>

I came here seeking advice on how to progress further safely and healthily. Any advice would be appreciated.


You have to understand that it is hard to give advice on here without background and details - I got the impression that you had just started to do the breathing exercises. If you have done a lot of Qi Gong then presumably you have a good understanding about the channels and orbit.

There are a lot of experienced practitioners on here - so hopefully further advice will come soon.

"Over himself, over his own body and mind, the individual is sovereign."  J. S. Mill

 

 


#9 pilot

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Posted 18 November 2010 - 11:53 AM

I don't think zhan zhuang will help you. I can't say anything about 'healing tao' since I stay away from it. If you focus on the "gates" healing tao recommends, Yang Jwing-Ming says this will only stagnate them with Qi. (Someone correct me if I'm missing something, but I'm pretty sure I can quote him on this from QM:small circulation). He writes that if you Qi is not led properly past the 3rd tricky gate (one of the cavities), it will enter the brain.

I've been having a mild but definite pressure in the left hemisphere of my head which started a few days ago and I attribute it with 70% confidence to the deepening of my zhan zhaung I've been doing daily for about half a year now. It too does not go away with sleep which otherwise cures all of my headaches no matter how bad. Suffice to say I stopped it entirely (it was very enjoyable), even regular qigong standing aggravates it. Zhan Zhuang definitely raises a type of pressure in the head, and I have followed Lam Kam Chuen's advice and schedule to the last detail (except I warmed up with only part of the baduanjin until I learned the rest). The only modification was deep breathing, setting the plumb line, and mildly trying to start the fire at Qihai occasionally.

regular taiji sets helps, and so does jogging. I anticipate it will go away gradually, and I might modify zhan zhuang if it is still viable for me.

crashing and burning are part of developing our own practice I figure, at least for those who are mostly self-taught.

#10 LBDaoist

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Posted 18 November 2010 - 01:33 PM

I used to get really bad headaches as a kid. The only thing that worked for me was complete relaxation. Instead of trying to fix the tension or guide it, let it go. On the inhale become aware of it, on the exhale let it go. Do not force the exhale, just let it evaporate.

It took a few months to develop the internal awareness to make it work. Once I got it figured out, it has worked like a charm ever since.

Good luck!

#11 Procurator

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Posted 18 November 2010 - 05:31 PM

I have tried focusing solely on the dantien with my breath to keep the energy down... Headaches. I tried solely focusing on my feet to ground the energy into the Earth... more headaches.

What am I doing wrong?

short answer: you are using your mind.

its the 4th or 5th report in short succession here about the problems that is why i decided to intervene. The problem is systemic: every single available method out there is false since all of them use the mind. The dabblers will not experience any adverse effects due to low intensity of their dabbling. The will just experience some relaxation and think that they must be doing something right.

On the other hand, those who practice long or intensely enough sooner or later gonna hit the brick wall, its called "Entering the madness and roving fire" http://all-dao.com/madness.html

and of course any advice given by those u practice false methods (focuse here, not there!) its just adding fuel to fire, curing poison with more poison.

Edited by Daode, 18 November 2010 - 05:32 PM.


#12 Lomistick

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Posted 18 November 2010 - 06:32 PM

Energy is going up, but not coming down. Deep breathing only fuels the energy.

Do ankle rotations. Get a tennis ball and roll it under your feet for a while.

when you've done that for a while you can learn to open your front channel.



This is good advice. I read about this in a book, but never tried it. The book suggested using
something prickly on the spot just beneath the ball of my foot and putting pressure on it.

Thank you very much for posting this.

short answer: you are using your mind.

its the 4th or 5th report in short succession here about the problems that is why i decided to intervene. The problem is systemic: every single available method out there is false since all of them use the mind. The dabblers will not experience any adverse effects due to low intensity of their dabbling. The will just experience some relaxation and think that they must be doing something right.

On the other hand, those who practice long or intensely enough sooner or later gonna hit the brick wall, its called "Entering the madness and roving fire" http://all-dao.com/madness.html

and of course any advice given by those u practice false methods (focuse here, not there!) its just adding fuel to fire, curing poison with more poison.



I hear what you are saying and all, but what exactly are you saying I should do? Meditate?


How does one learn to control their energy without using their mind?

#13 Procurator

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Posted 18 November 2010 - 07:00 PM





I hear what you are saying and all, but what exactly are you saying I should do? Meditate?

for short term solution with your headaches you need to take your mind OFF your qi first. Any kind of strenuous physical activity and/or fasting will do. Then, if you want to contunue your training you need to use a method where attention is on your body or on an outside object.


How does one learn to control their energy without using their mind?

unfortunately there is no way to answer that question truthfully without sounding pedantic. first, what exactly is "to control'? sec, there are many kinds of energy not just one, which one we are talking about? third, it depends on your overall goals, "to control" to what end?

I understand that "find a teacher" is a non-answer, so as a substitute here is what a true teacher would say : "to use mind is wrong, not to use it is also wrong:.

#14 jvaran

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Posted 18 November 2010 - 08:04 PM

The headaches are a sign that qi is getting stuck in your head, as you suspected. Are you touching your tongue to the roof of your mouth? That connection is needed to draw the qi down the Conception Vessel. Also, don't use your mind - use your intention. You don't want to push or try to move the qi, instead your intention should be ahead of it, leading it and guiding it. Place your intention where you want it and let the qi follow.

Edited by jvaran, 18 November 2010 - 08:05 PM.


#15 leo17

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Posted 18 November 2010 - 09:57 PM

I used to get global a few years ago that were related to insomnia (which had also just started). My doctor prescribed me two really strong sleeping pills and neither one of them had any effect on me. As it turned out some of my abilities were expanding some and I had a lot of energy just trapped in my crown...my senses were heightened. I could hear and feel everything in mile radius, I could stare into bright lights without my eyes dilating. Well after I just tried forcing my body to relax and just accepting that it was part of me, the headaches left me.

Now I only get headaches if someone wakes me. If I wake up on my own it's fine but if someone else does it...my head will throb for hours unless I meditate.
في حاجات في بعدك نقصاني مش ممكن ترجع تانى
لو تقدر يوم تنساني ده أنا على عيني أنساك

أغنية: طوّل غيابك لـمحمد نور

#16 freeform

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Posted 19 November 2010 - 05:31 AM

This is good advice. I read about this in a book, but never tried it. The book suggested using
something prickly on the spot just beneath the ball of my foot and putting pressure on it.

Thank you very much for posting this.



No probs. It's a good thing to do whilst watching a film.

You would also really benefit from wall squats.

Once you feel your feet, ankles, legs and hips feel more alive, you should go see a particular teacher - preferably a pine tree. Find a tree that looks big and healthy - growing straight.

Come up to it and say hello. About 2 feet from the trunk, get into a relaxed wuji posture, with a smile on your face and tongue on your palette. Drop your mind to the heart. Expand your awareness and connect with the trunk of the tree - you should feel a subtle (or sometimes not so subtle!) connection or repulsion. You'll be able to tell whether the tree wants to connect or not. Assuming it does want to connect, place your awareness on its roots and let it teach you how to really ground. You will exchange energies, and the tree will help you balance. Say thank you when you're done. Come back to the same tree next time.





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